ssloco Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 What are some good first round match ups next weekend at regionals? Who's season is going to end sooner than expected? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeastMode#31 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Are there full wrestle backs at Regionals? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrestlerslife Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Are there full wrestle backs at Regionals? No, if you lose first round best you can do is 5th place and if you lose second round worst you can do is 4th Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeastMode#31 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 No, if you lose first round best you can do is 5th place and if you lose second round worst you can do is 4th Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrestlerslife Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Possible good 1st round match ups at Rochester Regionals 106 Erik Humphrey vs. Darian Hartley 113 Jake Chadwick vs. Josh Heckathorn 113 Austen Laughlin vs Osman Solis 132 Cameron Beam vs Devon Childers 132 Daniel Olsen vs Triston Rodriguez 145 Cody Runyon vs Tavonte Malone 145 Tristan Georing vs Ben Horban Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripleB Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 No, if you lose first round best you can do is 5th place and if you lose second round worst you can do is 4th There are no wb's to fifth place this yr. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrestlerslife Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 There are no wb's to fifth place this yr. Why is that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Why is that? IHSAA determined it wasn't worth the time to wrestleback for the alternate position and resorted back to determining the spot based on the old system of the last person eliminated that lost to the Regional champion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navy80 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 For Bloomington South Regional: 120 2- Brock Jasper 23-11 3- Low TH North 22-5 138 3- Dalton Bl. North 28-7 2- Mundy Southridge 36-6 182 3-Weber N. Knox 35-6--------------winner gets Chambers Edgewood 33-1 2- Songer Jasper 23-7 2- Moshak TH North 19-3 3- Tedrow Mitchel 29-5---------------winner gets Fischer southridge 44-0 MOORESVILLE: 182: 3- schaffer South Putnam 27-3 2- miller Greenwood 29-3 195: 3- Brownfield Franklin 21-10 2- Harris South Putnam 17-1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headlock83 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 IHSAA determined it wasn't worth the time to wrestleback for the alternate position and resorted back to determining the spot based on the old system of the last person eliminated that lost to the Regional champion. Good! At the regional level I found the wrestle back to be tedious and unnecessary. It basically added another hour and a half to the day. If you can't win your first match at regional, you don't deserve to go to semi state. And as far as determining an alternate, who cares? Whoever gets the nod in the case of a withdraw, is going to be a one and done in 99% of the cases. However, wrestle backs at semi state level is a completely different story. There is too much at stake at the semi state level to not have a full wrestle back. The talent pool is much stronger and it sucks that a great kid can get a crappy draw and get put out while lesser wrestlers get to make the trip to Indy. The biggest difference between having wrestle backs at the regional and semi state levels is that half of the boys that make it to regionals do not really have even a remotely realistic chance of moving on, where at semi state the talent level soars and the draw is everything. And for the record, when I say full wrestle backs, I don't mean that stupid crap we did last year at semi state to determine an alternate. That was truly stupid and a huge time waster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navy80 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 @ Evansville Regional there are several good first round matchups at EVERY weight class! Here are a few that stood out to me. 138: 3- Allen Boonville 39-5 2- Dixon Central 33-9 2- Petrig Memorial 32-8 3- Baehl G. South 31-6 126 2- Hemmings Boonville 33-9 3- Baehl, GIBSON SOUTHERN 34-5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IN4206 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Wrestlebacks in first round are not always unnecessary in regionals. Looking at 2 sectionals feeding a regional that the 4 from sectional A can beat the 2,3 and 4 from sectional B. If 4 would lose, IHSAA is allowing lesser ability wrestlers to advance due to a weak sectional. I know it doesnt always work this way, but in this instance this seems very unfair. Why not give the kids that dedicated a year of hard work that opportunity. A lot of padding and cupcake schedules by coaches to try to help get a better seed. This takes out the seeding errors in sectionals and lets the kids determine who wins and not the draw. Mathematically it takes sectional and regional to weed the nonsense out. By semistate the hammers are all there then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigmak Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Wrestlebacks in first round are not always unnecessary in regionals. Looking at 2 sectionals feeding a regional that the 4 from sectional A can beat the 2,3 and 4 from sectional B. If 4 would lose, IHSAA is allowing lesser ability wrestlers to advance due to a weak sectional. I know it doesnt always work this way, but in this instance this seems very unfair. Why not give the kids that dedicated a year of hard work that opportunity. A lot of padding and cupcake schedules by coaches to try to help get a better seed. This takes out the seeding errors in sectionals and lets the kids determine who wins and not the draw. Mathematically it takes sectional and regional to weed the nonsense out. By semistate the hammers are all there then. exactly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigmak Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 138 PM regional Evan Smiley Beech Grove, 33-4, 11 vs. Brett Johnson Perry Meridian, 20-4, 10 Tanner Smith Franklin Central, 25-7, 12 vs. Ethan Briggeman Cardinal Ritter, 26-8, 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ontherise219 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 220 Morrow vs Corman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NICfan Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 So let's say hypothetically a highly ranked kid hurt at sectionals and loses a match, comes back to wrestle in the third and fourth place match (he didn't want his season to end and could still continue) then injury defaults so he can rest up and heal. Goes into regionals and the 1st seed of the other sectional is also highly ranked. One great wrestler goes home that shouldn't. There are other things that can happen that cause a better wrestler to go home at regionals and someone worse to advance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maligned Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Wrestlebacks in first round are not always unnecessary in regionals. Looking at 2 sectionals feeding a regional that the 4 from sectional A can beat the 2,3 and 4 from sectional B. If 4 would lose, IHSAA is allowing lesser ability wrestlers to advance due to a weak sectional. I know it doesnt always work this way, but in this instance this seems very unfair. Why not give the kids that dedicated a year of hard work that opportunity. A lot of padding and cupcake schedules by coaches to try to help get a better seed. This takes out the seeding errors in sectionals and lets the kids determine who wins and not the draw. Mathematically it takes sectional and regional to weed the nonsense out. By semistate the hammers are all there then. Sorry, but if you are the 4 coming out of your sectional and you lose first round at regional, you're only the 5th best wrestler at your regional--at best. You already showed you're behind 3 guys, then you show you're behind another by losing first round. It doesn't matter that you're better than the 2,3,4 from the other sectional. Mathematically speaking, there is NO reason for wrestlebacks at regional unless there's an injury to a top kid at sectional and he has to injury default a couple matches that cause him to enter regional as the wrong seed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigmak Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Sorry, but if you are the 4 coming out of your sectional and you lose first round at regional, you're only the 5th best wrestler at your regional--at best. You already showed you're behind 3 guys, then you show you're behind another by losing first round. It doesn't matter that you're better than the 2,3,4 from the other sectional. Mathematically speaking, there is NO reason for wrestlebacks at regional unless there's an injury to a top kid at sectional and he has to injury default a couple matches that cause him to enter regional as the wrong seed. i have to disagree. reason is you have 138 PM regional first round match ups of Evan Smiley Beech Grove, 33-4 vs Brett Johnson Perry Meridian, 20-4. Both state qualifiers but one will be going home yet that one can beat other guys in that bracket that will be moving on. I would dare say to look at that bracket, which is already open on trackwrestling, and tell me that one of these 2 wrestlers going home isnt a top 4 wrestler in that bracket...you cant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeastMode#31 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Sorry, but if you are the 4 coming out of your sectional and you lose first round at regional, you're only the 5th best wrestler at your regional--at best. You already showed you're behind 3 guys, then you show you're behind another by losing first round. It doesn't matter that you're better than the 2,3,4 from the other sectional. Mathematically speaking, there is NO reason for wrestlebacks at regional unless there's an injury to a top kid at sectional and he has to injury default a couple matches that cause him to enter regional as the wrong seed. What about Brett Johnson vs Evan Smiley? Two State qualifiers both deserving to wrestle at New Castle, right? It's not the end of the world that there are not full wrestle backs at Regionals, but it would ensure the best 4 move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maligned Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 What about Brett Johnson vs Evan Smiley? Two State qualifiers both deserving to wrestle at New Castle, right? It's not the end of the world that there are not full wrestle backs at Regionals, but it would ensure the best 4 move on. The loser of that match is the 5th best wrestler in that class, based on the last 2 weeks of wrestling, plain and simple. They both had their chance and blew it. Johnson's the number 2 because he got smoked and Smiley's the number 3 because he lost to the second place guy. That means whoever loses that match, based on 2 weeks of wrestling, DESERVES to be slotted 5th. It doesn't matter that they're better than most regional losers--mathematically speaking, the didn't get slighted in the least. One of them will have 2 losses over 2 weeks that will very justly slot them 5th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeastMode#31 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 The loser of that match is the 5th best wrestler in that class, based on the last 2 weeks of wrestling, plain and simple. They both had their chance and blew it. Johnson's the number 2 because he got smoked and Smiley's the number 3 because he lost to the second place guy. That means whoever loses that match, based on 2 weeks of wrestling, DESERVES to be slotted 5th. It doesn't matter that they're better than most regional losers--mathematically speaking, the didn't get slighted in the least. One of them will have 2 losses over 2 weeks that will very justly slot them 5th. I see your reasoning, but disagree. I think the best kids should advance each week and this is a potential case where they will not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maligned Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 I see your reasoning, but disagree. I think the best kids should advance each week and this is a potential case where they will not. How can you say they're the "best kids" when they lost to the kids that they'll be put below? Semi-state wrestlebacks absolutely make sense to me because there are so many mathematical injustices. The ONLY two ways you can argue wrestlebacks at regional are these: 1. Injury to a top guy who forfeits his semi and final matches at sectional and is therefore mis-seeded at regional. 2. A very bad seeding injustice at sectional that puts the top 3 guys all on one side of the bracket and the 4th best guy takes second place, thus putting an undeserving kid as the 4th place against a sectional champ. Arguing for wrestlebacks when both guys LOST the matches that put them in the position they're in fairly makes no sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1prouddad Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 @ Evansville Regional there are several good first round matchups at EVERY weight class! Here are a few that stood out to me. 138: 3- Allen Boonville 39-5 2- Dixon Central 33-9 2- Petrig Memorial 32-8 3- Baehl G. South 31-6 126 2- Hemmings Boonville 33-9 3- Baehl, GIBSON SOUTHERN 34-5 Farmer(castle) vs smith(ce) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeastMode#31 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 How can you say they're the "best kids" when they lost to the kids that they'll be put below? Semi-state wrestlebacks absolutely make sense to me because there are so many mathematical injustices. The ONLY two ways you can argue wrestlebacks at regional are these: 1. Injury to a top guy who forfeits his semi and final matches at sectional and is therefore mis-seeded at regional. 2. A very bad seeding injustice at sectional that puts the top 3 guys all on one side of the bracket and the 4th best guy takes second place, thus putting an undeserving kid as the 4th place against a sectional champ. Arguing for wrestlebacks when both guys LOST the matches that put them in the position they're in fairly makes no sense. Still a slight chance they are the 3rd and 4th best wrestlers at Regional (with the two guys who beat them 1and 2) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NICfan Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Still a slight chance they are the 3rd and 4th best wrestlers at Regional (with the two guys who beat them 1and 2) Not possible, smiley lost to the 2nd place kid. That kid will wrestle the person who beat Johnson in the 2nd round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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