dstruck Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 Dear IHSWCA Membership, and others: For years the IHSWCA Middle School State has used the same weight classes as national duals. It is of the opinion, an stance taken by the IHSWCA officers to use the IHSWCA State finals as your weight classes for your middle school meets. This issue was covered at our October meeting (fall clinic) for those that attended. WEIGHTS: 75 – 80 – 85 – 90 – 95 – 102 – 110 – 117 – 125 – 132 – 140 – 150 –160 – 175 – 195 – 220 – 275 While we absolutely can not make this a rule in your school as the IHSAA doesn’t govern middle school, we can make the suggestion of using these weights to make a uniform system throughout the state. As far as a local coach, and not just an association officer. When Jeffersonville middle schools run a home meet, these are the weights we use for our City Championships, County Championships, and all duals we host at home. When a school asks us what we want to use, we say MIDDLE SCHOOL STATE WEIGHTS. It is what we followed before I was officer, and most likely will be after. EXAMPLE: Why does the IHSWCA MS State use these weights? Nationals does Why does Jeffersonville use these weights? State Does (same at HS level) Why does the IHSAA use their weights? The National Federation does Why does Jeffersonville use these weights? The IHSAA does Good luck with your feeder programs – hopefully we can all keep working TOGHETHER to make Indiana wrestling a great place for kids to grow!! PS - please share with your MS coaches, and AD’s Danny Struck IHSWCA PRESIDENT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripleB Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 Yeah so take that MattM!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 Yeah so take that MattM!!!! Taking it, forwarding it to my AD, and hoping it starts to grow legs with the other high school coaches that want to help encourage it at the middle schools they are associated with. Thanks for taking some time to consider the issue and putting at least a little bit of backing behind it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randalllynch Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 These are weights we use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vito pepperelli Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 Many (All?) of the schools in northwest Indiana have 22 weight classes. Can't disagree with uniformity, but I would also hate to see coaches and conferences eliminate weight classes. And the majority of the schools I have seen this year fielded full lineups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 Many (All?) of the schools in northwest Indiana have 22 weight classes. Can't disagree with uniformity, but I would also hate to see coaches and conferences eliminate weight classes. And the majority of the schools I have seen this year fielded full lineups. Keep in mind there is the ability for reserve matches reguardless of the number of weight classes. If teams are that large their could always be an effort to have actual JV Dual meets or Varsity 2 teams, which may help build more excitement for events for the reserve kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlaskanMountie Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 Prior to the Commander-in-Chief's post, our conference (Sagamore) just realigned our weight classes last month. Here is the compromise I came up with after some coaches voted against the reduction of 22 to 17 weights; 75-80-85-90-95-100-106-113-120-126-132-138-145-152-160-175-195-220-275 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachi123 Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 So what happens when u show up to a school with 12 wrestlers and 5 of them weigh 115-120. Your still doing match ups. Then the other school wins 102-18 and thinks they are good! I still believe all jr high matches especially in the eastern side of the state need to be individual match ups closest to weight and wrestle. Hopefully get 2 rounds in at a dual. Building individuals that can grow into a team later. Having the luxury of numbers and the scheduling of jr high sports works for a large area. Wrestling is back into a small corner where small schools cannot compete. Basketball overlaps wrestling so then the jr high season overlaps the ISWA Folkstyle season. Many great individuals from this area, but very few complete teams. The only team I believe to be really great that would have won a 1 or 2 a title would have been union co in the early 2000's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timeinandout Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 Keep in mind there is the ability for reserve matches reguardless of the number of weight classes. If teams are that large their could always be an effort to have actual JV Dual meets or Varsity 2 teams, which may help build more excitement for events for the reserve kids. MS coach here. The cons far out weigh the pros for these weight classes. I don't want to show this to my AD because shortening a dual meet will be a done deal. Pros: Less forfeits for smaller teams Uniform weights(probably wont happen still) Quicker dual meet(con in my book!) Cons: Less "varsity" wrestlers(big deal) Half the weight classes between 100-135(30% of avg. team) Increase instances of weight loss(not as many classes) 68 lbers don't stand a chance against the 75lbers(maybe your 106 lb champ) Bigger jumps for guys that bump up(103 pounder wrestling some 120 lb. stud) Less varsity wrestlers(not varsity...I quit...I am the running back) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vito pepperelli Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 Have to go agree with timeinandout, To an adult it might be sematics, but to an adolescent whom you are trying to sell the sport of wrestling the difference between being in the varsity line-up and being JV is huge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Attakk Posted December 20, 2013 Share Posted December 20, 2013 After talking with my AD about adjusting our current weight classes here are some things I learned and some that were confirmed. Many middle school ADs no little to nothing about wrestling (confirmed). The IHSAA has puts out a guide book for middle school sports (learned). Therefore the ADs just follow the guidelines set forth by the IHSAA. Now these are not rules but rather suggestions and ADs not wanting to have to explain to parents why little Billy doesn't have his weight class. They can just say "we use the IHSAA guidelines". These weight classes haven't changed in at least 17 years, probably longer. My AD's suggestion was to contact the IHSAA and have them change their guidelines if we want more support. Now as far as the weight classes that were suggested go, there are some good points and bad. 22 weight classes are too many but 17 is too few and eliminating middle weights is a terrible idea. I like the idea of spreading out the weights a little bit more instead of 5, 10, or 15 pound increments having it gradually increase to allow more growth and less cutting weight. I took your suggested weight classes and the current ones we use and am trying to enact the following weight classes for our school and hopefully for our county and conference (not holding my breath). 75-80-85-90-95-100-105-110-115-120-125-131-137-144-151-158-168-180-220-280 With a rule about the minimum weight for the 280 class being 220. And I absolutely want to thank you for attempting to make it uniform and for getting the ball rolling as it as opened up more dialogue on the subject and importance of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 Bump, since some MS seasons are starting this month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgmotorfan Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 Man. IN THE FIRST PLACE EVERYONE KNOWS THE IHSAA HAS BEEN TRYING TO GET RID OF WREST FOR 40YRS. SO WHY NOT THINK OUTSIDE THE BOX. Get IHSWCA & ISWA set up a committee to make Ind. ms rule book, & if Ihsaa trys to butt in politely tell them there services for middle school s NOT needed. To me jr high as i still like to call it, should be nothing but as many matches as the team with fewest kids. SCH.#1 HAS 11 KIDS SCH.#2 HAS 18KIDS 11 MATCHES WILL BE THE BOUT # FOR TEAM SCORES.. THAT IS SET AS SOON AS COACH A SAYS HES GOT ELEVEN. DONT MATTER WHAT WIEGHT. 11. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarlHungus Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 Why would the IHSAA try to get rid of one the most profitable tournaments they run? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgmotorfan Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 PINPOINTING A WEIGHT IS OLD AND AT THE SAME TIME RESTRICTING FOR A KID TRYING TO CRAFT HIS SKILL AND A COACH TRYING TO TEACH HIM. EXAMPLE SCH. #1 #1WR IN @ 104 SCH. #2 COACH HAS 2 KIDS TO PICK FROM SO WHAT IS IT COACH IS IT YOUR 106 WRESTLER OR 110 EVEN THOUGH HES WEAKER. IN MY VIEW EACH POUND A KID AFFORDS ANOTHER KID IS A POINT OR 1/2 POINT HANDICAP YES I SAID HANDYCAP SCH.#1 #2WR IN @ 121 COACH OF SCH.#2 COULD HAVE 4 THAT ARE WITHIN 7 LBS BOTH WAYS DO I WRESTLE MY REAL TUFF 14 OR DO I THROUGH MY WEAK 27 @ him.Coaches would actually learn how To TEAM COACH WOW IMAGINE THAT . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgmotorfan Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 IF YOUR EQUAL TO BASKETBALL YOU WOULD HAVE TOP 64 TEAMS @ INDY . GOT RID OF TEAM ST. ALTOGETHER RIGHT. THAT IS NOT WHAT I THINK OF WHEN I THINK OF PROMOTING. & ON TOP OF THAT RESTRICT THE KIDS BY MAKING THEM BE ON A CERTAIN WHT FOR THE SAKE OF BEING ON SAID CERTAIN WHT. PROMOTING WHT LOSE & INJURING YOUNG ADULTS. BECAUSE ITS FOR THE TEAM THAT IS NOT EVEN RECOGNIZED BY IHSAA. WHY CANT A SCOOL HAVE TO WRESTLERS @SEC. IF TEAM HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT, PLEAE CHAD THE IHSAA GIVES YOU YOUR TOURNEY &IT SUFFICES THEM BECASE YOU GO AWAY FOR AWHILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgmotorfan Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 sry just a rant One mans opinion . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarlHungus Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 Thats ok, i didn't understand it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randalllynch Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 We use the weights used for the Middle School State Tournament. However, the coaches for the teams in our area and I sit down before the dual meet and make sure our good wrestlers go against each other and lesser experienced kids wrestle each other whenever possible. We have 5th through 8th graders and our elementary schools do not have sports, so this has worked really well for us in keeping our numbers high. We appreciate the schools we wrestle (Madison, Highland Hills, Jennings County, Hazelwood, Corydon, New Washington, Southwestern, Paoli, River Valley, Charlestown, and Parkview) for working with us to keep kids interested in the sport, because too many beat downs for a 5th grader is the easiest way to lose them forever! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgmotorfan Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 We use the weights used for the Middle School State Tournament. However, the coaches for the teams in our area and I sit down before the dual meet and make sure our good wrestlers go against each other and lesser experienced kids wrestle each other whenever possible. We have 5th through 8th graders and our elementary schools do not have sports, so this has worked really well for us in keeping our numbers high. We appreciate the schools we wrestle (Madison, Highland Hills, Jennings County, Hazelwood, Corydon, New Washington, Southwestern, Paoli, River Valley, and Parkview) for working with us to keep kids interested in the sport, because too many beat downs for a 5th grader is the easiest way to lose them forever! thats great match um up like they do the youth leagues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgmotorfan Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 Is it about the kids learning the sport or your teams dominace over a program with10 kids trying to learn.? just match um up try to get everyone you can solid matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathewsz7 Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 I have another suggestion for those who run the MS State tournament....GET RID OF THE HALF MAT CRAP, HELL I THINK THE UPSTAIRS GYM MY BE 1/3 MATS...IT'S REDICULOUS, I MEAN PEEWEE KIDS WRESTLE ON FULL MATS FOR ISWA STATE BUT MIDDLE SCHOOL KIDS DONT??? IN THE WORDS OF ESPN'S CHRIS BERMAN.....C'MON MAN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sig40 Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 Is it just the northwest that does not allow 5th graders to wrestle middle school? If so can middle schools up north that do not of 5th graders on their team be able to add them for middle school state where other Indiana schools have 5th graders competing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
backtothemat Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 Amen mathewsz7 ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 I have another suggestion for those who run the MS State tournament....GET RID OF THE HALF MAT CRAP, HELL I THINK THE UPSTAIRS GYM MY BE 1/3 MATS...IT'S REDICULOUS, I MEAN PEEWEE KIDS WRESTLE ON FULL MATS FOR ISWA STATE BUT MIDDLE SCHOOL KIDS DONT??? IN THE WORDS OF ESPN'S CHRIS BERMAN.....C'MON MAN That would probably require moving it to another venue. I highly doubt that will ever happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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