maligned Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 There is no need for expansion of the event any more at this point. This year's expansion was a horrible, horrible idea especially when no venue was secured beforehand. Bigger isn't always better when you have things like date, venue and format issues like they are currently facing right now. We will kill this event before it gains steam if we keep expanding without answering simple logistical questions such as date and venue. I definitely would not hope for any decisions about expansion to be made unless the frustration of this year is clearly behind us and there was a venue plan in place. I'm only speaking hypothetically in very general terms regarding your point about wanting to see a set non-holiday weekend in the future and what it would take for us to get to that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Here is a suggestion(actually not mine) on a doable format for 12 mats and 12 teams per class. 16 team bracket with the top 4 seeds getting byes. If you lose first round you will wrestle a semi-final and final for 9th and 11th place. If you lose in the quarter finals, you will wrestle a semi-final and final for 5th and 7th place. If you lose in the semi-finals you wrestle for 3rd. Round Mats used 1 Pig tails 12 2 Quarters 12 3 Pig tail loser, Quarter losers 12 4 Semi-finals 6 4 9th, 11th 6 5 3, 5, 7th 9 6 1st 3 Starting at 9am you can give about an hour and 45 minutes for each round and have the finals starting around 6:30pm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maligned Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Here is a suggestion(actually not mine) on a doable format for 12 mats and 12 teams per class. 16 team bracket with the top 4 seeds getting byes. If you lose first round you will wrestle a semi-final and final for 9th and 11th place. If you lose in the quarter finals, you will wrestle a semi-final and final for 5th and 7th place. If you lose in the semi-finals you wrestle for 3rd. Round Mats used 1 Pig tails 12 2 Quarters 12 3 Pig tail loser, Quarter losers 12 4 Semi-finals 6 4 9th, 11th 6 5 3, 5, 7th 9 6 1st 3 Starting at 9am you can give about an hour and 45 minutes for each round and have the finals starting around 6:30pm. Yes, a number of ideas, including this type, have been looked at. The two downsides with this format are that 1) lower-finishing or lower-seeded teams have a shot to wrestle 4 matches while the higher seeds are guaranteed to wrestle only 3 (and coaches have expressed that they love getting more matches at an event like this because of the level of competition) and 2) if you hold up each round as you must in this model, it's actually closer to two hours for each round (because 1 of the 3A-2A duals will always be long), pushing finals back to more like 7:45 or even later. On the positive side with a model like you bring up, a true bracket has its upsides and another model like it that doesn't include actually wrestling the 7/8, 9/10 or 11/12 matches (but guarantees everyone at least a couple matches) has been looked at because it can be configured to cut out a round. R1: Prelims R2: Quarters R3: Semi's & quarter losers R4: 3rd place, 5th place, two prelim loser matches R5: Championship (Place 1-6; end up with two 7th place, two 9th place, two 11th place teams) Finally, the pooled bracket format is still easy to follow, it is configured to have 1/8, 4/5, 3/6, and 2/7 wrestling each other in the final pool matches so that they will still function as exciting quarterfinals in most cases (coming in with 1-0 pool records), it guarantees 4 matches for the top 6 placing teams, and it pushes the rounds 1-3 through quickly because of the plan of having no stops on each pool mat (teams don't move around, books re-load fast, long matches usually won't happen back-to-back on the same mat). R1-3 (9-1:30): Pools (3 teams, 2 matches each, all on same mat) R4 (2pm): Semi's & Pool 2nd place teams R5 (4 or 4:30): 3rd place, 5th place, Pool 3rd place teams R6 (7pm): Championships (again, Place 1-6; two 7th place, two 9th place, two 11th place teams) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 The pool format is confusing for casual fans and the media. Brackets are way easier to explain and show people what is going on. We also need to find ways to get this done under one roof and not in separate locations. This event is designed to crown a champion and not to fulfill a coach's desire to get 86 matches in a season. If they want to have a super dual where they wrestle five of the top ten teams they need to go to Bellmont, the Traicoff or any other event with those teams present. One thing that is being overlooked is the top referees in the state are not going to want to travel to Indy two weekends in a row around the holidays. I believe most are human and do want to spend time with family during those times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
julio Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Now let me understand this as a 1st grader, since I passed kindergarten. You sent out the info for the tournament with a set date, but no confirmed venue, and now schools want you to change the date. Now there is the possibility of expanding the tournament, so that more teams can decide if the date needs to be changed if it does not suit their schedule? Is this all correct or am I reading it wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maligned Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Now let me understand this as a 1st grader, since I passed kindergarten. You sent out the info for the tournament with a set date, but no confirmed venue, and now schools want you to change the date. Now there is the possibility of expanding the tournament, so that more teams can decide if the date needs to be changed if it does not suit their schedule? Is this all correct or am I reading it wrong? There's no possibility of expanding the tournament...I hope you're joking if that's what you got from the last few posts (I think you are, since kids start goofing off more in 1st grade). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarlHungus Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Back to first grade billy madison Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 So we are going to two dates because some coaches want to get four matches instead of three. Am I reading this correctly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maligned Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 So we are going to two dates because some coaches want to get four matches instead of three. Am I reading this correctly? I'm not sure where you read that. That's definitely not true. Those are all 4-mat proposals you and I were looking at. I think I need to stop talking... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabio Jr. Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 Yes, a number of ideas, including this type, have been looked at. The two downsides with this format are that 1) lower-finishing or lower-seeded teams have a shot to wrestle 4 matches while the higher seeds are guaranteed to wrestle only 3 (and coaches have expressed that they love getting more matches at an event like this because of the level of competition) and 2) if you hold up each round as you must in this model, it's actually closer to two hours for each round (because 1 of the 3A-2A duals will always be long), pushing finals back to more like 7:45 or even later. On the positive side with a model like you bring up, a true bracket has its upsides and another model like it that doesn't include actually wrestling the 7/8, 9/10 or 11/12 matches (but guarantees everyone at least a couple matches) has been looked at because it can be configured to cut out a round. I know at the Al Smith I was mad that the kids who lost earlier got more matches than me when I was in the finals.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tskin Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 Guys Coach McCormick has been working hard on finalizing the details to this event and from my last correspondence with him has almost everything ironed out and will be releasing all the details in the days to come. I think everyone will be happy with the finalized plan. I am not going to step on his toes as he is the tourney chairman and will release the info when everything is finalized Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infowrestling Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 I have heard rumors........and don't quote me on this, that we are not wrestling it in the Pepsi Coliseum, nor the Memorial Coliseum, but the Roman Colosseum!!!! Obviously not a centralized location, but there is a solid amount of seating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarlHungus Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 I have heard rumors........and don't quote me on this, that we are not wrestling it in the Pepsi Coliseum, nor the Memorial Coliseum, but the Roman Colosseum!!!! Obviously not a centralized location, but there is a solid amount of seating. In that case look for the Bremen "Lions" to perform well. Har Har Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 Guys Coach McCormick has been working hard on finalizing the details to this event and from my last correspondence with him has almost everything ironed out and will be releasing all the details in the days to come. I think everyone will be happy with the finalized plan. I am not going to step on his toes as he is the tourney chairman and will release the info when everything is finalized So everything will be finalized in the next few days? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infowrestling Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 In that case look for the Bremen "Lions" to perform well. Har Har Nice...... ;D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrestler60160 Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 Since that is during Christmas break, why couldn't you have it as a 2 day event using a HS with a Field House. 1-A and 2-A wrestle on Friday, Main Gym and Field house. 3-A go on Saturday in the Main Gym. I am sure somewhere like Warren, LN, Avon.....would host at a minimal cost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soup Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 Karl...you funny!! I hope the "Lions" don't have to go to the Roman Colosseum to wrestle well!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 Looking into the future it doesn't seem next year will be any easier with trying to find a date. Teams are once again going to be forced to get out of their holiday events or do both in one week. Only in 2018 do we get a nice date for the even over the holidays once again. The question remains, should we get a more solid date or stick with the mess we have now? We are going to infringe on events no matter what, so it is time to decide if we go after the likes of the Mater Dei Classic, Al Smith, Connersville, Mooresville, North Montgomery and the Tom Miller Bronco Duals. Or do we go on the dates of the Bellmont Main Event, New Palestine Invite, Peru Super Dual, New Haven Invite, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
julio Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 I think a permit weekend needs to be set, not for next year but 2 years from now, that way schools can start to reorganize their schedules to attend this tournament. The school that have a real shot at being regulars to this tournament can open up this weekend for the coming years, and the other school can decide if they have a shot to be invited to this tournament and can choose to keep the weekend open or attend another tournament. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rookie78 Posted May 3, 2014 Share Posted May 3, 2014 Its been a few days.........any updates on venue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted May 3, 2014 Share Posted May 3, 2014 Having it in a hog barn will be like a home match for Prairie Heights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rookie78 Posted May 3, 2014 Share Posted May 3, 2014 Having it in a hog barn will be like a home match for Prairie Heights. Maybe not the hog barn, but the school farm could hold all the mats at one time. We have bleachers already there for the tractor pulls so seating shouldn't be a problem, plus ample parking because crops are not in the ground yet! FFA could butcher a couple cows on site and have a great concession stand too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soup Posted May 11, 2014 Share Posted May 11, 2014 Any more progress on this topic of location? Is the 1A definitely going to happen on 12/27 ?? Just trying to plan ahead. Thanks for any info. you can share! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
julio Posted May 15, 2014 Share Posted May 15, 2014 Why is it taking so long for someone from the IHSWCA to reply? Just tell us something, even if it is "still working on it." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach McCormick Posted May 16, 2014 Author Share Posted May 16, 2014 Participating schools/teams will be receiving an e-mail later this afternoon regarding the date and venue. I am signing the contract with the venue this afternoon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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