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Qualified Weigh-ins

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How many qualified weigh-ins does a wrestler need to qualify for sectional? Do injuries have an impact on this?  For example, we have a wrestler that's been out due to injury and will have about 10 matches, but only 3 qualified weigh-ins. Can he wrestle at sectional?

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19 minutes ago, 84headhunter said:

Honestly I don't get the point of this rule, can someone explain what it's for?

Some of the reason is likely to show through documented weigh-ins that you are adhearing to your weight management plan.   

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1 hour ago, Y2CJ41 said:

Even if he's injured he can weigh in

yep, should've been weighing in if he was able to. Doesn't need to be in the lineup.

That's what mom told me.

Edited by Numchuck Skills

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On 1/10/2018 at 8:12 PM, MattM said:

Some of the reason is likely to show through documented weigh-ins that you are adhearing to your weight management plan.   

Ehh, what's adhering to a weight mgmt plan?  I've personally seen wrestlers lose way more than what is allowed within a couple days and not too long ago, this same issue came straight from  one of Indianas finest. 

"I was cutting too much weight and it showed when things started to count. I was like 133 pounds during the week and I was cutting to 113."

But, I get where you're coming from on this, they need "paper trails"

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46 minutes ago, 1prouddad said:

Ehh, what's adhering to a weight mgmt plan?  I've personally seen wrestlers lose way more than what is allowed within a couple days and not too long ago, this same issue came straight from  one of Indianas finest. 

"I was cutting too much weight and it showed when things started to count. I was like 133 pounds during the week and I was cutting to 113."

But, I get where you're coming from on this, they need "paper trails"

What is your suggestion? Should kids weigh daily - and maybe multiple times a day? Drink a Gatorade...weigh in? Eat a hamburger, weigh in? If they weighed in right after dinner and that put them three pounds over, and the rule is you can only be two - should they not be able to compete?

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18 minutes ago, grappleapple said:

What is your suggestion? Should kids weigh daily - and maybe multiple times a day? Drink a Gatorade...weigh in? Eat a hamburger, weigh in? If they weighed in right after dinner and that put them three pounds over, and the rule is you can only be two - should they not be able to compete?

There's a big difference in cutting a couple pounds as you suggested than to not follow the guidelines and cut down 3 weight classes or 20lbs or nearly 1/6 of total body weight. But hey, if it's on the papers, then it's ok and no one knows. 

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8 minutes ago, 1prouddad said:

There's a big difference in cutting a couple pounds as you suggested than to not follow the guidelines and cut down 3 weight classes or 20lbs or nearly 1/6 of total body weight. But hey, if it's on the papers, then it's ok and no one knows. 

Not really - rules are rules. If the rule is you can only cut roughly two pounds (at the 113 pound for instance) - and a person cuts three. That's no better than the person cutting 10. It's still a rules violation, right? Personally, I don't have an issue with kids cutting as much as they want as long as they are healthy. That's part of the beauty of the sport - the ones that sacrifice the most are the ones that succeed. Wrestling isn't easy. In fact, it's by far the most difficult high school sport. If kids devote so much to it that they will cut 10 pounds in a week and be able to keep that up an entire season - more power to them. Goals aren't easy to achieve - unless you set the bar low.

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3 minutes ago, grappleapple said:

Not really - rules are rules. If the rule is you can only cut roughly two pounds (at the 113 pound for instance) - and a person cuts three. That's no better than the person cutting 10. It's still a rules violation, right? Personally, I don't have an issue with kids cutting as much as they want as long as they are healthy. That's part of the beauty of the sport - the ones that sacrifice the most are the ones that succeed. Wrestling isn't easy. In fact, it's by far the most difficult high school sport. If kids devote so much to it that they will cut 10 pounds in a week and be able to keep that up an entire season - more power to them. Goals aren't easy to achieve - unless you set the bar low.

True

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1 hour ago, 1prouddad said:

Ehh, what's adhering to a weight mgmt plan?  I've personally seen wrestlers lose way more than what is allowed within a couple days and not too long ago, this same issue came straight from  one of Indianas finest. 

"I was cutting too much weight and it showed when things started to count. I was like 133 pounds during the week and I was cutting to 113."

But, I get where you're coming from on this, they need "paper trails"

1. A person's weight can fluctuate by 5+lbs a day, which is much greater than the weight allowed to lose per week.

2. Most kids will lose 2-6lbs in a standard practice, again more than they are allowed to lose in a week.

3. I promise you most kids routinely lose more than 1.5% when they start the week.

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Here's a simple notion to keep in mind: If your kid was at a higher weight in the beginning of the season and weighed in while obeying the alpha plan's limits, you can count those weigh-ins.  If you change weight classes and follow the alpha plan's increments and don't drop below the lowest possible weight class, all weigh ins should count.  A lot of yo-yoing around to the extreme will make folks question your documents.

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Some kids lose 5 pounds by looking at the sun. Like Joe said.... weights go up and down. The kids know when they need to be on weight.

Our sport is dog eat dog. If a program was dirty a disgruntled jv parent would most likely let it be known so little Johnny could be varsity. Plus you have other coaches looking at weights every weigh-in. Bottom line is that this is a non-issue. 

And no!.... Asa did not cut 20 a week. I’ve been around him since very early on. Not sure what prompted him to say that??? He was heavy before last season, but got down quick and maintained. You can believe me or not. But... I’ve always shot all of you straight on this board and in person. I am sure some anonymous poster is going to let me have it now. 

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And no!.... Asa did not cut 20 a week. I’ve been around him since very early on. Not sure what prompted him to say that

Im sure he knows exactly what he weighs each and every day. If he said he was weighing a certain weight,  Not that it was the right thing to say when being published, but I would find it probable. It's no secret that wrestlers do this to either give them a better chance at a certain weight, help the team fill a roster spot, or whatever it may be, it's unhealthy for a growing body and that's why the rules were put into place. This is not a crack on Asa or any wrestler in general, just a point that I think should have better monitoring. 

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I understand that you can go to another meet (between two other schools) and weigh in even if your team doesn't wrestle in that meet, Is this correct?

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1 hour ago, Kerz said:

I understand that you can go to another meet (between two other schools) and weigh in even if your team doesn't wrestle in that meet, Is this correct?

Correct.  Coach has to be there with weigh-in sheet, as we were informed a week or so ago.

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On 1/12/2018 at 3:53 PM, 1prouddad said:

And no!.... Asa did not cut 20 a week. I’ve been around him since very early on. Not sure what prompted him to say that

Im sure he knows exactly what he weighs each and every day. If he said he was weighing a certain weight,  Not that it was the right thing to say when being published, but I would find it probable. It's no secret that wrestlers do this to either give them a better chance at a certain weight, help the team fill a roster spot, or whatever it may be, it's unhealthy for a growing body and that's why the rules were put into place. This is not a crack on Asa or any wrestler in general, just a point that I think should have better monitoring. 

worry about you?

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1 hour ago, fearless fly said:

so, if you are near a time zone you could get 2 fairly easily in one morning ?

The computer program that they are entered in only allows for one per day.

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On 1/10/2018 at 8:40 PM, Fishingbasket said:

Sectional participants must have 6 qualifying weigh ins prior to the seeding meeting for sectionals. One must be scratch weight

Really confused after seeing all of the responses regarding 1 1/2% per week rule and weight management program.  So are we all saying that the 1 1/2% rule is merely a suggestion?  I get that everyone on here would agree that most high school wrestlers will fluctuate and gain much more than that after they weigh in and then taper back down to weight before their next weigh in.  Wrestler weighs in at 144.8 to wrestle 145.  Immediately after weigh in he eats and rehydrates himself, competes on Saturday and eats everything in sight on Sunday only to enter his wrestling room on Monday 6-12 lbs over, then spends the week to get back down to weight where he will weigh in once again somewhere an ounce or two below 145.  No disagreement...it happens all of the time, but in every aspect of the rule is perfectly legal.

But here are two examples of why the rule is in place for fairness of competition as well as health of individual wrestler?

1.  On two occasions we have bumped some guys in our lineup to "wrestle up".  First time was vs Lakeshore (home team Michigan weights)  In many weight classes we gave up weight because we factored the legal weight following the 1 1/2% rule.  For example we bumped our 106 to wrestle their 112 lber.  To stay within rule for our next weigh in our 106 could weigh 107.59 to wrestle their 112.  Our 132 could weigh in at 133.98 or less to wrestle their 140 lber.  By calculating the max weight loss according to 1 1/2% rule we stayed within the rule as it was intended.  Were we right or wrong?  If we had not done that would it have been a "qualifying" weigh in according to rule?

2.  Little Johnny (hypothetical) has had trouble making weight so everyone says screw it and Little Johnny wrestles 120 at a Holiday tournament weighing in at 118.5.  Two weeks later Little Johhny shows up at the weight he has been struggling to hit which is 106!!  I don't know if Little Johnny has a "scratch" weigh in at this weight or not, but if he has spent the first part of the season one or two weights up....would any of his weigh ins be "qualified"?  Second part of the question...according to rule is he legal to wrestle 106 at sectionals with documented weigh ins 12+ lbs  and 14 days apart?

Intent is not to point out any specific deviations with any other individual or team but to merely understand the rule more clearly as it pertains to the proper interpretation for our team to follow as intended.

Thanks for your input/comments.

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8 minutes ago, SharkBit said:

1.  On two occasions we have bumped some guys in our lineup to "wrestle up".  First time was vs Lakeshore (home team Michigan weights)  In many weight classes we gave up weight because we factored the legal weight following the 1 1/2% rule.  For example we bumped our 106 to wrestle their 112 lber.  To stay within rule for our next weigh in our 106 could weigh 107.59 to wrestle their 112.  Our 132 could weigh in at 133.98 or less to wrestle their 140 lber.  By calculating the max weight loss according to 1 1/2% rule we stayed within the rule as it was intended.  Were we right or wrong?  If we had not done that would it have been a "qualifying" weigh in according to rule?

2.  Little Johnny (hypothetical) has had trouble making weight so everyone says screw it and Little Johnny wrestles 120 at a Holiday tournament weighing in at 118.5.  Two weeks later Little Johhny shows up at the weight he has been struggling to hit which is 106!!  I don't know if Little Johnny has a "scratch" weigh in at this weight or not, but if he has spent the first part of the season one or two weights up....would any of his weigh ins be "qualified"?  Second part of the question...according to rule is he legal to wrestle 106 at sectionals with documented weigh ins 12+ lbs  and 14 days apart?

Others feel free to refute this...but my experience has been as follows:

For question 1:  You were right IF you wanted both weigh-ins to be "QUALIFIED".  If your kids had weighed in heavier at the MI meet that weigh-in would be qualified, but the next one would not.  If you have extra weigh-ins in your schedule, a couple of non-qualified weigh-ins would not be a big deal (though I believe the intent of the rule would be to do what you did and have all qualified weigh-ins).

For questions 2:  It seems to me that this 'plan' would not really be in the spirit and intent of the 1.5% rule unless Little Johnny starts at 120 early in the season and makes his way down to 106.  I also assume 106 is not below his minimum weight.  However, your case of weighing in and then dropping 12.5 lbs in 2 weeks is a little different.  All previous weigh-ins would be qualified.  The one weigh in after the large cut would NOT be QUALIFIED  and could not count as the scratch weigh-in.  However, the system seems to re-set after every weigh-in.  So after hitting 106 once, he could then keep weighing-in and the subsequent ones would be qualified.  So it believe it is LEGAL by technical rule.

Some other states have systems that give a minimum weight allowed each week from the alpha weigh-in.  Then if you weigh in heavy, they re-adjust the minimum for each subsequent week.  Unless there is a minimum weight for every week AND every weigh-in must be qualified, there will always be some wiggle room "legally".

In the end it depends on the coach's and wrestler's philosophy.

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