GrecoCoach Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 With these days off school, I've been thinking over ideas for changes to the state series format (team & individual) that the IHSAA could see as viable, consistant with their current policies, and possibly increase their revenue without taking any additional days. Here's what I came up with: Individual - no classes Team - 3 classes A - lowest 96 teams (6 per sectional = only 2 mats needed) AA - next lowest 96 teams (same as above) AAA - approximately 116 teams (7.25 per sectional = 3-4 mats needed) *Bigger schools are more likely to have gyms that can hold 3-4 mats with plenty of seating. Time Frame (I'm using this year's dates to show how it would work out.) Saturday, January 29 (current individual sectionals) Team Sectionals - 16 sites (x3 classes) - every team is entered with a blind draw (IHSAA likes to do that) Wednesday, February 2 (current team regionals) Team Regionals - 4 sites (x3 classes) - 4 sectional winners just like current format Saturday, February 5 (current individual regionals) Team State - 1 site with 4 teams per class (12 total) [doesn't basketball bring 4 teams per class to state?] Friday, February 11 & Saturday, February 12 (current individual semistate weekend) Individual Sectionals - combines current ind. sectionals & ind. regionals Seeded and wrestleback from a certain point (similar to current sectionals) 16-24 teams per site (current) but would be good to realign to balance them Saturday, February 19 (current individual state weekend) Individual SemiState - same as current format (would love to see wrestlebacks added though - whole other discussion) Friday, February 25 & Saturday, February 26 (current team state weekend) Individual State - same as current format Pros: *This layout would be the exact same number of weekends as the current format, so there wouldn't be any additional work for the IHSAA. *This layout seperates the team portion from the individual portion so there is no "I want to rest my guys" argument. *This layout allows every team to be entered into the tournament series without beginning a team title with an individual tournament. Devil's Advocate: *The IHSAA likes the team trophy to be at the very end of the season - this format does not do that. *IHSAA would have to give out 16 more team sectional trophies and about 56 more team member medals (doing away with the 3rd place medals for two teams) Anyone else see anything horribly wrong with this format? Is it an improvement over what we currently have? (I won't be offended if someone hates it.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleGiant91 Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 Great idea, Jake! Looks like you've covered all the bases! I like the idea of finishing the team tournament before individual tourney starts. We could crown team champs, then wrestle for individual titles! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 Jake, The ihsaa only splits classes as evenly as possible so each class would have around 106 schools. I cannot see them changing that for one sport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chambers Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 Jake, The ihsaa only splits classes as evenly as possible so each class would have around 106 schools. I cannot see them changing that for one sport. Before this year the IHSAA by-laws required that they split classes as evanly as possible. They changed that by-law this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarlHungus Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 Before this year the IHSAA by-laws required that they split classes as evanly as possible. They changed that by-law this year. Correct. Mainly to open up the possibility of a 6th class for football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sodakchamp Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 According to the IHSAA web site a five class system is in place for football, four class system for baseball, basketball, softball,and volleyball, and a two class system for soccer. With that being said I don't see any reason why a three class system wouldn't work for wrestling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XCard Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 I think the best thing would be to try and complete the Team portion before individuals or the Team portion completely after. Of course this would probably add an extra week to the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Wrestler 2006 Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 I really like it. I think you should talk to as many coaches as you can and see how many of them would back this, then send it into the IHSAA to see if they go for it. Wahoo for you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XCard Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 I like the format of combining the Sectional and Regional, I thinking about this as well. How about just basically seeding each sectional as you still do and feed them into a 32 man bracket, one sectional on each half of the bracket. Cross bracket the wrestlebacks from the quarters on. If you did it any earlier, I think you may run into a problem with the 5 match rule in one day. I like the idea though. Another thing to consider is the availablity of Conseco Fieldhouse the following weekend. All in all nice job coming up with this plan. Should probably get with Julio who has mentioned he has been working on a proposal himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrecoCoach Posted March 4, 2011 Author Share Posted March 4, 2011 I still say a format like this would be a huge improvement over what we have been doing and is definitely better than not having team state at all. Even if it wasn't classed it could still work. Even if the classes had to be balanced it would still work (small schools would just need at least one gym per sectional that could hold 4 mats). The IHSAA knows there are serious flaws with the current team state format. They have repeatedly said that there WILL BE CHANGES to it. Hopefully that means they keep it and make it better. One thing I'd like to see changed is giving more teams the opportunity to feel involved in the team state series - not just team state, but the whole series. Right now, only 32 teams (sectional champs) have any involvement in the series. My idea gets 100% of teams involved from the start of team sectionals. Just imagine gyms across the state packed like Center Grove was! All the teams in the sectional would be fairly close to the host school, so fans could get there easily. Fans may even be more apt to follow along through the sectional finals, regionals, and team state to watch how teams do that may have knocked out their team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
julio Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 Jake your idea sounds good, but I don't see the IHSAA going for a class in wrestling if they don't have 1 for track, swimming, or cross country which are all similar to the way wrestling is classified. I don't know about your area, but up here they did an article in the paper about the basketball sectionals and the attendance of the class system. Some of the smaller classes had a hand full of people attend, 1 example had 23 people in the stands total. I would like to attend a meeting where the coaches could discuss, not just be told this is what we are going with and coaches not having an open mind, about the possibilities of a change to team and individual state this summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammer Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 Jake your idea sounds good, but I don't see the IHSAA going for a class in wrestling if they don't have 1 for track, swimming, or cross country which are all similar to the way wrestling is classified. I don't know about your area, but up here they did an article in the paper about the basketball sectionals and the attendance of the class system. Some of the smaller classes had a hand full of people attend, 1 example had 23 people in the stands total. I would like to attend a meeting where the coaches could discuss, not just be told this is what we are going with and coaches not having an open mind, about the possibilities of a change to team and individual state this summer. I don't believe that you can factor swimming into the equation, as I am pretty sure that there are nowhere near as many schools with swimming programs as wrestling programs. Track would probably be the best comparison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 Julio, Do you have a link to that article? I would be interested in reading it. Jake, I like the idea and I personally feel getting the team series done in a week's time is the best for its health. The biggest concern is if the IHSWCA or whomever is going to do a proposal they must look at it from the IHSAA's point of view. You have to look at how they run other tournaments and see the common themes in them, such as being all inclusive and having a random draw. Unfortunately since the IHSWCA has been reactive in this situation we are faced with the possiblity of not even having a team state tournament. I can only hope that the IHSWCA and coaches around the state learn from this and is more proactive that reactive in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrecoCoach Posted March 4, 2011 Author Share Posted March 4, 2011 Julio - whether it was classed or not, would it be an improvement to what we currently have? Hammer - actually the only sport that is comparable as a one-on-one sport would be tennis. Y2 - we are the only sport that has 2 tournaments, so there is no "common theme". My idea tries to add some of that in though, with all-inclusion and random draw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gstemv81 Posted March 5, 2011 Share Posted March 5, 2011 Intriguing proposal. Question: what options would teams like Yorktown or Mater Dei who might have no interest in a classed title and want to compete with the biggest and "best" in the main event? Going to three classes does a good job of ensuring the smallest schools a meaningful chance to compete with their peers, but what of those midsize schools who want to bump with the best? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcochran Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 I just received my survey. I thought this thread should be bumped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 What are they survey questions the IHSAA is asking? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrecoCoach Posted March 10, 2011 Author Share Posted March 10, 2011 What are they survey questions the IHSAA is asking? *This is what I remember the questions being (not word for word, but close) #1 Are you in favor of keeping the current team state format and time frame? #2 (If you answered "no" to #1) Are you in favor of determining the team champions based on the individual state finals? (same as before 1996) #3 (If you answered "no" to #1) Are you in favor of changing the time frame of the team state? (i.e., during the regular season) #4 (If you answered "no" to #3) What format would you be in favor of? (box to type a respnse) #5 Comments & Suggestions (box to type a response) None of the questions addressed classing it. Hopefully coaches take the time to type responses in the comment boxes. Even though I answered "yes" to #3, I still entered an explanation about it in #4. Coaches, ADs, and Principals need to keep in mind that the results for #3 need to reflect how you feel about what that specific question asked. Answering "no" just so you can vent about classing it does not accurately reflect what we feel about the time frame. Use #5 Comments & Suggestions to do that. I fear that the IHSAA has already made up its (Bobby Cox's) mind that wrestling will not be classed in any sense. The IHSWCA definitely needs to show them the results from its own survey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 Please make sure you take some time immidiately to talk to your principal and AD about holding off on the survey until you can talk to them soon. Unfortunately, if the data is mixed with no answer being overwhelming the IHSAA will say the survey was inconclusive and say that is a legit reason to take it upon just themselves to decided what to do. Making sure your principals and AD are informed of the details of the state tournament series by you so you have a better chance that they will go into it voting the same way as you (the wrestling coach) did. Reguardless of what your stance it this is a much better way of voting to help your school out than them voting quickly before you can speak with them. If not we are letting people have little to no clue about the details of the tournament series have 2/3 of the opinion on it. This will no doubt help to add more mixed data and a inconclusive result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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