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2016-17 IHSWCA Team State Qualifying Scores (FINAL)

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Brown boys, on 09 Feb 2016 - 12:52 PM, said:

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A link to the classification assignments was posted last week and has since been moved here:

http://indianamat.co...rocedures-2016/

Southmont is the second lowest enrollment 2A school this year.

We re-calculate classification every year since inclusion is dependent on meeting sectional participation minimum requirements.

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Joe will post the updated scores shortly.

Here’s a summary:

*Notes
-ASSUMING NO NEW INJURY INFORMATION IS SUBMITTED TODAY OR TOMORROW, all bids in all classes are clinched except one (Chesterton needs 3 state championships to catch Castle. There could be some jockeying for other positions as well, but bids are clinched.)
-Portage, Avon, and Churubusco have injury adjustments for Prado, Miranda, and Leazier added into below scores
-The only remaining points to be scored are for underclassmen in all 3 classes in this way: 0.5 for 6th-7th, 1 for 3rd-5th, 1.5 for 2nd, 2 for state champ

3A:
East Chicago rep: Crown Point 224
Fort Wayne rep: Carroll 177
New Castle rep: Warren Central 220
Evansville rep: Evansville Mater Dei 221
Automatic wildcards:
Portage 222
Avon 210
Penn 208
Brownsburg 205
Perry Meridian 204
Castle 197

Currently in position for consideration for both vote-in wildcards: Chesterton 192, Indianapolis Cathedral 182, Columbus East 177
Currently in position for consideration for final vote-in wildcard only: Lawrence North 175, Carmel 171, Jennings County 171

Additional 3A notes:
-You must be within 15 points of the first available candidate (currently Chesterton) for consideration for both vote-in wildcards and within 15 of the second available candidate (currently Cathedral) for consideration for the final wildcard
-Recall that Crown Point have declined bids 3 times. If they decline again, Portage would be the new East Chicago rep and Chesterton would move into the final automatic wildcard position. LN, Carmel, and JC would then be eligible for both of the vote-in positions along with Cathedral and CE. Hobart would need at least 2 more points this weekend to reach vote-in eligibility for the final wildcard in the no-CP scenario.

2A:
East Chicago rep: Culver Academies 130
Fort Wayne rep: Bellmont 210
New Castle rep: North Montgomery 217
Evansville rep: Edgewood 187
Automatic wildcards:
Yorktown 208
Jimtown 198
Garrett 184
Franklin County 176
Southmont 165
NorthWood 163

Currently in position for consideration for both vote-in wildcards: Lebanon 162, South Dearborn 162, Delta 151, Evansville Memorial 149, Indian Creek 149, Southridge 148

Additional 2A notes:
-You must be within 15 points of the first available candidate (Lebanon/S. Dearborn) for consideration for both wildcards and within 15 of the second available candidate (also Leb/S. Dearborn) for consideration for the final wildcard. Thus, Delta, EM, IC, Southridge are all eligible for both along with Lebanon and SD.
-Mt. Vernon (Posey) would get into the voting also with a state title at 145.

1A:
East Chicago rep: Triton 147
Fort Wayne rep: Prairie Heights 219
New Castle rep: Shenandoah 186
Evansville rep: North Posey 171
Automatic wildcards:
Oak Hill 209
Adams Central 199
Knightstown 169
Fountain Central 167
Monrovia 154
Winchester 147


Currently in position for consideration for both vote-in wildcards: Elwood 147, Woodlan 140, Central Noble 132, Eastern (Greentown) 132
Currently in position for consideration for final vote-in wildcard only: Churubusco 131, Delphi 127, Eastern Hancock 126, Bremen 126


Additional 1A notes:
-Winchester takes the final automatic position over Elwood by the first tiebreaker--most underclassmen sectional starters (Winchester 11, Elwood 10)
-All vote-in candidate positions are clinched unless new injury information comes in.

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Can we get CP there this year?

I hope so.  Not sure CP's school schedule, but most schools are getting out like Tuesday, Wednesday, or Thursday of the week before the Saturday-Sunday Christmas weekend this year.  They've not come because they don't want to wrestle over the holidays, but I personally hope they'll accept a bid since it's on Friday the 23rd, right at the start of break.  They could wrestle one or two more days, then still get virtually their whole 2 weeks of Christmas vacation.

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I hope so. Not sure CP's school schedule, but most schools are getting out like Tuesday, Wednesday, or Thursday of the week before the Saturday-Sunday Christmas weekend this year. They've not come because they don't want to wrestle over the holidays, but I personally hope they'll accept a bid since it's on Friday the 23rd, right at the start of break. They could wrestle one or two more days, then still get virtually their whole 2 weeks of Christmas vacation.

It will be tough with the coaching change

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It will be tough with the coaching change

I know nothing about it.  Why do you say that?  I actually wondered if that could make it MORE likely since it was most likely Vlink's preferred policy that had them sticking strictly to their no-holiday-wrestling policy.

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I know nothing about it.  Why do you say that?  I actually wondered if that could make it MORE likely since it was most likely Vlink's preferred policy that had them sticking strictly to their no-holiday-wrestling policy.

Interesting that Crown Point has the highest team score currently.   You would think they would have a legitimate shot at winning this.   What a great opportunity for them,  it would be a shame to miss out.   

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Interesting that Culver Academy and Triton are the automatic qualifiers from the EC semi-state in 2A & 1A, yet have rather low team scores.  These two teams also come from the same sectional (Plymouth).  What does that say about the quality - or lack of quality - for the Plymouth sectional and Rochester regional?  Is that an indication of the difficulty of smaller schools to advance wrestlers in that sectional and regional?  Or are all the smaller teams in that quadrant just bad?

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When is the vote for the vote-in candidates this year?

It's always been done in April at the time of the coaches' clinic in Indianapolis.

Interesting that Culver Academy and Triton are the automatic qualifiers from the EC semi-state in 2A & 1A, yet have rather low team scores.  These two teams also come from the same sectional (Plymouth).  What does that say about the quality - or lack of quality - for the Plymouth sectional and Rochester regional?  Is that an indication of the difficulty of smaller schools to advance wrestlers in that sectional and regional?  Or are all the smaller teams in that quadrant just bad?

It really only means that there weren't very many good 1A or 2A schools at the East Chicago semi-state this year.  There have been in other years, but a number of typical candidates are not as strong...Hanover Central, Rochester, Bremen, Culver Academies, West Lafayette have all had good qualifying scores in past years, for example.  The quota system controls for difficulty of path, so many of the small-school teams that have clinched berths are from difficult paths in other areas of the state.  It's just a down year.

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Joe will post the final IHSWCA Team State Qualifying scores shortly.

 

A summary is below.

 

3A:

East Chicago rep: Crown Point 224
Fort Wayne rep: Carroll 177
New Castle rep: Warren Central 225
Evansville rep: Evansville Mater Dei 225
Automatic wildcards:
Portage 223.5
Avon 214
Brownsburg 210
Penn 209
Perry Meridian 205.5
Castle 197
 
Currently in position for consideration for both vote-in wildcards: Chesterton 192.5, Indianapolis Cathedral 189, Columbus East 178
Currently in position for consideration for final vote-in wildcard only: Lawrence North 176.5, Carmel 176
 
Additional 3A notes:
-You must be within 15 points of the first available candidate (currently Chesterton) for consideration for both vote-in wildcards and within 15 of the second available candidate (currently Cathedral) for consideration for the final wildcard
-Recall that Crown Point have declined bids 3 times.  If they decline again, Portage would be the new East Chicago rep and Chesterton would move into the final automatic wildcard position. LN and Carmel would then be eligible for both of the vote-in positions along with Cathedral and CE.  Jennings County would also then be eligible for the final spot.
 
2A:
East Chicago rep: Culver Academies 130
Fort Wayne rep: Bellmont 210
New Castle rep: North Montgomery 217.5
Evansville rep: Edgewood 187
Automatic wildcards:
Yorktown 209.5
Jimtown 199.5
Garrett 184
Franklin County 176
Southmont 165
NorthWood 163
 
Currently in position for consideration for both vote-in wildcards: Lebanon 162, South Dearborn 162, Delta 151, Evansville Memorial 149, Indian Creek 149, Southridge 148
 
Additional 2A notes:
-You must be within 15 points of the first available candidate (Lebanon/S. Dearborn) for consideration for both wildcards and within 15 of the second available candidate (also Leb/S. Dearborn) for consideration for the final wildcard. Thus, Delta, EM, IC, Southridge are all eligible for both along with Lebanon and SD.
-Lebanon would move into automatic wildcard position and Mt. Vernon (Posey) and Columbia City would be eligible for the final vote if someone declines a bid.
 
1A:
East Chicago rep: Triton 147
Fort Wayne rep: Prairie Heights 220
New Castle rep: Shenandoah 199
Evansville rep: North Posey 171
Automatic wildcards:
Oak Hill 209
Adams Central 199
Knightstown 169
Fountain Central 167
Monrovia 154
Winchester 147
 
Currently in position for consideration for both vote-in wildcards: Elwood 147, Woodlan 140, Central Noble 132, Eastern (Greentown) 133
Currently in position for consideration for final vote-in wildcard only: Churubusco 131, Delphi 127, Eastern Hancock 126, Bremen 126
 
Additional 1A notes:
-Winchester takes the final automatic position over Elwood by the first tiebreaker--most underclassmen sectional starters (Winchester 11, Elwood 10)
-If someone declines a bid, Elwood becomes the new automatic wildcard, Busco/Delphi/E. Hancock/Bremen would be eligible for both vote-in spots, and Tri, Cass, and W. Central would move into contention for the final voted position.

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Joe will post the final IHSWCA Team State Qualifying scores shortly.

 

A summary is below.

 

3A:

East Chicago rep: Crown Point 224
Fort Wayne rep: Carroll 177
New Castle rep: Warren Central 225
Evansville rep: Evansville Mater Dei 225
Automatic wildcards:
Portage 223.5
Avon 214
Brownsburg 210
Penn 209
Perry Meridian 205.5
Castle 197
 
Currently in position for consideration for both vote-in wildcards: Chesterton 192.5, Indianapolis Cathedral 189, Columbus East 178
Currently in position for consideration for final vote-in wildcard only: Lawrence North 176.5, Carmel 176
 
Additional 3A notes:
-You must be within 15 points of the first available candidate (currently Chesterton) for consideration for both vote-in wildcards and within 15 of the second available candidate (currently Cathedral) for consideration for the final wildcard
-Recall that Crown Point have declined bids 3 times.  If they decline again, Portage would be the new East Chicago rep and Chesterton would move into the final automatic wildcard position. LN and Carmel would then be eligible for both of the vote-in positions along with Cathedral and CE.  Jennings County would also then be eligible for the final spot.
 
2A:
East Chicago rep: Culver Academies 130
Fort Wayne rep: Bellmont 210
New Castle rep: North Montgomery 217.5
Evansville rep: Edgewood 187
Automatic wildcards:
Yorktown 209.5
Jimtown 199.5
Garrett 184
Franklin County 176
Southmont 165
NorthWood 163
 
Currently in position for consideration for both vote-in wildcards: Lebanon 162, South Dearborn 162, Delta 151, Evansville Memorial 149, Indian Creek 149, Southridge 148
 
Additional 2A notes:
-You must be within 15 points of the first available candidate (Lebanon/S. Dearborn) for consideration for both wildcards and within 15 of the second available candidate (also Leb/S. Dearborn) for consideration for the final wildcard. Thus, Delta, EM, IC, Southridge are all eligible for both along with Lebanon and SD.
-Lebanon would move into automatic wildcard position and Mt. Vernon (Posey) and Columbia City would be eligible for the final vote if someone declines a bid.
 
1A:
East Chicago rep: Triton 147
Fort Wayne rep: Prairie Heights 220
New Castle rep: Shenandoah 199
Evansville rep: North Posey 171
Automatic wildcards:
Oak Hill 209
Adams Central 199
Knightstown 169
Fountain Central 167
Monrovia 154
Winchester 147
 
Currently in position for consideration for both vote-in wildcards: Elwood 147, Woodlan 140, Central Noble 132, Eastern (Greentown) 133
Currently in position for consideration for final vote-in wildcard only: Churubusco 131, Delphi 127, Eastern Hancock 126, Bremen 126
 
Additional 1A notes:
-Winchester takes the final automatic position over Elwood by the first tiebreaker--most underclassmen sectional starters (Winchester 11, Elwood 10)
-If someone declines a bid, Elwood becomes the new automatic wildcard, Busco/Delphi/E. Hancock/Bremen would be eligible for both vote-in spots, and Tri, Cass, and W. Central would move into contention for the final voted position.

 

What all goes into calculating these scores, because Warren won state pretty easily, yet they are tied in score with EMD

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What all goes into calculating these scores, because Warren won state pretty easily, yet they are tied in score with EMD

 

The scoring is specifically designed to project duals ability next year.  It won't necessarily reflect current-season strength or tournament-style ability.  Warren, for example, loses 8 starters and is projected to come back to the pack some.  All the details are in links in this thread:

 

http://indianamat.com/index.php/topic/49479-team-state-qualifying-procedures-2016/

 

Final IHSWCA Team State Qualifying scores are now posted in the first comment on this thread!

 

A summary is below.

 

3A:

East Chicago rep: Crown Point 224

Fort Wayne rep: Carroll 177

New Castle rep: Warren Central 225

Evansville rep: Evansville Mater Dei 225

Automatic wildcards:

Portage 223.5

Avon 214

Brownsburg 210

Penn 209

Perry Meridian 205.5

Castle 197

 

Currently in position for consideration for both vote-in wildcards: Chesterton 192.5, Indianapolis Cathedral 189, Columbus East 178

Currently in position for consideration for final vote-in wildcard only: Lawrence North 176.5, Carmel 176

 

Additional 3A notes:

-You must be within 15 points of the first available candidate (currently Chesterton) for consideration for both vote-in wildcards and within 15 of the second available candidate (currently Cathedral) for consideration for the final wildcard

-Recall that Crown Point have declined bids 3 times.  If they decline again, Portage would be the new East Chicago rep and Chesterton would move into the final automatic wildcard position. LN and Carmel would then be eligible for both of the vote-in positions along with Cathedral and CE.  Jennings County would also then be eligible for the final spot.

 

2A:

East Chicago rep: Culver Academies 130

Fort Wayne rep: Bellmont 210

New Castle rep: North Montgomery 217.5

Evansville rep: Edgewood 187

Automatic wildcards:

Yorktown 209.5

Jimtown 199.5

Garrett 184

Franklin County 176

Southmont 165

NorthWood 163

 

Currently in position for consideration for both vote-in wildcards: Lebanon 162, South Dearborn 162, Delta 151, Evansville Memorial 149, Indian Creek 149, Southridge 148

 

Additional 2A notes:

-You must be within 15 points of the first available candidate (Lebanon/S. Dearborn) for consideration for both wildcards and within 15 of the second available candidate (also Leb/S. Dearborn) for consideration for the final wildcard. Thus, Delta, EM, IC, Southridge are all eligible for both along with Lebanon and SD.

-Lebanon would move into automatic wildcard position and Mt. Vernon (Posey) and Columbia City would be eligible for the final vote if someone declines a bid.

 

1A:

East Chicago rep: Triton 147

Fort Wayne rep: Prairie Heights 220

New Castle rep: Shenandoah 199

Evansville rep: North Posey 171

Automatic wildcards:

Oak Hill 209

Adams Central 199

Knightstown 169

Fountain Central 167

Monrovia 154

Winchester 147

 

 

Currently in position for consideration for both vote-in wildcards: Elwood 147, Woodlan 140, Central Noble 132, Eastern (Greentown) 133

Currently in position for consideration for final vote-in wildcard only: Churubusco 131, Delphi 127, Eastern Hancock 126, Bremen 126

 

 

Additional 1A notes:

-Winchester takes the final automatic position over Elwood by the first tiebreaker--most underclassmen sectional starters (Winchester 11, Elwood 10)

-If someone declines a bid, Elwood becomes the new automatic wildcard, Busco/Delphi/E. Hancock/Bremen would be eligible for both vote-in spots, and Tri, Cass, and W. Central would move into contention for the final voted position.

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Is Hobart not eligible for vote in?

 

 

 

 
Currently in position for consideration for both vote-in wildcards: Chesterton 192.5, Indianapolis Cathedral 189
 
Additional 3A notes:
-You must be within 15 points of the first available candidate (currently Chesterton) for consideration for both vote-in wildcards and within 15 of the second available candidate (currently Cathedral) for consideration for the final wildcard

Unfortunately, no.  Hobart has 161.  The rest of the scores are in the first post on this thread.

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If you've only read the scores summary, it's worth looking at the final leaderboard to understand better how some schools are where they are.  Remember that underclassmen score much more than seniors because of their direct impact on each team's quality next year.  We've included a column on the final leaderboard for how many underclassmen starters each team in the state is bringing back next year.

 

Some general trends for certain numbers of starters coming back: 

 

8 or 9 returning: slight drop-off in duals ability is expected

7 or less returning: significant drop-off expected

 

10 or 11 returning: some improvement in duals ability expected

12+ returning: significant improvement expected

 

Knowing this, it explains why a team like Shenandoah with 14 starters coming back is tied for 3rd in overall score at 1A.  It also explains the high score of a surprising 2A team like NorthWood, who brings back 13 (they also got one of their best guys back right at the end of the year and were scoring much higher at year-end events).  

On the other hand, knowing Brownsburg brings back 9 and Warren only 6 explains why their qualifying scores suggest they could be back with the 3A pack next year instead of so far out front. 

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I'm not sure I understand the thought process of having one team with the exact same score get in while the other doesn't, when it's not for the final spot. Either allow them both to be voted on, or put them both in. Right?

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It is also a shame that two representatives from east chicago woukdnt have enough points to qualify if they were in any of the other 3 semistates.

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I'm not sure I understand the thought process of having one team with the exact same score get in while the other doesn't, when it's not for the final spot. Either allow them both to be voted on, or put them both in. Right?

It is for the last spot and the tiebreaker is designed exactly for the above scenario.  It's laid out in the procedures for two situations: semi-state rep and final automatic wildcard.     

 

The vote-in wildcards are a precious commodity designed to give the committee a chance to look at many more details than just state series performance (missed weight or mid-tournament injuries drastically affecting scoring, incoming freshmen/JVs, state series upsets) to pick 2 final candidates that could be top teams next year in the most effective way possible.  There has to be a rigid quota of 10 automatic berths for that commodity to exist. 

 

Re-reading the wording of the procedures doc, I understand how it could be interpreted that the tiebreaker doesn't apply here, but the phrase in item II.B "will also be selected and invited based solely on points" is meant to imply that the same scoring AND tiebreakers from II.A will be used as part of a strict cutoff.  I will make it more clear for next year.

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It is also a shame that two representatives from east chicago woukdnt have enough points to qualify if they were in any of the other 3 semistates.

Honestly, many people feel the qualification ought to be MORE geographically oriented (top 2 per semi-state per class, for example).  That's obviously how an IHSAA event would be, where the distribution of the number and quality of teams was often quite uneven.  There was often a "weak link" rep at IHSAA team state that wouldn't be a top 40 team but would be at team state.  

 

Unless we can come up with a way of better distributing teams per class per geographic area (right now there's a wide range in team totals per class per semi-state), I don't think anyone will push hard for it to change because of the situations you mention from this year.

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It is for the last spot and the tiebreaker is designed exactly for the above scenario. It's laid out in the procedures for two situations: semi-state rep and final automatic wildcard.

 

The vote-in wildcards are a precious commodity designed to give the committee a chance to look at many more details than just state series performance (missed weight or mid-tournament injuries drastically affecting scoring, incoming freshmen/JVs, state series upsets) to pick 2 final candidates that could be top teams next year in the most effective way possible. There has to be a rigid quota of 10 automatic berths for that commodity to exist.

 

Re-reading the wording of the procedures doc, I understand how it could be interpreted that the tiebreaker doesn't apply here, but the phrase in item II.B "will also be selected and invited based solely on points" is meant to imply that the same scoring AND tiebreakers from II.A will be used as part of a strict cutoff. I will make it more clear for next year.

I think you're missing my point. If Winchester, Elwood and Triton all have the same score and are deemed equal, then one of two things should happen:

 

They should all be in.

 

Or

 

They should all be up for voting.

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I think you're missing my point. If Winchester, Elwood and Triton all have the same score and are deemed equal, then one of two things should happen:

 

They should all be in.

 

Or

 

They should all be up for voting.

I understand what you're saying, but I'm saying the tiebreaker exists so that no one is "deemed equal" in the case of a rigid quota cutoff.  It's the same as two 10-6 teams in the NFL trying to get into the playoffs.  They are equal only in record--not in playoff qualifying criteria, which also includes tiebreakers to make sure no one is "deemed equal." 

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