Sectional Enrollment Discrepancy

[TeamGarcia]

12 minutes ago, TeamGarcia said:

 

I’ll be right back …. 

 

10 minutes ago, TeamGarcia said:

 
 

 

 

 

7 minutes ago, TeamGarcia said:

 

DANG IT ! 

Starting a A letter schools, 2 syllables. Somebody prolly on letter D by now . I’ll catch up . Don’t rush me dang it ! 

[CainBones]

The thing is this; no matter the enrollments of the schools at a sectional, they will all wrestle each other throughout their state journey. 
 

If you are suggesting to make a “big school sectional” and a “small school” one, then we are essentially making pseudo-class wrestling. Even with this “solution” the small schools will still eventually have to wrestle the large schools. 
 

If it’s an argument against big schools winning the sectional due to their size, just look at Mater Dei. They win sectionals and regionals despite being a smaller school. 

[takemtothemat]

11 hours ago, R. Kendrick said:

Not quite as big as Crawfordsville, but Jeffersonville has a large disparity as well.   Take out Silver Creek whose program is only about 5 years old, and the 2 sectionals are very similar.

 

Jeffersonville 2099

Silver Creek 913

Corydon Central 730

Charlestown 717

North Harrison 687

Crawford County 415

Clarksville 395

Providence 327

Henryville 299

Borden 214

Rock Creek Academy 176

New Washington 174

 

Maybe 18 kids from this make it to semi state

[Pug]

10 hours ago, Mattyb said:

Avon sectional enrollment has to crazy high. Who can get that info? 

Ben Davis—4557

Pike—3387

Avon—3258

Brownsburg—2995

Plainfield—1823

Danville—766

Tri-West—625

Speedway—543

Greencastle—475

North Putnam—444

South Putnam—359

[AlaskanMountie]

12 hours ago, Observing said:

Just curious,is there a point to your point? It sounds like you’re trying to imply something. 

I was simply asking if there were any other disparities equal to or greater than my example. It seems odd that the IHSAA would put one 6A school in a sectional where all the other schools are 1A or 2A and I didn’t know if my example was the only one or if there were more. It sounds like this is the only example in the entire state…with Jeffersonville(5A) getting similar good fortune. Not sure why this is the case but I’m all ears if someone can explain it. 

[Galagore]

5 hours ago, AlaskanMountie said:

I was simply asking if there were any other disparities equal to or greater than my example. It seems odd that the IHSAA would put one 6A school in a sectional where all the other schools are 1A or 2A and I didn’t know if my example was the only one or if there were more. It sounds like this is the only example in the entire state…with Jeffersonville(5A) getting similar good fortune. Not sure why this is the case but I’m all ears if someone can explain it. 

It's all about geography. Not saying that their geographical formula always makes sense - it often does not. However, their logic is, has been, and always will be based on geography.

[randalllynch]

46 minutes ago, Galagore said:

It's all about geography. Not saying that their geographical formula always makes sense - it often does not. However, their logic is, has been, and always will be based on geography.

Have to disagree on this point, New Albany is only 10 minutes from Jeffersonville and Floyd Central is 15.  We currently go 1.5 hours to Southridge.  If it is only geography based decisions then this would never be the situation.

[Galagore]

11 minutes ago, randalllynch said:

Have to disagree on this point, New Albany is only 10 minutes from Jeffersonville and Floyd Central is 15.  We currently go 1.5 hours to Southridge.  If it is only geography based decisions then this would never be the situation.

 

As I said, their decisions do not always make sense. However, the party line from their end is making geographic equity, not competitive equity.

Edited January 29 by Galagore
typo

[Coach Brobst]

Zionsville used to be in the same sectional as Fishers, HSE, Lebanon, Carmel, and Westfield along with Clinton Prairie, Clinton Central, Sheridan, and Frankfort. 2 adjustments ago, they moved Zionsville out to Crawfordsville and they are obviously the farthest West of the teams in that sectional, so I suppose geographically that fits. Why they only sent one of 5 6A schools? Why they sent one at all I assume was to relieve some of the crowdedness between sectionals as they say they like to balance student population size within sectionals that feed the same regional.

 

Now I'm not Math wizard, but I'm pretty confident that the Frankfort Sectional still has way more student population than the Crawfordsville one. I thought maybe they'd move another one that direction with the  new realignment this year, but they did not.

[Lat Drop]

On 1/27/2024 at 7:33 PM, AlaskanMountie said:

I was inquiring if there were any other sectionals that had one 6A (football) school paired with all 1A & 2A schools which is the case in the Crawfordsville Sectional. 

Wait til this guy sees who Cathedral wrestles in sectionals!

[Y2CJ41]

The whole state series alignment thing is intriguing. I would NOT want that job at all.

 

Just for fun I did a distance to each regional/semi-state for every team in the state.

 

With approximately 310 schools that means each semi-state should have 77.5 teams. Looking at the Evansville semi-state only, the 78 closest teams by DRIVING mileage for 46 teams Evansville is the closes, 20 teams it's the second closest, 11 teams it's the 3rd closest, and for one team it's the FURTHEST semi-state. For teams actually in the semi-state there are 82 teams, 45 Evansville is the closest, 22 teams it's the 2nd closest, 9 teams it's the 3rd closest, and for seven teams it's the furthest.

 

South Vermillion goes to New Castle and is closer to Evansville. The seven teams that go to Evansville in which it is the furthest semi-state are Danville, Ben Davis, Brownsburg, Speedway, Tri-West, and Pike.

 

 

[Timeinandout]

Southport sectional is close to the Avon enrollment, but not quite:

North Central 3709

Lawrence North 2844

Lawrence Central 2255

Perry Meridian 2385

Southport 2391

Mount Vernon 1375

Roncalli 1081

Beech Grove 968

Christel House 509

Victory Prep 256

Total 17,773

 

I believe AlaskanMountie's point is that Southmont is very thankful to be in the Crawfordsville Sectional with a total enrollment of around 6,300!

Edited January 29 by Timeinandout

[piscis1956]

1 hour ago, Y2CJ41 said:

The whole state series alignment thing is intriguing. I would NOT want that job at all.

 

Just for fun I did a distance to each regional/semi-state for every team in the state.

 

With approximately 310 schools that means each semi-state should have 77.5 teams. Looking at the Evansville semi-state only, the 78 closest teams by DRIVING mileage for 46 teams Evansville is the closes, 20 teams it's the second closest, 11 teams it's the 3rd closest, and for one team it's the FURTHEST semi-state. For teams actually in the semi-state there are 82 teams, 45 Evansville is the closest, 22 teams it's the 2nd closest, 9 teams it's the 3rd closest, and for seven teams it's the furthest.

 

South Vermillion goes to New Castle and is closer to Evansville. The seven teams that go to Evansville in which it is the furthest semi-state are Danville, Ben Davis, Brownsburg, Speedway, Tri-West, and Pike.

 

 

Thank you for putting that together.

Evansville is in the corner pocket if Indiana and is about as remote as you can get from the rest of Indiana.  This too bad IHSAA hasn’t been able to find a more centrally located venue that could reasonably and cost effectively host the Evansville Semi-State.

 

I would not want to be in charge of making decisions as to which schools go where.

 

But one more thing I would find interesting would be a list of the 80 to 85 schools that are closest to Evansville.

[piscis1956]

9 hours ago, AlaskanMountie said:

I was simply asking if there were any other disparities equal to or greater than my example. It seems odd that the IHSAA would put one 6A school in a sectional where all the other schools are 1A or 2A and I didn’t know if my example was the only one or if there were more. It sounds like this is the only example in the entire state…with Jeffersonville(5A) getting similar good fortune. Not sure why this is the case but I’m all ears if someone can explain it. 

So is your question why did IHSAA put that one 6A school there with all the other small schools (instead of another small school) or why they didn’t put more big schools there?

[SIACfan]

1 hour ago, Y2CJ41 said:

The whole state series alignment thing is intriguing. I would NOT want that job at all.

 

Just for fun I did a distance to each regional/semi-state for every team in the state.

 

With approximately 310 schools that means each semi-state should have 77.5 teams. Looking at the Evansville semi-state only, the 78 closest teams by DRIVING mileage for 46 teams Evansville is the closes, 20 teams it's the second closest, 11 teams it's the 3rd closest, and for one team it's the FURTHEST semi-state. For teams actually in the semi-state there are 82 teams, 45 Evansville is the closest, 22 teams it's the 2nd closest, 9 teams it's the 3rd closest, and for seven teams it's the furthest.

 

South Vermillion goes to New Castle and is closer to Evansville. The seven teams that go to Evansville in which it is the furthest semi-state are Danville, Ben Davis, Brownsburg, Speedway, Tri-West, and Pike.

 

 

 

The problem is that the northern portion of the state is much more populated the southern portion. Plus the Indy area is by far the most populated.

 

When you look at the 4 SS locations you will find that Evansville is the furthest from all the rest. Thus there are going to be many schools that are closer to some of the other locations. Nothing is going to be perfect in this scenario.

 

It is odd that they choose Evansville to host the State Finals this year, but I am glad they did. But clearly I am in the minority on that.

 

[R. Kendrick]

The question is why the numbers are so imbalanced as well.  86 schools feed into Evansville SS, 82 into New Castle, ECC only has 73.  There is an extra Sectional worth of teams that feed into EV and NC more than the other Semi State.    Ft. Wayne has 77.  

[Y2CJ41]

58 minutes ago, SIACfan said:

 

The problem is that the northern portion of the state is much more populated the southern portion. Plus the Indy area is by far the most populated.

 

When you look at the 4 SS locations you will find that Evansville is the furthest from all the rest. Thus there are going to be many schools that are closer to some of the other locations. Nothing is going to be perfect in this scenario.

 

It is odd that they choose Evansville to host the State Finals this year, but I am glad they did. But clearly I am in the minority on that.

 

The New Castle semi-state is also not quite centrally located. It really should be Fort Wayne, Region, Indy, and then something like Seymour(as it once was) in order to space out the best geographically.

However as we all know, venues and wanting to host an event such as semi-state are the biggest hurdles.

[MattM]

4 minutes ago, Y2CJ41 said:

And then something like Seymour(as it once was) in order to space out the best geographically.

 

However as we all know, venues and wanting to host an event such as semi-state are the biggest hurdles.

Move the Ford Center closer to that neck of the woods and I'm sure someone near it would host.  Venue is great, the drive not so much.

[AlaskanMountie]

14 hours ago, piscis1956 said:

So is your question why did IHSAA put that one 6A school there with all the other small schools (instead of another small school) or why they didn’t put more big schools there?

Former rather than the ladder. The IHSAA moved one 6A school to the Crawfordsville sectional but why? I agree with the HSE coach on if they wanted to balance the two sectionals (Frankfort & Cville), go for it and move a few 6a schools over to Cville but to move just one doesn’t make any sense. 

[piscis1956]

5 hours ago, AlaskanMountie said:

Former rather than the ladder. The IHSAA moved one 6A school to the Crawfordsville sectional but why? I agree with the HSE coach on if they wanted to balance the two sectionals (Frankfort & Cville), go for it and move a few 6a schools over to Cville but to move just one doesn’t make any sense. 

I thought a lot of the intriguing realignments to sectionals and regionals for this season didn’t make sense.  I guess that just means I didn’t/don’t understand the motives and intent for those changes.  They didn’t seem to make sense from a geographical perspective or from a numbers or strength balancing perspective.  So your guess is as good as mine.

 

But if you think they should not put a 6A school in with a bunch of smaller schools, then my original response stands.  You should just be happy that they didn’t put more in and make your sectional even tougher.

[randalllynch]

Did the realignment recommendations come from the Coaches Association or were they independently done by the IHSAA?

[VisionQuest87]

My understanding is that Indiana does not have class wrestling.  So why is there even a debate on why a 6A school is in the same sectional as a 1A school?  Does not matter.  Unless someone or some organization is trying to give the appearance of some type of classing and maybe appease some of the 'We need class wrestling' people.  Who knows why the IHSAA does anything. The only thing that I know is that there is not class wrestling in Indiana, yet.  So go ahead 6A schools beat up on the 1A schools.

[Galagore]

29 minutes ago, VisionQuest87 said:

My understanding is that Indiana does not have class wrestling.  So why is there even a debate on why a 6A school is in the same sectional as a 1A school?  Does not matter.  Unless someone or some organization is trying to give the appearance of some type of classing and maybe appease some of the 'We need class wrestling' people.  Who knows why the IHSAA does anything. The only thing that I know is that there is not class wrestling in Indiana, yet.  So go ahead 6A schools beat up on the 1A schools.

 

Excellent point. If one thinks this kind of discrepancy is unfair, I have no idea how the same person could be against class wrestling.

[rhayes]

2 hours ago, randalllynch said:

Did the realignment recommendations come from the Coaches Association or were they independently done by the IHSAA?

I have been told there was a group of 18 the voted unanimously on these changes. There were coaches on this committee, but who they are is a mystery.

[Clint Gard]

39 minutes ago, rhayes said:

I have been told there was a group of 18 the voted unanimously on these changes. There were coaches on this committee, but who they are is a mystery.

This statement combined with what Robert Faulkens told our conference coaches when he attended our conference seeding meeting 2 weeks ago makes me think our coaches association needs to be more transparent...especially when they are making recommendations, decisions, and policy "on our behalf".