purdue02 Posted February 13, 2022 Share Posted February 13, 2022 Today at Evansville, Bray Emerine was out at 182. This bumped McBee up to the 2 spot and Rose to the 3 spot. McBee went from a Clay Martin ticket round match to a Gunnar Henry ticket round match. Subsequently McBee loses in the ticket round, Rose qualifies for state beating Martin, and McBee has beaten Rose in back to back weekends. I am not saying that McBee would have 100% beaten Martin and qualified for state but... he beat Rose the past 2 weekends and had earned that better opportunity. Could there not be a rule in place, where when a guy is out... McBee can choose to go to the 2 spot or stay put? Then Rose can choose to go to the 2 spot or stay put. Then if both guys decide to stay put, they could just put the alternate in the 2 spot. I just hate to see someone have their opportunity basically taken away by something that was out of their control. Any thoughts? Pg_rated, formercollegekid, swain358 and 4 others 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyGonzo Posted February 13, 2022 Share Posted February 13, 2022 Unfortunately I have seen this happen numerous times... However, I can't really think of a better way to have it done... If #2 goes out, then #3 and #4 are elevated, then the alternate is put in place... This may work against a wrestler bumping up a spot, but it may also help that same wrestler as well depending on the scenario and draw... Most cases I've witnessed, it has hurt one wrestler and helped another, but I don't believe there is a "fair" way other then bumping them up in the formula awill0352 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueandgold Posted February 13, 2022 Share Posted February 13, 2022 28 minutes ago, purdue02 said: Today at Evansville, Bray Emerine was out at 182. This bumped McBee up to the 2 spot and Rose to the 3 spot. McBee went from a Clay Martin ticket round match to a Gunnar Henry ticket round match. Subsequently McBee loses in the ticket round, Rose qualifies for state beating Martin, and McBee has beaten Rose in back to back weekends. I am not saying that McBee would have 100% beaten Martin and qualified for state but... he beat Rose the past 2 weekends and had earned that better opportunity. Could there not be a rule in place, where when a guy is out... McBee can choose to go to the 2 spot or stay put? Then Rose can choose to go to the 2 spot or stay put. Then if both guys decide to stay put, they could just put the alternate in the 2 spot. I just hate to see someone have their opportunity basically taken away by something that was out of their control. Any thoughts? I was wondering what happened. Jerry is a quality wrestler who I feel should be competing at the state finals. I feel terrible for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWINfan Posted February 13, 2022 Share Posted February 13, 2022 Similar comments were made in the Last Minute Bracket Changes thread. You aren't the only one with this thought. When someone else mentioned it, I commented that might not be a good change for McBee. And like you said, no guarantee he wins, but I'd have liked his chances better in his original quarter bracket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anskinne Posted February 13, 2022 Share Posted February 13, 2022 I have been against this forever. Bumping the bracket is for seeded tournaments. It should only happen at Sectional. Indiana is based on draw after that. The athlete should be able to choose, or the bracket should just be locked in. There should NOT be an automatic bump in a blind draw….. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted February 13, 2022 Share Posted February 13, 2022 In order for the IHSAA to consider a change in this they would need to accept that there is a flaw in our system. formercollegekid, Justin Ratliff and NavyGonzo 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripleB Posted February 13, 2022 Share Posted February 13, 2022 I say you can pick if you bump or not, the alternate falls in the hole KLH and formercollegekid 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted February 13, 2022 Share Posted February 13, 2022 I’ve mentioned in several years of threads including semi-state morning that ideally it would be nice if a coach/wrestler had the option not to bump if someone went out and the alternate would just move up a spot. Seems like it could be more fair to the rest of the bracket too since less opponents may get shifted at the last minute than when they bump everyone. But i’m sure the IHSAA would argue that’s just how the random process works based on placement and and if you don’t like it then we won’t have alternates. Though that hold little water since they would still want to bump the rest of the wrestlers anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbulldog152 Posted February 15, 2022 Share Posted February 15, 2022 (edited) So if you look back at the New Castle Semi-state 126 for 2017 you'll see Negangard from East Central getting a forfeit in the first round.... Negangard was a Regional runner-up... I remember there being a wrestler from Pike missing weight and not wrestling, he finished 3rd in his regional, however Evans from Greenfield Central finished 4th but still wrestled Pugsley from Shanendoah who won regional. I don't know if there was a mistake made during the coaches meeting and it was over looked, but they didn't not shift the seeds that one time which led to a runner-up getting a forfeit while his champ had a match. Edited February 15, 2022 by bbulldog152 change word Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsisson Posted February 15, 2022 Share Posted February 15, 2022 54 minutes ago, bbulldog152 said: So if you look back at the New Castle Semi-state 126 for 2017 you'll see Negangard from East Central getting a forfeit in the first round.... Negangard was a Regional runner-up... I remember there being a wrestler from Pike missing weight and not wrestling, he finished 3rd in his regional, however Evans from Greenfield Central finished 4th but still wrestled Pugsley from Shanendoah who won regional. I don't know if there was a mistake made during the coaches meeting and it was over looked, but they didn't not shift the seeds that one time which led to a runner-up getting a forfeit while his champ had a match. If a wrestlers misses weight a new wrestler only moves in if the alternate is present. If not it turns into a forfeit. At the coaches meeting they said our wrestler missed weight but that was not the case. I sent the email late Friday. It was a tough call for our wrestler to not wrestle at Semi-State, we literally did everything possible to get him ready but unfortunately it did not happen. I knew the implications it would have on the bracket, and sending that text message to Owen Valley honestly hurt me. I also agree that it is a simple fix by allowing the wrestler/coach decide if they would like to move in the bracket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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