SlickRodz Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 Why would coaches allow for the posting to a ranking site? This question is for those who coach. Our coach does not participate in the process of getting wrestlers or the team itself ranked. `It at the very least is a distraction to the wrestler `It makes opponents aware of a teams or individual's strength ` It leads to additional pressure `IT really means nothing For me there are many negatives and no positives to providing information as far as results that make up rankings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decbell1 Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 `IT really means nothing I think you summed it up right there.... If you wrestle differently somehow, because someone's name is on an internet page, how does that make any sense? Other reasons TO post info: -to help grow and support the sport of wrestling in Indiana -we all love the sport and want to be informed on the rest of the state -giving kids recognition for a job well done has never been a bad thing -most of the information is obtainable anyways, asking for it from the coaches just streamlines things. (maybe the best reason) In all honesty, I don't think rankings are going to change anyone's opinions too drastically. If someone is overconfident because they think they are good, they would probably be overconfident and cocky if there were no rankings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 Maybe coaches want to promote the sport better so they make the rankings better. Trust me, the rankings guy will find the results that are needed. He has connections on top of connections, so whether the coach sends it in or not it won't matter. Wrestling coaches are the sport's worst enemy when it comes to that kind of information. Many still live in the stone age of not wanting people to know their line-ups like its a top secret conspiracy. I take it your coach also doesn't send in meet results to the newspaper too. Wrestling coaches need to realize they are not helping the sport or their team by living in their top secret world of not releasing results. You are hurting the sport by not sending the information to the newspapers. I know I always liked seeing my name in the newspaper(for good things) and I presume kids are the same these days too. You will never see a football coach withhold stats because their opponents might figure out their strengths and weaknesses. To me it is absurd that a coach doesn't want his program to get recognition for their hard work. You also might want to have your coach contact the IHSAA to have them take down the past 10 years worth of state tournament data too. As someone that utilizes that information on scouting in the early season I can tell you there is a great deal of information there to help someone figure out strengths and weaknesses. It at the very least is a distraction to the wrestler I have never heard a kid say he lost because he was ranked. If he did, I would laugh at him and tell him the real reason he lost. It makes opponents aware of a teams or individual's strength Guess what, I can tell your team's strengths and weaknesses from looking at the results of sectional from last year. You aren't hiding anything from anyone. The information is out there, you just have to do some legwork. I have links to all the newspapers in the state that can provide me lots of information. It leads to additional pressure See the first response. IT really means nothing Rankings mean nothing in the end, but they are a great way to promote the sport. The topics that get the most attention on this website are rankings topics. No other subject is even close. Every sport has rankings, they are for discussion and only one sport I know of allows them to choose their champion(NCAA football). All other sports the champions are determined on the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlickRodz Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 I have to disagree with you. I don't see how rankings make the sport better, we will just have to agree to dis-agree here. Tuesday a HS wrestler came on the board and said goodbye. Said that last year the board (and the rankings) really got into his head and were a distraction. I have seen that. It gives a scouting report by which a wrestler can see the ranked wrestlers and who/how they lost. I am not calling for the withdraw of the rankings, I like them, but I don't see why a coach of a team would support it. I also disagree that the results come out anyway. Always some wrestlers at the top at years end that were not on the list at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 So you don't want any information about your team in any publications and want to have all their results under lock and key? I guess I don't get it when every other sport's results and statistics are in the paper, yet for some reason its a great conspiracy in wrestling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlickRodz Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 Maybe coaches want to promote the sport better so they make the rankings better. Trust me, the rankings guy will find the results that are needed. He has connections on top of connections, so whether the coach sends it in or not it won't matter. Wrestling coaches are the sport's worst enemy when it comes to that kind of information. Many still live in the stone age of not wanting people to know their line-ups like its a top secret conspiracy. I take it your coach also doesn't send in meet results to the newspaper too. Wrestling coaches need to realize they are not helping the sport or their team by living in their top secret world of not releasing results. You are hurting the sport by not sending the information to the newspapers. I know I always liked seeing my name in the newspaper(for good things) and I presume kids are the same these days too. You will never see a football coach withhold stats because their opponents might figure out their strengths and weaknesses. To me it is absurd that a coach doesn't want his program to get recognition for their hard work. You also might want to have your coach contact the IHSAA to have them take down the past 10 years worth of state tournament data too. As someone that utilizes that information on scouting in the early season I can tell you there is a great deal of information there to help someone figure out strengths and weaknesses. It at the very least is a distraction to the wrestler I have never heard a kid say he lost because he was ranked. If he did, I would laugh at him and tell him the real reason he lost. It makes opponents aware of a teams or individual's strength Guess what, I can tell your team's strengths and weaknesses from looking at the results of sectional from last year. You aren't hiding anything from anyone. The information is out there, you just have to do some legwork. I have links to all the newspapers in the state that can provide me lots of information. It leads to additional pressure See the first response. IT really means nothing Rankings mean nothing in the end, but they are a great way to promote the sport. The topics that get the most attention on this website are rankings topics. No other subject is even close. Every sport has rankings, they are for discussion and only one sport I know of allows them to choose their champion(NCAA football). All other sports the champions are determined on the field. 1. Our coach DOES send meet results and photos to the paper....every time. That is how the kids get their local recognition. 2. Yes there are links to every paper in the state, but no way anyone has the time to check them all. Our paper requires a fee for it's internet site as do many. Nothing is free. 3. It does effect the wrestlers as I mentioned with the wrestler who stated so this week. 4. It is not that hard for a wrestler to stay "under the radar" and off the list. Get to state as an unknown and make some noise. Happens every year. 5. We are not football or basketball. It may be a team sport but individuals have to wrestle. Much more pressure! I just don't see how rankings "better the sport of wrestling". There great for those who watch from the mat-side, I just don't see how they are good for the teams. I am not bashing the rankings, I really like them I just don't understand coaches and teams being "on-board". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlickRodz Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 An important note: We do give results of EVERY contest to the local paper. However we get about 33% coverage. Wrestling is not popular enough to garner coverage. We are very active but unless it is sectional time we are about 1 in 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 Rankings help the sport by giving recognition to the kids that perform well. It also gives a heads up to colleges looking for kids in certain weights. By the time the state finals rolls around the schools with money have already allotted most of it. Kids aren't flying under the radar unless they don't go to any offseason meets and never wrestle in any tournaments with good wrestlers in them. Its hard for me to believe that many people are flying under the radar with our rankings. There were three, yes three wrestlers last year that were unranked going into the post season and placed in the top 4. They were Dustin Kief, Alex Gregory and Keon Jones. All three were ranked during some portion of the season last year. If a coach doesn't want to send in information, so be it, we will get it from parents or other fans around the state. The kid you are referring to, did not state he lost because of the rankings, he lost because he lost focus and wasn't focusing on the task at hand. If you can't handle the "pressure" of being mentioned on a website, they you surely will not be able to handle the pressure of the semi-state ticket round or any other big match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlickRodz Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 You make good points and that is why I raised the question! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Central111 Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 Well while the Cameron Vlahos dicussion is still on, id just like the say that even if he did not wrestling last year i still bet anyone that he'll be top three at conseco. Shoot i'll even bet he'll win ;D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimtown 138 Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 The wrerstler that stated on October 29th that he was not getting on this website anymore, was active on this site this past Wednesday. What can you say, this site's addictive. It is not that hard for a wrestler to stay "under the radar" for a year maybe and that's if he didn't do well. You get to semistate and you are on the radar until you're out of school or quit. Sectional, regional, SS, and State stats are all over the internet. Most newspaper clippings are on this site in the results. Ultimately rankings mean nothing. They're mainly interesting to the old fart, armchair wrestlers like me. Yes, I live vicariously through my sons. Hey, I own them... ;D The wrestlers need to know that on any given day, anything is possible...period. Also, Y2CJ41 mentioned about the rankings- "It also gives a heads up to colleges looking for kids". That's a good enough reason for rankings to me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 What can you say, this site's addictive. No it is not. ;D ;D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimtown 138 Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 No it is not. ;D ;D Yeah, I can see it in your face AJ, you're HOOKED! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midwest Wrestling Fanpage Posted November 7, 2009 Share Posted November 7, 2009 There is No way Mitch should be ranked higher than half of the kids he is ahead of, Eads are you kidding me he is a beast , Thacker st. qual. and some others . I know its just pre season the rankings don't mean alot, but that high of a ranking he will have a target on his back ,every 189lber will be looking for that match. Best of luck to Mitch as a freshman wrestling varsity at 189 is tough but to have that high of expectations right off the bat. We will see in a couple of weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smooth34 Posted November 7, 2009 Share Posted November 7, 2009 Rankings guy, i like your passion for wanting the rankings to be perfect Duckworth goes from 171 to 215, Stein Princeton has been 171-189 during freestyle doubt hell see 152 again will be interesting to see how Sliga does this year at 189 great job so far Maybe I've been living under a rock somewhere, but who Sliga at 189 for Fishers? What has he done to warrant the #4 ranking? I'm not knocking the ranking, I'm just really curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midwest Wrestling Fanpage Posted November 7, 2009 Share Posted November 7, 2009 So you don't want any information about your team in any publications and want to have all their results under lock and key? I guess I don't get it when every other sport's results and statistics are in the paper, yet for some reason its a great conspiracy in wrestling. Keep up the good work, it keeps us die hard wrestling guy's goin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midwest Wrestling Fanpage Posted November 7, 2009 Share Posted November 7, 2009 Jared Mckinley should be at least # 3 at 112, with his showing at pre-season nationals some huge wins and getting 3rd, I believe he went undeafeted at Disney this year. Jared will prove his self this year!! Went 51-2 last season and ranked 10th?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainzero Posted November 9, 2009 Share Posted November 9, 2009 If a wrestler is good enough to be considered for being ranked, he won't fly under the radar. It doesn't take long before everyone knows who the good wrestlers are, even without coaches or others providing information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navy80 Posted November 9, 2009 Share Posted November 9, 2009 If a wrestler is good enough to be considered for being ranked, he won't fly under the radar. It doesn't take long before everyone knows who the good wrestlers are, even without coaches or others providing information. thats not always the case, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ontherise219 Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 Well while the Cameron Vlahos dicussion is still on, id just like the say that even if he did not wrestling last year i still bet anyone that he'll be top three at conseco. Shoot i'll even bet he'll win ;D I love to gamble You take Vlahos and I get the field I like my chances I'm not doubting Vlahos Skills but anything can happen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midwest Wrestling Fanpage Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 Cameron will be under the lights, I will take that bet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midwest Wrestling Fanpage Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 I still like Tyler Willis over Sean McMurray this year for the Major upset taking nothing away from the champ. You will see this year Tyler is the real deal!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ontherise219 Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 Cameron will be under the lights, I will take that bet. we going to go Snow Cones for Vlahos top 2. Like I said Those are very good odds. but even guys who are sure things aren't always sure things. Maybe we can See a Tyler Willis vs Sean McMurray at the Tricoff this year. But I would also Take Sean in that one he has had a pretty good 3 years so far Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midwest Wrestling Fanpage Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 we going to go Snow Cones for Vlahos top 2. Like I said Those are very good odds. but even guys who are sure things aren't always sure things. Maybe we can See a Tyler Willis vs Sean McMurray at the Tricoff this year. But I would also Take Sean in that one he has had a pretty good 3 years so far Ok Snow cones to the winner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ontherise219 Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 cool Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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