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Not a very favorable draw for Chad. After the first match, getting the defending champ, Yianni.

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Yep. I go back and forth on his seed. Not much reward for taking second at the B1G tourney, but then the D1 record even after a 3-1 weekend is just 12-11. He finally got some wins over higher ranked wrestlers, but he also lost some odd ones early on. Highs and lows. Ups and downs. Maybe 16 is right, just unfortunate.

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9 hours ago, Disco said:

Not a very favorable draw for Chad. After the first match, getting the defending champ, Yianni.

 

9 hours ago, wrestlenewbie said:

Yep. I go back and forth on his seed. Not much reward for taking second at the B1G tourney, but then the D1 record even after a 3-1 weekend is just 12-11. He finally got some wins over higher ranked wrestlers, but he also lost some odd ones early on. Highs and lows. Ups and downs. Maybe 16 is right, just unfortunate.

This is where the "rest of the season" came back to bite him.  If he wins, no biggie.  But it makes you wonder how much the BTT helped him. Would he have been seeded in the 20's with a 8th or 9th Place finish?  

As he and Nick both proved last year, you can lose early and still be an All-American.

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Posted (edited)

As I’ve said he’s a gamer.  The crowd and big “back against the wall” moments seems to gives him an additional gear. The issue is that gear seems to always come late in the seson which limits his outcome.   If he can just find a way to keep that gear going for the entire season we may see him in a NCAA final in the future. 

Edited by MattM

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1 hour ago, Leftenant Luers said:

Still AA'ed,  He get's hot come the Tournament as I said mid season when most of you were doubting. 

Actually people weren't doubting him as opposed to wondering why he wasn't living up to his potential.  If he can do it at tournament time, why can't he do it all the time?  That's a fair question.  Was then.  Is now.

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9 hours ago, SWINfan said:

Actually people weren't doubting him as opposed to wondering why he wasn't living up to his potential.  If he can do it at tournament time, why can't he do it all the time?  That's a fair question.  Was then.  Is now.

No: Some were doubting and hating. Shush. Tournament time is what matters. You don't know what he was dealing with. I'd like to add his only two loses at the most important part of the season is to the two finalist.  He's wrestling lights out now. That's all that matter's.  Getcha popcorn ready. He is not done.

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On 3/14/2019 at 9:57 AM, wrestlenewbie said:

Yep. I go back and forth on his seed. Not much reward for taking second at the B1G tourney, but then the D1 record even after a 3-1 weekend is just 12-11. He finally got some wins over higher ranked wrestlers, but he also lost some odd ones early on. Highs and lows. Ups and downs. Maybe 16 is right, just unfortunate.

Put some respect on the 2X AA's name. Seeds only matter if you think they do Newb. Obviously "Newb".

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Calm down, LL.

I’d say 99% of us on this board want to see Red do well. Just like 99% of us want to see Lee do well. 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Leftenant Luers said:

Put some respect on the 2X AA's name. Seeds only matter if you think they do Newb. Obviously "Newb".

You are exactly wrong. It is because of his seed that the best he can do is seventh again. By being seeded 16 he runs into the 1 almost immediately and it is off to the consols. If he finishes 7th he will suffer the irony of having a better record than whoever takes 6th purely because of his seed. Seeds absolutely matter. That's why they exist.

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2 hours ago, Leftenant Luers said:

No: Some were doubting and hating. Shush. Tournament time is what matters. You don't know what he was dealing with. I'd like to add his only two loses at the most important part of the season is to the two finalist.  He's wrestling lights out now. That's all that matter's.  Getcha popcorn ready. He is not done.

No one was hating.  Criticizing or questioning performance is not hating the individual.  And as was stated before no we don't know what he was going through, which is exactly why people question.  It is a LEGIT thing to do.

No one here is bummed that Chad is still wrestling.  I'll shush when you start making sense and take whatever shades off that are distorting your thinking about what others think.

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1 hour ago, wrestlenewbie said:

You are exactly wrong. It is because of his seed that the best he can do is seventh again. By being seeded 16 he runs into the 1 almost immediately and it is off to the consols. If he finishes 7th he will suffer the irony of having a better record than whoever takes 6th purely because of his seed. Seeds absolutely matter. That's why they exist.

Huh?

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1 hour ago, wrestlenewbie said:

You are exactly wrong. It is because of his seed that the best he can do is seventh again. By being seeded 16 he runs into the 1 almost immediately and it is off to the consols. If he finishes 7th he will suffer the irony of having a better record than whoever takes 6th purely because of his seed. Seeds absolutely matter. That's why they exist.

I get what you are saying, but losing to #1 Yianni in the second round did not keep Red from wrestling beyond 7th.  If he beat McKee last night, he would have been wrestling this morning and still have a chance for as high as 3rd.

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1 hour ago, wrestlenewbie said:

You are exactly wrong. It is because of his seed that the best he can do is seventh again. By being seeded 16 he runs into the 1 almost immediately and it is off to the consols. If he finishes 7th he will suffer the irony of having a better record than whoever takes 6th purely because of his seed. Seeds absolutely matter. That's why they exist.

Are you dense? He was seeded 16th. He can do no worse than 8th.  Seeding didn't matter.  

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38 minutes ago, Leftenant Luers said:

Are you dense? He was seeded 16th. He can do no worse than 8th.  Seeding didn't matter.  

I think what he is trying to say is if Red was seeded higher he would’ve went further in the championship bracket instead of facing the #1 seed in the round of 32. I believe he could’ve made quarters or semis if he didn’t pull yianni second round. So it that sense seeding does matter.

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1 hour ago, Leftenant Luers said:

Are you dense? He was seeded 16th. He can do no worse than 8th.  Seeding didn't matter.  

It absolutely mattered. He dropped into consols quickly which caused him to have to wrestle more matches. You are arguing that the seed was wrong, but you think you are arguing that it doesn't  matter. The higher your seed, the easier your path. The lower, the harder. For someone involved in wrestling I am surprised you struggle with this concept. When you take your wrestlers to a tourney do you argue for a higher seed or a lower seed? Come on. Be honest.

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4 hours ago, wrestlenewbie said:

It absolutely mattered. He dropped into consols quickly which caused him to have to wrestle more matches. You are arguing that the seed was wrong, but you think you are arguing that it doesn't  matter. The higher your seed, the easier your path. The lower, the harder. For someone involved in wrestling I am su.rprised you struggle with this concept When you take your wrestlers to a tourney do you argue for a higher seed or a lower seed? Come on. Be honest.

I have a reason behind it.  I never was seeded in any tournament in high school. I won several invites. I wasn't seeded at conference my senior year because i dropped down 2 weights.  I won. I was seeded third at sectional. i defeated an undefeated foe in the finals. My son was seeded 4th at preseason nationals: He won. My history in the sport tells me seeds only matter if you think they do. to win you have to beat everyone anyways. I will go to the grave with that philosophy,

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20 hours ago, MattM said:

As I’ve said he’s a gamer.  The crowd and big “back against the wall” moments seems to gives him an additional gear. The issue is that gear seems to always come late in the seson which limits his outcome.   If he can just find a way to keep that gear going for the entire season we may see him in a NCAA final in the future. 

I concur

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On 3/23/2019 at 4:42 PM, Leftenant Luers said:

I have a reason behind it.  I never was seeded in any tournament in high school. I won several invites. I wasn't seeded at conference my senior year because i dropped down 2 weights.  I won. I was seeded third at sectional. i defeated an undefeated foe in the finals. My son was seeded 4th at preseason nationals: He won. My history in the sport tells me seeds only matter if you think they do. to win you have to beat everyone anyways. I will go to the grave with that philosophy,

They asked NCAA Champ Mekhi Lewis the same thing when they asked him about being the 8 seed. His response was simple: It’s only a number. 

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On 3/23/2019 at 7:10 AM, Leftenant Luers said:

No: Some were doubting and hating. Shush. Tournament time is what matters. You don't know what he was dealing with. I'd like to add his only two loses at the most important part of the season is to the two finalist.  He's wrestling lights out now. That's all that matter's.  Getcha popcorn ready. He is not done.

Nobody was hating, event the haters. 

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Posted (edited)
On 3/23/2019 at 5:42 PM, Leftenant Luers said:

I have a reason behind it.  I never was seeded in any tournament in high school. I won several invites. I wasn't seeded at conference my senior year because i dropped down 2 weights.  I won. I was seeded third at sectional. i defeated an undefeated foe in the finals. My son was seeded 4th at preseason nationals: He won. My history in the sport tells me seeds only matter if you think they do. to win you have to beat everyone anyways. I will go to the grave with that philosophy,

I wouldn't disagree that cliches and anecdotes can be helpful motivation, but fact-based evidence is more important for actual results. Of course, upsets happen, but for every upset, there are tens, if not hundreds that that didn't happen. Upsets stick in our mind, because...well they're upsets...and less frequent. Seeds matter; otherwise they wouldn't be so prevalent across all sports.

Pick any particular bracket, at say, the NCAA DI finals this year. Count up how many they got right and how many they got wrong. For example, look at the 125 bracket. I believe the higher seed won 28 of 29 matches. That's fact-based evidence.

Edited by gsmith58

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On 3/14/2019 at 8:44 AM, Disco said:

Not a very favorable draw for Chad. After the first match, getting the defending champ, Yianni.

Got it done - 141 was imo tougher than 133

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On 3/26/2019 at 4:39 PM, Powerline said:

Got it done - 141 was imo tougher than 133

141 definitely wasn't tougher 1-6 than 133. You could make the argument that 141 was better 1-16, but 133 was pretty dog gone good this year.

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