Joker Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 They have at least two other common opponents in Davis of Penn and Hartman of Clay. If you are going to nitpick one common opponent I will pick Hartman whom Lee pinned and whom defeated Miracle 8-2. The Garza match was also an overtime victory, fyi. Didn't realize they had other common opponents I know you can't look to much into who beat who as Garza also pinned Hartman. I was just stating that except for the top wrestlers at this weight class she can wrestle with any of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No One Famous Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Why does everyone care about our perception in other states? We can change that by getting more kids to not just wrestle in national tournaments, but do well in those tourneys. She has earned her spot like everyone else. I doubt everyone thought the 126lb weight class was down last year in college wrestling because a guy with one leg won it all. Everyone saw an athlete that worked their tail off, regardless of the circumstances. Keep up the hard work, Kayla and continue to represent Culver (this yr) and hopefully the US well in the future! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NAChicken Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 It's good. Shouldn't matter if it's a girl or boy. If they made it to state, they worked hard to accomplish that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCKAJC Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 This is a really sensitive subject and I'm going to get destroyed for what I'm about to post but I believe it makes a single class state like indiana look weak by having a female qualify for individual state. Other "wrestling" states (I believe iowa?) have had a female qualify for state but I'm pretty sure it was in the smallest class. States like alaska have had female champs but I wouldn't put their wrestling on par with a midwestern state. Sorry, but this is my opinion. I'll probably be approaching caliboy/demoguy/wc182dad for the most boos by nightfall. Everyone can all get in a circle burn some candles and sing Kumbaya again if you like, but I agree. This isn't about the wrestler, 1oldwrestler made that clear in his post. It's not about hate or any other emotion, and to #%&* with politically correct!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Of course she's an excellent wrestler and competitor. But she is a girl/woman first. Right?? The volleyball analogy is a good point. Volleyball is also an Olympic sport, but no boy will be allowed to compete on a HS volleyball team anytime soon. I'm sure 1oldwrestler isn't wishing any ill will and the same is true for me. But I'm very curious, how does this shine a positive light on IN "male" wrestling? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuneFan Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 fwrestler: Maybe I did go a little overboard calling the official a chauvanist but the way he called the match there was left little doubt on who he wanted to win the match. Check out Cosgrove's post. I'm sure he knows more about wrestling than you ever did and he agrees with me. You either weren't there or are from Merrillville. My son watchedf the match on the Web from Avon and he also thinks she received at least 3 bad calls that went in favor of the Merrillville kid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fwrestler Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 fwrestler: Maybe I did go a little overboard calling the official a chauvanist but the way he called the match there was left little doubt on who he wanted to win the match. Check out Cosgrove's post. I'm sure he knows more about wrestling than you ever did and he agrees with me. You either weren't there or are from Merrillville. My son watchedf the match on the Web from Avon and he also thinks she received at least 3 bad calls that went in favor of the Merrillville kid. I didn't see the match, and I have no dog in this fight (the F stands for Fort Wayne). There very likely were some questionable calls, but that is par for the course for semistate. It just irks me that every time she loses, all of her fans rush to make excuses and claim that it wasn't her fault. She's a tough wrestler, but she's not invincible, and I'm sure she's not making any excuses for her losses. I still think you're out of line saying the ref "didn't want" her to win the match. Whether or not the calls made were correct, those are judgment calls, and to insinuate the ref made them out of malice or prejudice rather than simply making a mistake is irresponsible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmsuks Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Bad. In every way. DITTO. When will the first male athlete try out for girls Softball, Volleyball or Gymnastics....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awood2 Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Why does everyone care about our perception in other states? We can change that by getting more kids to not just wrestle in national tournaments, but do well in those tourneys. She has earned her spot like everyone else. I doubt everyone thought the 126lb weight class was down last year in college wrestling because a guy with one leg won it all. Everyone saw an athlete that worked their tail off, regardless of the circumstances. Keep up the hard work, Kayla and continue to represent Culver (this yr) and hopefully the US well in the future! Finally, some common sense... Cosgrove, I wasn't there, but you opinions certainly have credibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushmandonna Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Everyone can all get in a circle burn some candles and sing Kumbaya again if you like, but I agree. This isn't about the wrestler, 1oldwrestler made that clear in his post. It's not about hate or any other emotion, and to #%&* with politically correct!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Of course she's an excellent wrestler and competitor. But she is a girl/woman first. Right?? The volleyball analogy is a good point. Volleyball is also an Olympic sport, but no boy will be allowed to compete on a HS volleyball team anytime soon. I'm sure 1oldwrestler isn't wishing any ill will and the same is true for me. But I'm very curious, how does this shine a positive light on IN "male" wrestling? boys can play volleyball!!! as long as it is a boys team bc the rules are different for boys and girls volleyball! If there is one boy on a girls team they have to raise the net height to what the rules are for a boys team, but it can be done. There are high schools in Indiana that have a boys volleyball team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmsuks Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 boys can play volleyball!!! as long as it is a boys team bc the rules are different for boys and girls volleyball! If there is one boy on a girls team they have to raise the net height to what the rules are for a boys team, but it can be done. There are high schools in Indiana that have a boys volleyball team. Boys cannot play the IHSAA sanctioned sports of Gymnastics, Volleyball or Softball. IF you are going to allow a girl to wrestle, you should allow a boy the opportunity to play the three sporting events listed above. Fair is fair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No One Famous Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 You ppl make it sound like the 50's on this board. The difference is men do not WANT to participate in girls sports. She is performing at a level that is exposing some of your insecurities. If the boys don't want her out there, wrestle her like a man and BEAT her...if you can. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuneFan Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 fwrestler: My remarks about the Miracle match were not irresponsible, they were an opinion. You weren't there, so quit making irresponsible remarks about my opinion. As I stated before, Cosgrove agreed with me and Awood(a former official) accepted his opinion as credible. Maybe if you saw a tape of the match your opinion might be the same as mine. Amen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmsuks Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 You ppl make it sound like the 50's on this board. The difference is men do not WANT to participate in girls sports. She is performing at a level that is exposing some of your insecurities. If the boys don't want her out there, wrestle her like a man and BEAT her...if you can. lol So you say "men" don't want to participate in "girls sports"?? You might want to search around and see how many MEN'S Softball players are participating in the spring, summer and fall leagues throughout this great country... In addition, men?s gymnastics and volleyball were at one time IHSAA sanctioned sporting events. Wrestling was never an option for girls at that same time. This all happened roughly 30-years after the 1950?s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCKAJC Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 So you say "men" don't want to participate in "girls sports"?? You might want to search around and see how many MEN'S Softball players are participating in the spring, summer and fall leagues throughout this great country... In addition, men?s gymnastics and volleyball were at one time IHSAA sanctioned sporting events. Wrestling was never an option for girls at that same time. This all happened roughly 30-years after the 1950?s. Anyone else feel like this is really a title 9 discussion?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
techpin123 Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 To be completely honest I think this topic is rediculous. To qualify for state in its self is an achievement, to do it as woman is even greater considering most general boys are starting and continuing to build a majority of their strength throughout high school. Who says a woman wrestling and beating man is bad or makes our competition statewide any weaker than the rest? The wrestler that works the hardest and prepares the most deserves to win, whether that be male or female. In my oppinion if a girl steps into a "man's sport" and is willing and ready to take on whatever repercussions there may be then let her. If this is a legitament question then there are some people that need to reevaluate and reconsider why the people that should be in this weekends tournament aren't. The answer is simple they were out worked by a hard working persevering female. When it's all said and done the only thing that really matters is who stepped on the mat to wrestle and who didn't when the whistle blows. I wish Ms. Miracle good luck this weekend I'll be rooting for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olemissHC Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 I will restate what i said earlier....If someone is uncomfortable watching her or wrestling her then there is probably a good reason...she is a better WRESTLER than who you are rooting for or she is kicking your a$$ and this is just an excuse... Here is IHSAA's stance on the girls playing boys sports and boys playing girls sports...I find it very very open for interpretation....Again, GOOD LUCK Ms. Miracle! http://www.ihsaa.org/dnn/portals/0/Flip%20Book/By-Laws_1/index.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crownepoint13 Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 Definitely good. This is history right here and I'm all for it. And are we forgetting that miracle is only a sophomore? She's most likely gonna be in this same spot next year and maybe have a better draw and go farther in the tournament. Imagine having the first girl wrestling champion ever. That would be huge. I'm really pullin for this girl this year and in the years to come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCKAJC Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 Definitely good. This is history right here and I'm all for it. And are we forgetting that miracle is only a sophomore? She's most likely gonna be in this same spot next year and maybe have a better draw and go farther in the tournament. Imagine having the first girl wrestling champion ever. That would be huge. I'm really pullin for this girl this year and in the years to come. Actually I think as women grow into the heavier weight classes their impact lessens. Because women mature at a younger age, as the boys they wrestle become young men and maturity begins to equal that of the women, their strength will naturally far surpass that of the women. So as the women grow they will no longer be wrestling predominantly younger less mature kids. Usually this begins to create a pretty big physical mismatch regardless of ability. Has anyone seen a girl wrestling above a 113# weight class against males with much success? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navy80 Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 Miracle placed 2nd and Lee placed 3rd last summer at state.....did they wrestle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 March isn't the summer and no they did not wrestle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charger.dad Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 go gettum kayla....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmsuks Posted February 18, 2012 Share Posted February 18, 2012 go gettum kayla....... Great job Hayden Lee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sarto Posted February 18, 2012 Share Posted February 18, 2012 Definitely good. This is history right here and I'm all for it. And are we forgetting that miracle is only a sophomore? She's most likely gonna be in this same spot next year and maybe have a better draw and go farther in the tournament. Imagine having the first girl wrestling champion ever. That would be huge. I'm really pullin for this girl this year and in the years to come. There are many things that make history. That doesn't make them praiseworthy. I have nothing against Kayla and she is to be commended for her hard work and dedication. However, as I have stated numerous times on this topic, none of that is relevant to the discussion. Did she make history? Yes. Did she work her ass off to do so? Of course. Should she be commended for that? Yes (with a caveat). Is it appropriate? Is it good? Is it right? Hell no. It is bad for so many reasons. Reasons that I have argued ad nausaem. None of the reasons people give in defense make a damn bit of difference. They are secondary to the question of whether or not it is right . And to come back to my original point, the fact that it is historical, or the fact that she worked hard, do not, in and of themselves, make it right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fearless fly Posted February 18, 2012 Share Posted February 18, 2012 There are many things that make history. That doesn't make them praiseworthy. I have nothing against Kayla and she is to be commended for her hard work and dedication. However, as I have stated numerous times on this topic, none of that is relevant to the discussion. Did she make history? Yes. Did she work her ass off to do so? Of course. Should she be commended for that? Yes (with a caveat). Is it appropriate? Is it good? Is it right? Hell no. It is bad for so many reasons. Reasons that I have argued ad nausaem. None of the reasons people give in defense make a damn bit of difference. They are secondary to the question of whether or not it is right . And to come back to my original point, the fact that it is historical, or the fact that she worked hard, do not, in and of themselves, make it right. whatever dude... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sarto Posted February 18, 2012 Share Posted February 18, 2012 whatever dude... Good argument. I stand corrected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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