youngone Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 309 Schools competed this year in wrestling this year. only 8 participate in the team state finals I propose 2 classes Here is Why You allow 8 more teams media exposure IHSAA makes more money More fans of more schools will get exposed to quality wrestling It will get smaller schools more excited about wrestling raising number of participants It is possible to do it with out interupting the indivual tourney Here is how Split the schools in half D2 small schools 154 D1 Big schools 155 Team Sectionals 154 Schools 16 Sectional, 1o teams at 10 Sectionals, 9 teams at 6 Sectionals D1 Big schools 155 Team Sectionals 155 Schools 16 Sectional, 1o teams at 11 Sectionals, 9 teams at 5 Sectionals Each Sectional would look like this Start 11 days before sectionals Seed meeting on Monday Dual Meet format 10 team format 9 Teams Tue Thur @ Pre determined Location Tue Thur @ Predetermined Location A 10v8, EWinner A v.1 @1 Home Winner E v. Winner B A8v.9, E Winner A v.1@1 Home Winner E v. Winner B B 4v5 @4 Home Winner F v. Winner C B4v.5@4 Home Winner C v. Winner D C3v6 @3 Home Winners Then Compete C3v.6@3 Home Winners then Compete D 7v9, F Winner D v.2 @ 2 Home D7v.2@ 2Home -The next week is dead for Indivual Sectionals- Top 2 Teams Advance The Wed. After Ind Sectionals 8 Regionals Winner Sectional A v. Runner Up B Winner Sectonal B v. Runner Up of A Winners competer The Following Wed. Top two Per Regional Advavnce to 4 Semi States Winner Regional A v. Runner Up Regional B Winner B v. Runner Up A Winners Compete Top Two Advance to an 8 team State Championship where D1 and D2 will be held at the same location the Sat after Individual State No change to the individual tournament at all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 Stupid idea, class wrestling is stupid, I only care about a true champion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickS Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 Stupid idea, class wrestling is stupid, I only care about a true champion. About time you got on board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gstemv81 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 With class wrestling one thing that never comes up is the "balkanization" that would happen to the wrestling community. I don't like the idea of segregating teams and having to pay attention to who is in what class, etc. As for 8 teams getting more "media exposure" - is it earned? This media exposure comes AT THE EXPENSE of the top eight who have earned it. Put differently, the top 8 at Team State have EARNED the undivided attention of ALL wrestling fans in the State of Indiana, and all real fans of wrestling would be at ONE SITE on that weekend at Center Grove. Yes, I'm saying that all those "fans" who stay home because they don't have a kid/team competing aren't real fans - they're "homers." The segregating of schools by class would create a new issue for small school State. Every year the final would be MD vs. whoever. How boring would that be? Mater Dei may be down the last couple of years but they would still score 60+ in a dual against any small school team in the state, at least for awhile. Depending on the cutoff, only a Yorktown could compete with MD. However, Yorktown is a real team with a great tradition. This weekend they get to go after Castle and Mishawaka. Would they want it any other way? So, if Yorktown is small enough to meet the cutoff they wrestle MD every year, year in and year out for a meaningless small school state title. If they're above the cutoff they have the opportunity to take on real competition while no one will care what MD does - not even their fans. I imagine that in that event MD will continue to decline and they will never be back. A divided team state series would just create new dominant team scenarios. In the Southland (without MD) it would be Castle and Evansville Reitz for the team regional every year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catfish Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 If they class wrestling, we can then start threads like they do in football. They argue about the unfair advantage of Catholic schools and not the size of schools. Have you ever looked at what the percentage of Catholic schools that win the 1A thru 4A state football championships? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pin2win1 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 NOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The endless arguement that makes me want to roll up into the fetal position and cry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 With class wrestling one thing that never comes up is the "balkanization" that would happen to the wrestling community. I don't like the idea of segregating teams and having to pay attention to who is in what class, etc. As for 8 teams getting more "media exposure" - is it earned? This media exposure comes AT THE EXPENSE of the top eight who have earned it. Put differently, the top 8 at Team State have EARNED the undivided attention of ALL wrestling fans in the State of Indiana, and all real fans of wrestling would be at ONE SITE on that weekend at Center Grove. Yes, I'm saying that all those "fans" who stay home because they don't have a kid/team competing aren't real fans - they're "homers." The segregating of schools by class would create a new issue for small school State. Every year the final would be MD vs. whoever. How boring would that be? Mater Dei may be down the last couple of years but they would still score 60+ in a dual against any small school team in the state, at least for awhile. Depending on the cutoff, only a Yorktown could compete with MD. However, Yorktown is a real team with a great tradition. This weekend they get to go after Castle and Mishawaka. Would they want it any other way? So, if Yorktown is small enough to meet the cutoff they wrestle MD every year, year in and year out for a meaningless small school state title. If they're above the cutoff they have the opportunity to take on real competition while no one will care what MD does - not even their fans. I imagine that in that event MD will continue to decline and they will never be back. A divided team state series would just create new dominant team scenarios. In the Southland (without MD) it would be Castle and Evansville Reitz for the team regional every year. I agree, the small schools that would make it wouldn't earn it because it would be an easier route for them. Those teams and coaches wouldn't have to work as hard as the other schools to make it to state. Then we would just be letting a bunch of teams and kids to state that didn't work hard and we don't want that, do we? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 If they class wrestling, we can then start threads like they do in football. They argue about the unfair advantage of Catholic schools and not the size of schools. Have you ever looked at what the percentage of Catholic schools that win the 1A thru 4A state football championships? Another great point! We definitely don't want posts with hypothetical match-ups or even people complaining about parochial and private schools. I always try to eliminate posts with hypothetical match-ups on here because they are worthless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duck_and_run Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 The IHSAA will not make a whole new structure for the sport of wrestling. We will have to go to either a four or five class system. Also if we deem the team side more important they will force an individual side change. Four or five class individual tournement is an absolute joke for all the wrestlers. Im not to worried about changing the structure of the sport though, they can't even get wrestle backs through how in the heck do they expect to get the whole system switched. Its a dumb topic to even post cause its not going to happen and if it ever does it will be classed for both the team and individual in a 4 or 5 class system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikev Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 hey youngone, even though no one agrees with you, your post was nicely thought out and well written....just not a good idea though......i say keep it just like it is now....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 Why not just give every team a trophy then? There is only one team that works hard and that is the one with the blue ribbons, all others don't work hard or don't put enough time into wrestling in the offseason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
md85 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 Why not just give every team a trophy then? There is only one team that works hard and that is the one with the blue ribbons, all others don't work hard or don't put enough time into wrestling in the offseason. I agree. MD is not there this year because they didn't work hard enough. They deserve no ribbon and no recognition for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripleB Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 Y2, Small Schools are at a significant disadvantage. Some guy who used to post on here had very good statistical info to back up these claims. It's not just about the champion, it's about the kids. I vote every pariticpant is awarded a trophy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 Y2, Small Schools are at a significant disadvantage. Some guy who used to post on here had very good statistical info to back up these claims. It's not just about the champion, it's about the kids. I vote every pariticpant is awarded a trophy Well tell me who that is and I will ban his democratic, socialistic butt right now! Down with class wrestling and those idiots that support it. We only want a true champion! If you aren't the best there is a reason for it, you SUCK! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 If you aren't the best there is a reason for it, you SUCK! Well way to go an steal the quote we were going to put on the back of our team shirts next year. Thats two years in a row someone's taken my shirt design idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
md85 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 Well way to go an steal the quote we were going to put on the back of our team shirts next year. Thats two years in a row someone's taken my shirt design idea. Thats funny, Idon't care who you are. ;D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripleB Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 The following are all products of a class wrestling state, tell me if they look upset or down because they were not the "true" state champion. http://www.kenston.k12.oh.us/khs/athletics/wall-of-fame/img/wrestling_jeff_long.jpg[/img] http://www.kenston.k12.oh.us/khs/athletics/wall-of-fame/img/wrestling_ralph_graham.jpg[/img] http://www.norwalkreflector.com/content/articles/2009/03/09/front/doc49b52c7683bf0931446020.jpg[/img] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueBolt Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 I will say it again...Why not just award 309 Team State Champion Trophys? I mean lets face it, there will be 308 dejected teams and we just can't have that! I mean what will these kids do if they are not all champions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
md85 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 I will say it again...Why not just award 309 Team State Champion Trophys? I mean lets face it, there will be 308 dejected teams and we just can't have that! I mean what will these kids do if they are not all champions? Wow, BlueBolt and I agree on something. The apocolypse is upon us.( actually I agree with the Castle fans and coaches on several subjects.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpiderMonkey Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 There is a couple things that bother me about dividing into classes. The first is this would benefit and hinder the bubble teams. It would benefit the team that is on the high end of the cutoff and theoretically make them the BIG school in the division. Also it would make the other side be the small school! So a team with roughly 1200 students would be small compared to the big 3000 schools! Another thing is why would it be fair to divide into team class and not individual? If it is unfair for the small schools in the team competiton then it sure has to be worse for them individually? This so called big schools didn't become good overnight or because they are big. It's taken some of them almost 10+ years to become mainstays at the top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimtown 138 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 Ahhhhhh, the soothing sounds of class wrestling... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueBolt Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 Wow, BlueBolt and I agree on something. The apocolypse is upon us.( actually I agree with the Castle fans and coaches on several subjects.) Now don't come over here trying to be all friendly to score tickets to team state this year... ;D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripleB Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 This guy says that our state is in the stone ages because we don't offer class wrestling. Ooooops, wrong John Smith. How about this one: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-train Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 i would go along with a two class system for the team state. for the team format this would be fair and make sense. as far as the individual state tournament, i think that we need to acknowledge that wrestling is essentially an individual sport. at the end of it all, we want to know who is THE best wrestler at each weight class. with a watered-down tournament we will not get this result and we will be like college football fans, forever debating who is the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rebelmania Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 Worst idea ever. I have argued this idea many times. As a former state champion, i do not feel that i would have wrestled the best if i was wrestling in a class system. I would have always been thinking, what if that guy from the smaller school was better then me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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