Loki27 Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 Probably just talk, first he didn't pin his way through the field and he probably has a few tech falls. But I'm sure his pin % is very high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munges Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 Probably just talk, first he didn't pin his way through the field and he probably has at least 15 tech falls. Cheers...forgot about the finals with Forrest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWINfan Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 The thing I enjoy about these discussions is we are nitpicking about those at the very top of their craft, at least in Indiana. I don't think anyone is disrespecting Chad Red Jr. at all. He could lose to Lee (or beat him) and he is still a GREAT wrestler. Lee still has 3 years to prove what he has done can be translated to the high school championship level. I see no reason it can't/won't be. As far as Lee vs. Micic, there is no doubt that Stevan was superior this past weekend. Would the result be different in a rematch in this or another setting? Hard to say. Micic took away Lee's best weapon and kept him from getting to his legs, then countered and got take downs. Very smart, strategic wrestling. Would Lee adjust if they wrestled again? I'm sure he would, but we'd be stupid to think that Stevan wouldn't adjust also. Would freshman Micic beat freshman Lee? Hard to say. The bottom line is they are both unbelievable wrestlers and the years in age difference makes it next to impossible to truly make legit comparisons. That said, while doing so from afar, I really enjoyed watching Micic the last 3 years (thank you internet!) and look forward to doing so the next 4 years at Northwestern. I also can't wait to see Lee for the next 3 years, and his younger brothers to boot. The Lee vs. Red debate can be very easily answered if they face each other at the Mater Dei Holiday Classic next December. Even if they aren't wrestling in the same class by state tournament time, I see no reason why they can't make it work in December. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayruss Posted February 25, 2014 Author Share Posted February 25, 2014 Take nothing away from Red, he's phenomenal! I just think Lee would win the match. I think Red will turn out to be a collegiate AA, maybe even multiple times. I think Lee is a lock to be an AA and yes I said it, and quite possible Olympic wrestler. Think Lee, Jason T, and Andrew Howe, and A. Escobedo are those type of wrestlers. It is early, but I am projecting out, and there's no harm done in doing so Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bash513 Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 The thing I enjoy about these discussions is we are nitpicking about those at the very top of their craft, at least in Indiana. I don't think anyone is disrespecting Chad Red Jr. at all. He could lose to Lee (or beat him) and he is still a GREAT wrestler. Lee still has 3 years to prove what he has done can be translated to the high school championship level. I see no reason it can't/won't be. As far as Lee vs. Micic, there is no doubt that Stevan was superior this past weekend. Would the result be different in a rematch in this or another setting? Hard to say. Micic took away Lee's best weapon and kept him from getting to his legs, then countered and got take downs. Very smart, strategic wrestling. Would Lee adjust if they wrestled again? I'm sure he would, but we'd be stupid to think that Stevan wouldn't adjust also. Would freshman Micic beat freshman Lee? Hard to say. The bottom line is they are both unbelievable wrestlers and the years in age difference makes it next to impossible to truly make legit comparisons. That said, while doing so from afar, I really enjoyed watching Micic the last 3 years (thank you internet!) and look forward to doing so the next 4 years at Northwestern. I also can't wait to see Lee for the next 3 years, and his younger brothers to boot. The Lee vs. Red debate can be very easily answered if they face each other at the Mater Dei Holiday Classic next December. Even if they aren't wrestling in the same class by state tournament time, I see no reason why they can't make it work in December. I think one thing that gets overlooked or that people just don't remember is that Micic was significantly smaller than his competition his freshman year. If I remember correctly, he routinely weighed in under 100 lbs while most 103 lbers would obviously wrestle at a weight well above 103 (105 after January). It's not easy to give up 4-7 lbs especially when that is such a large percentage of your body weight. He was still one of the top wrestlers in the state that year... He is a special wrestler and deserves to be talked about with the very best in the state's history. I doubt we will see Red vs Nick Lee next year, I have a feeling Nick Lee will be at 138 or larger. Kid has a VERY big frame and it will be scary to see when he fills out... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCKAJC Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Stevan was superior this past weekend. Would the result be different in a rematch in this or another setting? Hard to say. Micic took away Lee's best weapon and kept him from getting to his legs, then countered and got take downs. The Lee vs. Red debate can be very easily answered if they face each other at the Mater Dei Holiday Classic next December. If you watched the match and it appears you did. I don't follow how venue could make a difference in such a one sided match. Lee's points were given, and Micic scored, I believe 3 takedowns and a turn for 3. Micic's head and hands defense might be the most under rated part of his game. Clearly based on their sat match if they wrestle 10 times in 10 different settings we get the same result in each match. I guess I have to ask what they saw or didn't see that would lead you to think differently? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWINfan Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 If you watched the match and it appears you did. I don't follow how venue could make a difference in such a one sided match. Lee's points were given, and Micic scored, I believe 3 takedowns and a turn for 3. Micic's head and hands defense might be the most under rated part of his game. Clearly based on their sat match if they wrestle 10 times in 10 different settings we get the same result in each match. I guess I have to ask what they saw or didn't see that would lead you to think differently? I think you're getting into the minutia of things that aren't necessary. How many times in sports have you seen upsets when no one thought the other could win? It happens. I only mentioned venue in reference to another poster made reference to it. I think Lee admitted he was nervous under the setting. So if they wrestled 10x, could I see Lee winning 1 or 2? Sure because great athletes make adjustments and not all matches are the same. Could I see Micic winning all 10? Sure. He was dominant Saturday. What I saw Saturday was two great wrestlers where one was clearly better on that day. I'm not saying Lee is better, but to ignore there is even a possibility of a different result at a different time (same venue or different) is sticking your head in the sand because things change in sports all the time. It happens. That doesn't take away from Micic's HS career or his dominance Saturday so I'm not sure why you feel the need to defend any other ideal than total superiority. Why not just see that people on here recognize him as a great wrestler and his storied career and leave it at that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caleb Spires Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Surprised there hasn't been a "Lee vs. Sliga" thread yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WrestleMan Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Surprised there hasn't been a "Lee vs. Sliga" thread yet. Or Lee vs. Ditka. Not mini Ditka but full size Ditka in a no holds barred cage match. Now that would be something. I think Lee wears him down and wins in a marathon match for the ages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCKAJC Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 So if they wrestled 10x, could I see Lee winning 1 or 2? Sure because great athletes make adjustments and not all matches are the same. Could I see Micic winning all 10? Sure. He was dominant Saturday.. So judging by this your saying that you don't recognize that Micic is just on a different level right now. You lose a whole grade for that gaf. What I saw Saturday was two great wrestlers where one was clearly better on that day. : Better on that day? REALLY? WOW!! So the next day it may have gone the other way? : You do realize that at no point was Lee close to scoring, right? What ever. You opinion is yours to do with as you please. Another whole grade off. I was going to give extra points for the use of the word minutia, accept you misspelled it. It's actually minutiae. Excellent effort though. Interesting side note- I was in the third row right in the middle for this match. As Lee and Micic were waiting to get started pacing the mat, I looked around at the crowd. I had trouble finding anyone that was watching the other three other matches that were in progress. All eyes were on Mat 3 for the royal rumble that hadn't even started yet. Kinda funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCKAJC Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Or Lee vs. Ditka. Not mini Ditka but full size Ditka in a no holds barred cage match. Now that would be something. I think Lee wears him down and wins in a marathon match for the ages. I agree with the out come. But I think Ditka bites off the end of Lee's nose as Lee is getting the fall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWINfan Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 . So judging by this your saying that you don't recognize that Micic is just on a different level right now. You lose a whole grade for that gaf. : Better on that day? REALLY? WOW!! So the next day it may have gone the other way? : You do realize that at no point was Lee close to scoring, right? What ever. You opinion is yours to do with as you please. Another whole grade off. I was going to give extra points for the use of the word minutia, accept you misspelled it. It's actually minutiae. Excellent effort though. Interesting side note- I was in the third row right in the middle for this match. As Lee and Micic were waiting to get started pacing the mat, I looked around at the crowd. I had trouble finding anyone that was watching the other three other matches that were in progress. All eyes were on Mat 3 for the royal rumble that hadn't even started yet. Kinda funny. You're replies on here are getting to the point of being sad. I can't help you if you aren't smart enough to read a post in it's entirety and understand it. I'll try to type slower and MAYBE you'll get it. What I don't get is your need to nitpick to make your self feel better in your love for Stevan when I have done nothing but praise him. But I'll give this a shot. In the history of sport, there have been upsets throughout. No one thought: Buster Douglas had a chance in hell against Mike Tyson. Villanova had a chance in hell against Georgetown (or NC State vs. Houston for that matter) Appalachain State beat Michigan The Reds sweeping the 1990 A's? Nonsense The Miracle on Ice? There are more examples than anyone could name where a team or individual seemed completely outmanned and still won. Upsets happen. With Lee's talent, if you can't see how adjustments could be made, then there is no hope for any civil discussion with you and a certain word that starts with an i and ends in diot comes to mind. Stop being that and acknowledge that your boy is excellent and people are giving him props. When he becomes Superman with no Kryptonite, I'll start to listen to your nonsense again. Feel free to get the last word in and make yourself feel smarter. I'm done typing to someone no smarter or logical than a brick wall. The floor is yours Mr. Genius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weelittlegiblet49 Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 I really don't think lee can beat red. Red has proved him self two years in a row Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MD92 Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 . So judging by this your saying that you don't recognize that Micic is just on a different level right now. You lose a whole grade for that gaf. : Better on that day? REALLY? WOW!! So the next day it may have gone the other way? : You do realize that at no point was Lee close to scoring, right? What ever. You opinion is yours to do with as you please. Another whole grade off. I was going to give extra points for the use of the word minutia, accept you misspelled it. It's actually minutiae. Excellent effort though. Isn't it ironic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boiler10 Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 First: Kudos to Nick Lee for going after the best. He would have likely won the state title at 132 but he cut to 126 because he simply wanted to wrestle the best. That attitude alone is commendable. Second: Micic was the better wrestler at state. Would he be the best wrestler everyday? Who knows and it doesn't matter. Nick gave it his best and Micic won. Congrats to Stevan. You had one of the best guys in the country come after you and handled it like a champ. Third: Does Lee beat Red. Very likely he does as he is the bigger wrestler and Red would have to give up weight. Lee can't make 120 and Red would likely have to wrestler 132 or 138 to make the match happen. Red has completely dominated his first 2 years. I do not think he has wrestled guys at Lee and Micic's level but top to bottom 120 was probably a stronger class and Red walked through it (although the finals were a bit closer than most expected). At the end of the day, these might be the best three pound for pound wrestlers in the state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boiler10 Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 "accept you misspelled it" Don't you hate it when you put your own foot in your mouth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bog190 Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 I was going to give extra points for the use of the word minutia, accept you misspelled it. It's actually minutiae. Excellent effort though. I was going to give extra points for the use of the word "except," except you misspelled it. It's actually except. Excellent effort though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meluvwrestling Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 Is the Micic vs Lee matched posted anywhere online? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 Is the Micic vs Lee matched posted anywhere online? Look in the archives of the state finals videos (bottom of the page) and you should be able to find the semi-final rounds which will include their match. If I recall correctly it was on Mat 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCKAJC Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 I was going to give extra points for the use of the word "except," except you misspelled it. It's actually except. Excellent effort though. So it looks like three found my attempt at interjecting at bit of levity into this uptight thread. But it didn't come from where I had hoped it would come from. Oh well, I tried.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meluvwrestling Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 Look in the archives of the state finals videos (bottom of the page) and you should be able to find the semi-final rounds which will include their match. If I recall correctly it was on Mat 3. Thanks for helping me locate the video. Nick Lee appears to still only have that one takedown and Micic shut it down. After watching the match, it's no surprise that he lost the match based on his lack of takedown shots and shot defense. Micic has multiple options when it comes to takedowns. I was surprised that he got rode out the way he did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hero123 Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 I don't know Red. Yet he pinned his way through the field this weekend (Dominating performance). Someone said that over 80 of his 90 wins have been by pin. Can someone confirm this or is it just talk? He had 30 something falls this year and pinned everyone up to the finals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futureRECORDholder Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 Back to the main topic of this thread, I think lee would beat Red. I believe Lee has more credentials anyway. They do have a chance of facing next year but we all know they will dodge each other b/c they both want a state title next year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU89 Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 Nick will NOT dodge anyone. He seeks out the best, not run from it. That being said, Red doesn't want any part of Lee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naphtali Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 Chad Red is a great wrestler. He has achieved 2 titles in his first 2 years of high school and that is a great accomplishment. If C. Red and N. Lee were to meet up there is no doubt in my mind C. Red would be completely overwhelmed by N. Lee. I think that the best shot for C. Red to beat a Lee would be against the younger Joe Lee who is coming up next year. But his odds at winning against the younger J. Lee are not that much greater considering J. Lee has as great a resume to his credit as his older brother Nick. I hope we get to see some sort of Lee vs Red match up next year. I don't see Red or either Lee running from each other should they end up in the same weight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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