Coach77 Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 I have seen a lot of topics about kids moving for one reason or another and make some teams around the state better then what they were. Well we better get used to that, because as the new education reforms start to take effect we are going to see more and more of it and there will nothing the IHSAA (what little they do already) can do about it. The voucher system and school choice will basically end school boundaries and kids will be able to transfer from one school to the next by basically saying they are going to another school for a different academic program or maybe even a better one. We have just seen the tip of the iceberg with this one and we will all have to what and see what happens as the new education reform is passed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crosstownrivals Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 High schools might as well start hiring recruiters to their coaching staffs. The way our WONDERFUL goverment is handling school choice and vouchers. I think we should all start offering benefits to the top notch athletes. Why not, all the big time colleges do it (Auburn, Florida, Alabama and etc...) Do I hear free lunches for the best of the best! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munges Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 The present system already allows you to attend another school if they offer subjects not taught at your school presently. This has already been abused for sports purposes. I have a hard time believing that high school athletics was even a topic of consideration when it came to vouchers. If I lived in district that had a horrible school academically and socially I would be glad for the voucher to send my kids to a better school. If parents allow their kids to abuse this for sports then shame on them! But I applaud the politicians for trying to fix some things which are broken in our schools. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m25443 Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 One of the big problems with continuing to add more laws is the fact that there are often "unintended consequences" that were not thought through or anticipated. I'd love to find some politicians who try to see how many laws they can eliminate, rather than ones looking to have their name associated with new laws/bills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PITBULL Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 I don't know if any one has seen this. it's about Mark Hall out of Michigan and hoe he has transferd. http://www.intermatwrestle.com/articles/7774 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polytropos Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 The voucher system may propose a challenge for the IHSAA, but the governor's concerns are a little more important than the smooth function of high school athletics. We are talking about enabling people to get out of these swamps of ignorance to go somewhere that might actually teach them. Whether it will work remains to be seen, but if the state is going to spend that much tax money on someone's education, I would personally hope we could get a little more for our money than we currently do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1oldwrestler Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 I don't know if any one has seen this. it's about Mark Hall out of Michigan and hoe he has transferd. http://www.intermatwrestle.com/articles/7774 I don't really understand his dad's logic about holding him back. He's talking about not wanting to send his son to college at the age of 17, but if he's turning 14 during his 7th grade year, he'll be 17 by the time he's a sophomore, making him 19 when he goes to college... Sounds like B.S. to me. If he wants to hold his son back and move him all over the country in order to give him an advantage on the mat the least he should do is be honest about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1oldwrestler Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Did I read the article wrong? I thought it said the kid was wrestling high school kids. I don't know if his dad said those exact words, but it seemed he was saying he moved his kid all over to increase his advantage on the mat and didn't care what anyone thought of it. Last year, he was wrestling high school kids in Kentucky as a seventh grader because they allow seventh and eighth graders to compete at the high school level. This year he's wrestling in Minnesota in their premier program, Apple Valley, again as a seventh grader, because his dad held him back. Minnesota also allows seventh and eighth graders to wrestle at the high school level, I believe. The dad did pretty much own up to just moving his son around the country in order to make him a better wrestler, but I think his reasons for holding him back in school are disingenuous, for the reasons I stated before. It's not about college, it's about giving his son a physical advantage over his peers, in addition to all the other advantages he obviously already has. I don't necessarily disagree with either decision, although I would think it would be hard to have the life of a normal kid moving around so much, but the father should at least be straightforward about everything he's doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indyshred Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 I don't really understand his dad's logic about holding him back. He's talking about not wanting to send his son to college at the age of 17, but if he's turning 14 during his 7th grade year, he'll be 17 by the time he's a sophomore, making him 19 when he goes to college... Sounds like B.S. to me. If he wants to hold his son back and move him all over the country in order to give him an advantage on the mat the least he should do is be honest about it. Look around, you see this alot in the wrestling and football world where physical maturity gives you a big advantage. My oldest son is a freshman in college and is younger than many high school seniors out there competing right now. It amazes me that this isnt talked about more than it is. Did you ever notice in the wrestling world that nobody ever gives the age of their wrestler, only their grade? You see this alot in the middle school world, muscular, physically mature, hairy kids wrestling little boys. The parents are always beaming in the crowd as their 15 year old 8th grader is beating on a 13, 14 or even a 12 year old. Unfortunately thats the nature of our sport, people are willing to do whatever thay can to make sure their kid is THE MAN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randalllynch Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Having retired from the military with children I can tell you there is a huge difference between moving for sports and the military life style. There is a HUGE family support system of help with the effects of moves on children. To move a family on a military move the you stay in that location for 3 years (normally), military familys do not move every year. I have a son in the 8th grade, wrestling schoolboy, and he has wrestled first and second year cadets when the tournament is based on school grades. If you really believe it doesn't matter then you are not looking very close. A boy who has not gone through puberty yet is at a very distinct and obvious advantage compared to one who has not. Also, someone mentioned kids needing twrestle high school kids because junior high kids are no longer a challenge, that is because they should be in high school. My brother and I both coach youth football, and the problem is even more rampant there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1oldwrestler Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Weak argument - you generally don't have to move to get your kid into a better academic situation and even if you did it would be a helluva lot better reason to do so than athletics. Enhancing a kids intelligence is going to pay a lot more dividends for him his entire life than enhancing his abilities in a sport he'll more than likely be finished with at the age of 35. Let's say you have a 5 year old that already reads, writes, plays music, does arithmetic, etc. Are you going to want him in a Kindergarten situation when the other kids are learning their alphabet and colors? This would stymie his development. Again, weak argument - you're talking about a parents career choice here. No comparison whatsoever. As far as moving around, every milatary kid in the country has to deal with that. Do you think we should disband the milatary because kids have to move? If his father loves him, then the kid will have few developmental issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Peck Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 The voucher system may propose a challenge for the IHSAA, but the governor's concerns are a little more important than the smooth function of high school athletics. We are talking about enabling people to get out of these swamps of ignorance to go somewhere that might actually teach them. Whether it will work remains to be seen, but if the state is going to spend that much tax money on someone's education, I would personally hope we could get a little more for our money than we currently do. Maybe the Governor should concentrate on making every school a quality school. Vouchers are a nice idea, but they may just make the "swamps" worse as the better students are accepted by Private Schools and the others are rejected and the "swamp" is the only place left for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decbell1 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Maybe the Governor should concentrate on making every school a quality school. Vouchers are a nice idea, but they may just make the "swamps" worse as the better students are accepted by Private Schools and the others are rejected and the "swamp" is the only place left for them. and then the private schools decide that with increased enrollment that they obviously will have to raise their tuition...... and the whole money issue starts over again. If I don't approve of the way my roads are being built, can I get the option to send my tax money elsewhere? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boot Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 and then the private schools decide that with increased enrollment that they obviously will have to raise their tuition...... and the whole money issue starts over again. If I don't approve of the way my roads are being built, can I get the option to send my tax money elsewhere? All the voucher system does is take even more money away from those whose budgets have been cut to the bone and send it to private schools and the wealthiest schools. Focus on treating teachers better so they don't have to get second jobs and actually want to stay in teaching, give more continuing ed opportunities and incentives. Those 2 simple acts along with parents supporting teachers (a novel idea) rather than always assuming they know more will lead to better education of kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarlHungus Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 But in this case, this boy's age is not going to be a factor for 5 more years during his senior year. Until then, he will be wrestilng just like he would have. From what I read in the article, by the time this kid is a freshman or even this year maybe, he won't even be challenged by high school wrestlers. This kid's father makes no bones about the fact that he is doing what he can to develop his son's wrestling potential. I personally have no problem with his choice especially after reading how good that kid is. He would not benefit at all from wrestling junior high kids if he is majoring nationally ranked seniors. I don't know that I would make the same choice, but I might if my sons were that good. They are pursuing excellence. Let's say you have a 5 year old that already reads, writes, plays music, does arithmetic, etc. Are you going to want him in a Kindergarten situation when the other kids are learning their alphabet and colors? This would stymie his development. As far as moving around, every milatary kid in the country has to deal with that. Do you think we should disband the milatary because kids have to move? If his father loves him, then the kid will have few developmental issues. Then you have the example of Mark Churella from Michigan. He was a national champion who did not let his boys wrestle until they were in middle school and they both turned out pretty good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOX FAN Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Exactly what is the state law regarding school choice ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach77 Posted January 19, 2011 Author Share Posted January 19, 2011 As of right now the state does not have open enrollment as it relates to public schools. You can choose to go to a private or charter school but then we start to talk about out of pocket costs as it relates to those types of schools. All in all is the whole plan by the state at this time is so vague and the fact that Mitch has total control of the government means he will get what he wants and as a result we will have to wait and see how things come out when we see the final details. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decbell1 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 As of right now the state does not have open enrollment as it relates to public schools. Actually, open enrollment does exist in some form. As long as another school approves it, you can go there without paying tuition like they used to make you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MatChick76 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Actually, open enrollment does exist in some form. As long as another school approves it, you can go there without paying tuition like they used to make you. Yes it does. I know a few kids in Evansville that go to a public school not in their district, and they get bussed to the school, because they have taken advantage of the School Choice Program. I'm not sure exactly how it all works, but there are kids doing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numberz Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 I believe the money follows the student. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrecoCoach Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 I believe the money follows the student. If it does, then there is still a 1 year delay because the state bases its formula allotment on the previous year's enrollment. That really hurts fast-growing school districts since they end up receiving less money per student than the previous year. This will cause some of the better districts to refuse to accept students from outside their boundaries. Open enrollment will not improve education in Indiana unless the state changes how they distribute the money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarlHungus Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Hungus, I am not even saying that this is the best thing to do or something I would do. I am just saying that if the Dad wants to do what he is doing (I guess he must have the means), then I don't have a problem with it. If the Dad loves his boy, spends time with him, appropriately disciplines him, I don't think the kid will have any reason to have any issues because he has moved around. People move all of the time for all different kinds of reasons. I am not advocating for every wrestling or sports prospect to go galavanting around the country, but I am also not saying that it is wrong. It is that family's choice, not mine, not yours, or anyone else's. I don't have a problem with it. Child prodigies in music will sometimes move to get to a teacher that can actually help them. This kid from what I read seems like a prodigy. I don't think the decisions to move around are good or bad necessarily is all I am saying. I agree with you, I was just pointing out that there was more than one way to skin a cat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 My biggest problem with the Mark Hall saga is that they are holding him back a year. I know for my kid(s) I will probably do crazy things to help them succeed as this father is doing, but to me holding the kid back in school doesn't help. He is already a stud and beaten some really good wrestlers this summer and this season. To me it seems as if the family is putting wrestling before anything else and in reality when Hall is 35 years old his extra state championship as a 2nd year 7th grader probably won't help him land a job anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtv2112 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 If it does, then there is still a 1 year delay because the state bases its formula allotment on the previous year's enrollment. That really hurts fast-growing school districts since they end up receiving less money per student than the previous year. This will cause some of the better districts to refuse to accept students from outside their boundaries. Open enrollment will not improve education in Indiana unless the state changes how they distribute the money. Several public schools in the Evansville area have sent out recruiting pamphlets advertising their school. These pamphlets were sent to addresses obviously outside their normal boundarys. Some have also advertised on billboards. Schools will be hesitant to turn away kids and only will if they simply don't have space. They may not get money the first year, but they will get it the second year and until graduation. Money drives the bus and few will turn down money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtv2112 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 I don't think an extra state championship will help him either, but he could be a wrestling coach somewhere for job. RankingsGuy might even advocate for him to coach at a Indiana hs if he wrestles in college. Nickster, you better watch it. You might get in trouble if you mess with the RG {genuflect here}. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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