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Y2CJ41

Open Letter to the ISWA

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dammit, I want the money back for the 2 tourney's I registered my kid for that he did not go to now!

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It really comes down to an issue of fairness.  Wrestlers gave up baseball, track meets, jobs, proms to meet the criteria the ISWA established.  Parents and guardians gave up personal time and money to meet the criteria the ISWA established.  

 

Several coaches in the north created fs tournaments with little notice to help ALL kids in the north have a shot at meeting the ISWA established criteria.  ISWA did not respond to a number of emails in February and March asking for clarification on the criteria.  So all members had to go on was the very clear sentence on the ISWA web site: "All participants MUST compete in a minimum of 2 local freestyle tournaments in order to compete at the state event."  The ISWA web site doesn't say "we would like for wrestlers to have two".  It doesn't say "if you have a prom or broken finger, you can get a waiver."  The ISWA web site clearly says "MUST." 

 

It is only fair to those who met the criteria the ISWA established that everyone is held to the same standard. 

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It really comes down to an issue of fairness.  Wrestlers gave up baseball, track meets, jobs, proms to meet the criteria the ISWA established.  Parents and guardians gave up personal time and money to meet the criteria the ISWA established.  

 

Several coaches in the north created fs tournaments with little notice to help ALL kids in the north have a shot at meeting the ISWA established criteria.  ISWA did not respond to a number of emails in February and March asking for clarification on the criteria.  So all members had to go on was the very clear sentence on the ISWA web site: "All participants MUST compete in a minimum of 2 local freestyle tournaments in order to compete at the state event."  The ISWA web site doesn't say "we would like for wrestlers to have two".  It doesn't say "if you have a prom or broken finger, you can get a waiver."  The ISWA web site clearly says "MUST." 

 

It is only fair to those who met the criteria the ISWA established that everyone is held to the same standard. 

 

Well said and I think you summed it up perfectly.  It's not about whether you agree or disagree with the rule itself but rather how it's being handled.  I too feel bad for the parents that had to make sacrifices to ensure their wrestler got their 2 tournaments in only to find out they could have gotten a waiver and still got in.  This waiver should have been in effect from the beginning and since it wasn't they should have left it as is.

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I have no dog in the fight, but I regularly read that everything we do as a wrestling community should be about growing the sport. It seems that giving kids the opportunity to wrestle would be what is best for kids and help grow the sport. Whether it's giving a waiver for freestyle state or moving to class wrestling, having more people participate is what is best for the sport to grow, am I missing the problem? 

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I have no dog in the fight, but I regularly read that everything we do as a wrestling community should be about growing the sport. It seems that giving kids the opportunity to wrestle would be what is best for kids and help grow the sport. Whether it's giving a waiver for freestyle state or moving to class wrestling, having more people participate is what is best for the sport to grow, am I missing the problem? 

You're missing the point...the ISWA made a rule and 800+ kids followed it. They spent time and money, made sacrifices to get these two tournaments in over just 5 weeks. There are numerous instances of people going to great lengths to get their two tournaments in. Now the ISWA is saying that this rule...well isn't a rule any more and will let anyone in.

 

Not a good thing when people made the sacrifices to attend the local events only to be told it was for nothing.

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And much like in Feb/Mar when the ISWA did not respond or clarify or reply to emails, we should expect nothing as far as a reason or explanation this time and that is just wrong and unjust. As Walt says, we (northerners..and I assume there's other sections too) jumped thru the hoops as they wanted. Did we beyotch and moan..you betcha! But we did what they said we had to do. Now, as Tskin is subtly predicting, are we going to beyotch and moan about the abrupt change..you betcha! Funny thing about us in the north..we don't suffer fools greatly..or silently. And this whole charade was foolish and below board.

 

So what can we do to let the ISWA know our displeasure? They clearly don't reply to emails...calling the nice lady who occasionally answers the phone and ruining her day doesn't help. Is there some form of protest we can make at State this weekend? Petition? Everybody meet  in between Cadet/Jr changeover that is not pleased and walk over to the ISWA table to ask for an explanation? I don't know, but I think we are entitled to some type of explanation on this with all the sacrifice a lot of people and families have made over the last 2 months. It's only fair.

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You're missing the point...the ISWA made a rule and 800+ kids followed it. They spent time and money, made sacrifices to get these two tournaments in over just 5 weeks. There are numerous instances of people going to great lengths to get their two tournaments in. Now the ISWA is saying that this rule...well isn't a rule any more and will let anyone in.

 

Not a good thing when people made the sacrifices to attend the local events only to be told it was for nothing.

Right, but 800+ kids got to participate in the sport you and I love, I don't see this as a bad thing. Ok, they broke their own "rule" to allow more people to participate, how is that a bad thing? Don't we want more people to participate and help facilitate growth in the sport? 

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Right, but 800+ kids got to participate in the sport you and I love, I don't see this as a bad thing. Ok, they broke their own "rule" to allow more people to participate, how is that a bad thing? Don't we want more people to participate and help facilitate growth in the sport? 

Because there are others who followed this rule that is not a rule after all. 

 

One parent above said he spent $400 one weekend to get a tournament in for his son. Another kids missed a family wedding to get a tournament in. Others skipped out on national tournaments to get a local one in. Others wrestled injured or just "donated" money to get a tournament in. Now all of a sudden these people didn't have to do that. 

 

It's bad that you force people to follow the rules up until the week of the event. This is about setting rules and following them, the ISWA is setting a precedent with the abrupt changes.

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Right, but 800+ kids got to participate in the sport you and I love, I don't see this as a bad thing. Ok, they broke their own "rule" to allow more people to participate, how is that a bad thing? Don't we want more people to participate and help facilitate growth in the sport? 

This is what hundreds of people said when this "RULE" first came about. They were told "This will help local tourneys." "This will increase participation." "This will help Indiana and USA wrestling grow in the international styles." and that was the end of the story. Either follow the rule or you wouldn't wrestle at state...

 

Then a day before registration closes they tell everyone their "RULE" isn't a "RULE".

 

It's the most hypocritical thing I think I have ever witnessed in my entire life. This didn't just effect a few people... It effected every single kid who wrestles in this state and it's not right.

 

By all means I agree they should let everyone wrestle that wants to wrestle; BUT you can't make an April Fools joke out of a "RULE".

 

Could you imagine the backlash if the government turned around and said healthcare wasn't really mandated this whole time. They just said it was mandatory but in reality you could have just waited until 2 days before the deadline and signed a piece of paper to save you thousands of dollars a year?

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And much like in Feb/Mar when the ISWA did not respond or clarify or reply to emails, we should expect nothing as far as a reason or explanation this time and that is just wrong and unjust. As Walt says, we (northerners..and I assume there's other sections too) jumped thru the hoops as they wanted. Did we beyotch and moan..you betcha! But we did what they said we had to do. Now, as Tskin is subtly predicting, are we going to beyotch and moan about the abrupt change..you betcha! Funny thing about us in the north..we don't suffer fools greatly..or silently. And this whole charade was foolish and below board.

 

So what can we do to let the ISWA know our displeasure? They clearly don't reply to emails...calling the nice lady who occasionally answers the phone and ruining her day doesn't help. Is there some form of protest we can make at State this weekend? Petition? Everybody meet  in between Cadet/Jr changeover that is not pleased and walk over to the ISWA table to ask for an explanation? I don't know, but I think we are entitled to some type of explanation on this with all the sacrifice a lot of people and families have made over the last 2 months. It's only fair.

Everyone can protest and hang out with me and TripleB and buy us drinks.  Mrs Tskin will be there also.  I hear there is nothing the ISWA hates more than me and TripleB getting free drinks.

 

Seriously though if you are upset with the system then voicing your opinions to the people in charge would be a good step.  Now does that mean be hateful, no but let them know how you feel and try to come to a working solution for the years to come.

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Well look at Y2, the Tom Rinaldi of Indianamat.....delivering the sad motivational stories!!

 

It was a cold, windy Saturday morning when this particular family found themselves in a car wreck, with twisted steal, cries, and the blood from his sister still fresh, Little Johnny wouldn't be deterred, no he had to qualify for ISWA state! He kissed Mom and sister farewell, and with a tear in his eye he set off on foot with only his Asic Tigers, Head Gear and his Pro Power sweatshirt to keep him warm. He traveled through 95 inches of snow, over the hills and through the cornfields of Indiana to that little gym in Hickory. Johnny wanted to an ISWA state qualfier... LMAO #hammered

dm_100629_ten_rinaldi_caprioti.jpg

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Let me give you another deal. There's a wrestler at 120 I'm not sure is qualified when you look at Joe's google doc. If he's allowed to wrestle, honestly I would advise my 120 pounder to move up a weight class. But because this has turned into a cluster #%*¥ it's impossible to figure things out. This might seem minor to you, but to my wrestler going to Fargo is the biggest deal you could possibly imagine.

 

This whole topic seems like a case study for why iswa meetings should be a google hang out as others have suggested.

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Some of these folks without two tourneys have likely already got hotel rooms. There are going to get really dinged in the pocketbook by the hotel when they don't use it plus have sent money on gas. The iswa needs to answer now.

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I could be wrong but Joes doc only represent guys that have wrestled at least one tourney. I know guys listed that have wrestled multiple but it only lists one

I agree w Tskin. One drink for every protest vote...we'll show them!!!

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I could be wrong but Joes doc only represent guys that have wrestled at least one tourney. I know guys listed that have wrestled multiple but it only lists one

I agree w Tskin. One drink for every protest vote...we'll show them!!!

These are all the tournaments that were on TrackWrestling and the list of their participants. The only event I know of that isn't on the list is the Carmel Freestyle Duals with Carmel, Garrett, and Greenfield-Central.

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Carmel looks to be there. Check a few of the dudes from Chesterton high. I know they wrestled at Carmel. They show up on your list rightly as wrestling at Chesterton and Carmel.

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Disappointed to hear the ISWA did this. There were a bunch of wrestlers/families who traveled, spent money, cancelled or put aside other important obligations in order to commit to this and now it has been undone.

 

Now the ISWA should begin to look at the Nationals Duals team selection process.  At first glance I saw an upper weight Junior wrestler who appears to have only wrestled in Freestyle State once in the past 3 years and did not place.  In addition this wrestler hasn't even participated in a single ISWA Freestyle or Greco event this season or last. How has this wrestler has been selected to be on the team? His only qualification was a good 2015 high school season.  The only other thing I can find is that he may be close to one of the coaches, but I can't be sure this is the case. I would guess there are others of similar circumstance but haven't had time to check.  According to the coaches of this team from a posting earlier in the year they want to be competitive with other states like Illinois in Freestyle and Greco on a national level...odd they would select wrestlers who lack any participation in Freestyle and Greco this season (or last) on a local or state level. 

 

At least select kids who are participating in a couple of Freestyle and Greco tournaments this season. 

Shouldn't they need to wrestle in these styles in this weekends State in order to make your team seem legitimate?

 

Oh, by the way if you would like to tout this as a tune up for Fargo shouldn't the team consist of kids who actually qualify for Fargo?

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Disappointed to hear the ISWA did this. There were a bunch of wrestlers/families who traveled, spent money, cancelled or put aside other important obligations in order to commit to this and now it has been undone.

At least select kids who are participating in a couple of Freestyle and Greco tournaments this season. 

Shouldn't they need to wrestle in these styles in this weekends State in order to make your team seem legitimate?

 

Oh, by the way if you would like to tout this as a tune up for Fargo shouldn't the team consist of kids who actually qualify for Fargo?

No, No, NO.......We are Indiana, we make the rules.  This smells of a scandal started by Illinois to split Indiana, so they can continue to win.  I hear that Iowa, Pennsylvania, Michigan and Ohio may also have had a part in it.

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Disappointed to hear the ISWA did this. There were a bunch of wrestlers/families who traveled, spent money, cancelled or put aside other important obligations in order to commit to this and now it has been undone.

 

Now the ISWA should begin to look at the Nationals Duals team selection process.  At first glance I saw an upper weight Junior wrestler who appears to have only wrestled in Freestyle State once in the past 3 years and did not place.  In addition this wrestler hasn't even participated in a single ISWA Freestyle or Greco event this season or last. How has this wrestler has been selected to be on the team? His only qualification was a good 2015 high school season.  The only other thing I can find is that he may be close to one of the coaches, but I can't be sure this is the case. I would guess there are others of similar circumstance but haven't had time to check.  According to the coaches of this team from a posting earlier in the year they want to be competitive with other states like Illinois in Freestyle and Greco on a national level...odd they would select wrestlers who lack any participation in Freestyle and Greco this season (or last) on a local or state level. 

 

At least select kids who are participating in a couple of Freestyle and Greco tournaments this season. 

Shouldn't they need to wrestle in these styles in this weekends State in order to make your team seem legitimate?

 

Oh, by the way if you would like to tout this as a tune up for Fargo shouldn't the team consist of kids who actually qualify for Fargo?

I am all for a complete selection process for the Duals teams. If you win a state Title (I mean a REAL State Title) odds are you are good enough to be on the team. We have been beaten like ragdolls in the past few years. If we want to stay competitive it needs to be done that way. 

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I would be pretty upset as a parent knowing I ponied up money for gas, entry, food, even hotels to get two events in when I didn't really have to.

it's hard enough to get kids to train when the weather is nice. I have 7 kids of my own and when you try to make anything a requirement these days you are going to receive some resistance. When you ask parents as a club coach to make sacrifices and then they spend lots of mullah so their son/daughter to compete and then you say they are required to drive to either South Bend,Yorktown at Perry Meridian or

they can't participate at state? We had a small circle to begin with now parents are saying let's take some time off. We are making it difficult to attract newcomers to this sport and retaining career wrestlers. Freestyle and Greco are like the fringe of an already fringe sport. If we truly are out to help kids get better and increase our level nationally then we must do away with this red tape. Make things simpler so the kids can wrestle. Sad to say we will not be attending ISWA State.

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Disappointed to hear the ISWA did this. There were a bunch of wrestlers/families who traveled, spent money, cancelled or put aside other important obligations in order to commit to this and now it has been undone.

 

Now the ISWA should begin to look at the Nationals Duals team selection process.  At first glance I saw an upper weight Junior wrestler who appears to have only wrestled in Freestyle State once in the past 3 years and did not place.  In addition this wrestler hasn't even participated in a single ISWA Freestyle or Greco event this season or last. How has this wrestler has been selected to be on the team? His only qualification was a good 2015 high school season.  The only other thing I can find is that he may be close to one of the coaches, but I can't be sure this is the case. I would guess there are others of similar circumstance but haven't had time to check.  According to the coaches of this team from a posting earlier in the year they want to be competitive with other states like Illinois in Freestyle and Greco on a national level...odd they would select wrestlers who lack any participation in Freestyle and Greco this season (or last) on a local or state level. 

 

At least select kids who are participating in a couple of Freestyle and Greco tournaments this season. 

Shouldn't they need to wrestle in these styles in this weekends State in order to make your team seem legitimate?

 

Oh, by the way if you would like to tout this as a tune up for Fargo shouldn't the team consist of kids who actually qualify for Fargo?

The Junior Duals team is another subject....I see both sides and as always there is no easy or perfect solution.

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We are now at almost 20 wrestlers with one or zero qualifying events in trackwrestling.  Some them undoubtedly wrestled at Carmel Duals and are actually qualified because Carmel Duals was not on trackwrestling.  That is totally fine for those kids.   But some I know are not.

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