aoberlin

If we go by percentages for days won and upvotes here are your rankings. I would appreciate some upvotes for my effort here.

Upvote Percentage Per Post:

Days Won Percentage Per Post:

23 minutes ago, Bulldog89 said:

I guess we won't get any respect until we win all 14 weight classes!!!

When our U14 comes through high school it's going to be fun. 

Just more fuel to keep working hard. Thanks for the post. 

29 minutes ago, jets said:

Interesting topic and good read. Of course, most on here will cite examples of their Champs who didn't make a "hard cut" and point out that is the best possible route. 

 

Not many will have the guts to come on here and talk about the 1061/113/120 pounder who came down from 140+ to win his title. 

 

It is all relative ...

My son cut from 138 before this year's season to make 113 for Sectionals. Our first scratch weigh-in could only happen the week before Sectionals. He got rid of all his baby fat, and it was the best thing for him. He is a new kid. So yeah, I am happy to talk about it.  No titles were won though. 

That took allot of mama meal prepping.

But... you are absolutely right. We will get the veneer and the rarities. 

1. Implementing a harsher penalty for unnecessary roughness.
2. Wrestlers being considered inbounds with one supporting point.
3. Specific measurement requirements for required girls uniforms.
4. Video replay in championship events.
5. Awarding three points for a takedown instead of two.
6. Awarding two points for near-fall after a two-second count, three points for a near-fall after a three-second count, four points for a near-fall after a four-second count.
7. Charging the wrestler with a loss when using a medical forfeit.
8. Requiring only one supporting point for wrestling to be considered inbounds.
9. Eliminating that knees be inside the boundary to earn a fall or near-fall with the defensive wrestler out of bounds.  
10. Allowing that the pinning area not be the “total” of supporting points when the defensive wrestler is on their back. 
11. Allowing a wrestler to touch the mat in front of the starting line in the neutral starting position.
12. Adding grasping of the ear guards or mat as a delayed call.
13. Adding head-butting to the list of illegal holds/maneuvers.
14. Expanding to include gouging or poking of the eyes to Rule 5-29-1 (Unnecessary Roughness)
15. Requiring at least one coach in the corner of a match.
16. Requiring mat-side weigh-ins. 
17. Mandating coaches’ attire at dual meets and tournaments – similar to other NFHS sports.

I received this yesterday. But no survey. Figured they didn't really want my opinion.

Personally I believe it depends on the weight some and how naturally lean a wrestler is. 175 and above you may get away with not cutting and hanging close to 175 maybe even 165. My 175 weighed 165 and lost ticket round to someone who looked much bigger than him and we had a couple of positions we probably would have held if we were on weight or possibly floating over from time to time. My 190 weighed 176 at semi-state.  Under 175 I think you for the most part need to be lean and around your 7% body mass and actually be strong and not just a skinny rail. We can talk about position and mindset all day long which I think are the most important things. But if the kid doesn't have the strength to hold a position and execute a technique or defend an attack then you aren't winning titles. They have to be at a weight that makes sense for their body and the strength they have. We have been a non-cutting team for quite a while, I even forced a kid to go up a weight due to cutting too much, and I do feel like it has cost us some matches and kids not going as deep in the tournament as they could have. In the ideal world it would not matter but to say it doesn't just isn't living in reality. The size difference I see with some of our kids vs who they are wrestling is sometimes glaring. But... I also hate watching a kid suck weight 2 days before a match and use practice just to just cut weight and survive. Part of it may depend on just how natural of an athlete a wrestler is. 

We have also had plenty of kids that didn't get down to their fighting weight before the season or within striking distance and do the fat test and certify over what they naturally start weighing halfway through the season even though they say they are hammering food. So there is that to manage also.

With all that said our big focus this off-season is #1 Mindest, #2 Weights/Agility, #3 Chasing Competition, and #4 Technique. That isn't the order every team needs but that is what we need right now.

Kraus, I thought I explained this to you in our chat group. Also for a 175 Chase looked just fine and chiseled.

Angel is my pick also. I didn't get a chance to watch Lance.

Pearl Jam lost to Ticketmaster. I doubt the Indiana Wrestling community goes any further than someone's junk email box.

53 minutes ago, Wrestling Scholar said:

Think about  injury time outs in the sporting world.  In most cases, you're not penalized for taking an injury time out.  Why should wrestling be different.  And even pro athletes  call their own time outs.  Lets not jump on wrestlers.  Generally, the only penalty for injuries in team sports is you have to come out of the game for one play.  The only kind of  penalty i can think of is in football like under two minutes where you get a ten second run off for an injury when clock is still running.   .

Wrestling actually is odd and punitive  in itself as it does have a penalty on 2nd and 3rd timeout.

 

When have we ever wanted to be compared to other sports? That's how we ended up with no wrestlebacks. 

For the record I honestly didn't key in on any injury calls this weekend I thought were gamesmanship. I was just stating I have been seeing it a lot recently and feel we need to do what we can to minimize and curb it as much as possible. Personally, I had a wrestler who got a bloody nose every match and we were never able to use our conditioning to break an opponent which drove me nuts, I can't stand breaks in the flow of the matches but that is the style I enjoy watching and coaching.

1 hour ago, maligned said:

 

 

Now that the IHSAA has settled into the all-day Friday schedule for state finals, has there been any push to add semi-state 5th or 5th/6th to the state finals?  I know many have proposed this in theory.

 

That's 20 or 24 per weight, Opening Round 3v6 and 4v5 matches Friday morning, Round of 16 in the afternoon. More butts in seats, more concessions bought all day. More money all around. Plus no need to continue the endless discussion of wrestle backs at semi-state. (At semi-state, QF losers wrestle each other same time as semi-finals, 5/6 placement match same time as other placement matches)

This^^^^ Like everything else I am sure there will be holes shot in this but this has made total sense to me. Doesn't "water" anything down. We wrestled for 5th a while back and it wasn't an issue. It provides more opportunities for kids.

9 hours ago, Lat Drop said:

Very true.  I'd say Hock was in an arguably tougher weight class but both wrestled very well.  I hope Cressell finds some humble in his game, confidence is one thing and I know he is just a sophomore but he didn't come off well in the post match interview.  

For anyone that knows Waylon when it comes to wrestling he has a mindset at all times to score points and break his opponent. All the while being confident he will do that. What is wrong with that? His speech reflected that and the question is asked less than 5 minutes after he just got done taking care of business. You think his mindset changed that fast? The kid just went full throttle on a very tough bracket. Being humble in an interview is not be a requirement. Being confident in your ability is if you want to win on that level. 
 

11 hours ago, Jam said:

I say Leech counts as half a champ for East Chicago seeing as he is coached by one of ours.

You just #SETL down. He is fully blown 260 now! 

53 minutes ago, Chris Cooper said:

Watching this Iowa vs Wisc dual and Rathjen takes injury time as he’s getting taken down.  Official gives the injury time, Rathjen continues after a short break and doesn’t give the 3 pt td.

 

Reminds me of one of my biggest issues watching wrestling this weekend.  Coaches allowing their kids to take a time out when the going gets tough.  Weak.  One of the countless things that separates wrestling from the stupid sports like basketball, no timeouts when it’s getting real, you have to deal with it.  
 

Dissapointing the programs that are ok with taking a breather for that mental break when adversity has set in.

100% I made this point earlier this year in a post. 

Doster won convincingly. End of story.

That's about the same time he hit me with a luck slide by in practice. So he was really arrogant back then. Boy, how things have changed.......... 

As big as it is we could do one per semi-state. I would be happy to host one at Homestead next year. 

10 minutes ago, julio said:

My wrestler placed 4th and he beat a Sectional Runner Up, how does that not make sense?  Are you saying a Sectional champion will take 4th at Regionals?

Sorry, I didn't focus on what you actually wrote and read the whole thread. I assumed you were just saying how it is set up now.  

24 minutes ago, julio said:

Should be the person beaten by the 4th place finisher.

Which makes no sense since that is probably the 4th placer from sectionals. It should go off the highest placer of the sectionals of the 1st placer that didn't qualify. Or... have wrestlebacks.

Did we just become best friends?

10 hours ago, Wrestling Scholar said:

I see a lot of posts complaining and asking why Indiana doesnt' have wrestle backs.  And since this is the time of the year we need them the most, I thought id construct the list of reasons/theories/hypotheses or plain conspiracies as why the great wrestlers of Indiana dont have the essential tool granted to every other state in their state series.  Here's my list In David Letterman style!!!!!!

 

10.We cant be like Illinois theory: In Indiana's continuous competition with Illinois and the resulting inferiority complex, Indiana had to do something different and in the name of conservative stubborness, we found a great avenue to differentiate from the Land of Lincoln,  "We wont have wrestlebacks like those woke liberal dudes to the west".

 

9. The Hunger Games theory:  In the the modern action novel where each district's humble heroes travel to the capitol and are placed in an arena to fight each other to die or move on for the ultimate reward solely for the purpose of the audience's bloody lust for entertainment.  Just like the Hunger games, we in Indiana travel to the capitol and are entertained by the Friday night circus called the ticket round where we love to see our humble wrestlers reach immediate state placing glory.  But also, we love the sudden agony of defeat and seeing ranked wrestler's dreams and hope of destroyed abruptly.  Wrestlers, "May the odds ever be in your favor".

 

8.  Save the IHSAA beautiful mats:  The IHSAA has great mats.   Buy eliminating wrestle backs, were cutting out 29% of wrestling from the tournament thus saving our mats for future years.

 

7.  Let's hang out at Tilted Kilt more theory:   Not that I've ever been there, but by eliminating wrestle backs this opens up more time for the great wrestling fans of the Hoosier state to patronize the abundant downtown dining places like the Tilted Kilt (come on, you guys tipped big).  We love places like "Dicks last resort, St Elmo's (love the Shrimp cocktail) or Fog De Chao for those with big appetite.  Even though I was disappointed when the kid i was cheering for lost and didn't have a wrestle back match, I did have extra time and the consolation to sincerely enjoy some tasty pasta at Buca.  The East Chicago equivalents are Portillo's or El Gran Taco.  But Ive heard Region Rat recommend PoleKatz for their excellent bar food and service.  In Evansville, the wrestling community and guys like TripleB  utilizes the extra time to spend at "Taco Bell, Panda Express and Pizza King".

 

6. Indiana Loves Quality over Quantity hypothesis:  We just want to see good matches and not be distracted by a plethora of matches created by "wrestlebacks".    If it has the word consolation in it, then you're going to have to console us from watching it. The winner's bracket is just so much more watchable and cool. Why stymie the tournament with consolation matches.  Is anybody watching the Ravens vs the Lions this weekend?      Come on everybody likes to see perennial winners and champions like Patrick Mahomes and the Chiefs and i guess that other team from California.  But they ain't watching the consolation bowl.

 

 

5.  The biased IHSAA board makeup theory:   The IHSAA board, which has the overarching power to decide wrestling competition rules, is made up of former basketball, baseball and football coaches.  We have very little wrestling representation on the board.  Remember Indiana is a basketball state and those guys get power.   When asked to include wrestle backs, they say we don't have baseball backs, basketball backs, tennis backs or football backs, why should wrestlers get wrestle backs?  Its only a matter of fairness they say.   We did have some hope when the swimming coach on the board did show some interest in the idea, and curiously asked are wrestling backs like the backstroke?

 

4. Sinister Y2CJ41 conspiracy theory:  While Joe Caprino was thinking of ways to improve Indianamat participation and patronization, he conspired this idea in his lair at Victory Bay (yes it exists).  With his capacity to pull strings in Indiana wrestling, and his overreaching influence on the gatekeepers of the wrestling community he, came up with the idea to create controversy and blowup discussion on the Indianamat forum by secretly eliminating wrestle backs in the state tournament.  You notice "wrestle backs" is a common controversial topic????? You ever wonder why we don't have class wrestling????? Just saying i heard something on Qanon. I swear.

 

3. I didnt have wrestle backs when i wrestled:  How many grizzled veterans of the Indiana state tournament post they love the format, and that we have the best tournament in the country.  Even though many were scarred by their bad draws and robbed of placing or their lots were thrown wheel of luck. Its really just a psychological perception to block progress because they didn't have the same advantage Why should these young cocky spoiled wrestlers have a progressive advantage we didn't.   It's just not fair, thus were continually stuck in this circle state of no changes or progress.   These are the same dudes that walked to school 6 miles in the snow and loved it.

 

,

2.  We just arent trying or working hard enough theory!!  Under the current format, we will get bad draws and the better wrestlers wont advance.  But this could be overcome if everybody worked more or tried harder.   If every Indiana wrestler tried harder, we would never have a bad draw.  This is also the same reason we haven't found Sasquatch yet.

 

1. The Ricky Bobby Impact:  "If you aren't first, you're last".   That's the message we're getting.  Anyway, it's all about finding the one champion. That's what counts.  If you lose to the champion, then it doesn't really matter when you lost to him.  You're not important because you're not the champion. See #6 on consolation.   Yes, those silly non- first place medals are just over glorified system of participation trophies.  Why should we spend more time on silly consolation wrestle backs that's only irrelevant purpose is to separate the losers.

 

 

 

Did we just become best friends? 

Every transfer no matter what is supposed to be approved by the IHSAA and gets the pass of the principal of the recieving school and transferring out school. The parent/athlete needs to submit an Athletic Transfer Report that the principals will need to sign off on. You can have a student from another school that didn't play any sports transfer and they are not allowed to play any sport at the new school until the Athletic Transfer Report has been approved. For the most part, the principals from both the receiving and transferring out are supposed to evaluate if any of the transfer rules in the bylaws have either been broken or met then throw a red flag to the IHSAA or give approval. Transferring is very well defined in the bylaws. https://www.ihsaa.org/sites/default/files/documents/2022-23 By-Laws.pdf Start reading on page 96 and it goes over all violations and reasons for legitimate transfers. 

Someone can correct me if I am wrong I am just reading the rules. We have never had a high-level athletic transfer so I can only go off of the fact we had a student from another school move to us and they never even played a sport but had to still jump through the hoops. How people get around these rules I have no clue. But it is pretty hard to argue if there is a legit change of address barring it being some apartment with an address that "receives mail".

Also, remember middle school is the wild wild west and kids can go to any school they want before high school starts as long as the school system they are going to has open enrollment.  Which then doesn't throw an Athletic Transfer Report.

43 minutes ago, jets said:

Interesting topic of discussion. I think we all agree that to be at this elite level of wrestling, it goes beyond the high school room and into the Club scene...so maybe, the more appropriate question is, which CLUBS are feeding into these schools??

 

Crown Point - RWA (Region Wrestling Academy) 

Brownsburg - Red Cobra's ?

Center Grove - ??? 

Mater Dei - Maurer-Coughlin 

 

Just makes sense that these kids form a relationship rolling around all off-season together, and they want to be on the same high school team. 

 

Maybe this isn't the case...just what it appears from afar....

Contenders is huge. You can't leave them off the list. 

Great read. Your story is not an uncommon one. Your perspective at such a young age is rare. Keep at it.

14 minutes ago, Silence Dogood said:

Probably countable times a year.

Then do it. 

Probably countless times a year.