twodogs Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 I try to keep my emotion out of my post, but tonight my son had a match made wieght got bumped up by coach and then the other team pulled or bumped thier wrestler so they would not have to wrestle my son WOW. I realize I don't know alot about about wrestling but what is it teaching your wrestlers. I feel you join a team to compete win loose or draw. As a coach you teach your wrsetlers to have "character" not to have a team full of "characters". I feel tonight I watched a coach that has no confidence in his wrestlers. It wont happen again next time we meet up it wont be a team comp. it will be individual. I may loose all of my cool points but what the heck. I thank you for allowing me to rant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chambers Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 So you think the coach should put what may be the individuals good above what he feels is the best for his team in that dual? Is he responsible for just doing what is best for your wrestler or what is best for the team overall? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edb41 Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 I try to keep my emotion out of my post, but tonight my son had a match made wieght got bumped up by coach and then the other team pulled or bumped thier wrestler so they would not have to wrestle my son WOW. I realize I don't know alot about about wrestling but what is it teaching your wrestlers. I feel you join a team to compete win loose or draw. As a coach you teach your wrsetlers to have "character" not to have a team full of "characters". I feel tonight I watched a coach that has no confidence in his wrestlers. It wont happen again next time we meet up it wont be a team comp. it will be individual. I may loose all of my cool points but what the heck. I thank you for allowing me to rant. Umm, this isn't really keeping your emotions in check Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twodogs Posted December 8, 2011 Author Share Posted December 8, 2011 That goes back to is this a team or an individual sport debate. acording to the IHSAA it must be individual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 That goes back to is this a team or an individual sport debate. acording to the IHSAA it must be individual. But the commissioner of the IHSAA also made other individual paints wrestling in a team light not an individual one. So it looks like they don't know what it is, but someone also refuse to recognize the uniqness of it and instead try to associate it with other sports. So we are back to square one with that one. Sounds like both coaches jockeying there line up around to try and get the best result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tenaciuos1 Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 I agree with you twodogs. If a guy earns the varsity spot at a given weight he should wrestle that weight to prove he deserves it. It doesn't teach a kid to overcome obstacles which is one of the great lessons to be learned from wrestling. Whatever happened to leaning your shoulder to the wind, testing your metal, and the best moment in sports called the underdog pulling off the upset. I personally feel like it is worse to "bump" a guy or move him down a class sending the message to the kid that he is not good enough to win then to allow the wrestler to wrestle and loose by his own devices. That being said it is a part of wrestling and I accept it as just another obstacle to overcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warrior140 Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Unfortunately, that is why we have to wait to tournament time. Just make sure your son is ready, during the tournament, so we can find why the kid was bumped. Good luck to all, just make sure your keeps his integrity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twodogs Posted December 8, 2011 Author Share Posted December 8, 2011 I have to say thank you for the comments that have been posted. My son said stop so I have to comply it is his sport and not mine. See you at conseco. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charger.dad Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 I have to agree. And, if I made the rules........ You would weigh in 14 kids and they all have to wrestle the weight class that they weighed in at. No moving them around. Run what ya brung..... Come time for the state series, you would have to wrestle the weight that you weighed in at the most during the season. No cutting at the last meet to qualify for the next lowest weight class and bumping out your team mate who wrestled that weight all season just because you're better. That's what I think and is also probably why I don't make the rules.....lol.... Oh yeah, I would also give points to your opponent when you fake an injury cause you're gassed.....but that's a whole other topic being discussed...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hurford160 Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 You know that's how that team is they always will be that way he earned the team six he did all he could. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinl Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 I have to agree. And, if I made the rules........ You would weigh in 14 kids and they all have to wrestle the weight class that they weighed in at. No moving them around. Run what ya brung..... Come time for the state series, you would have to wrestle the weight that you weighed in at the most during the season. No cutting at the last meet to qualify for the next lowest weight class and bumping out your team mate who wrestled that weight all season just because you're better. That's what I think and is also probably why I don't make the rules.....lol.... Oh yeah, I would also give points to your opponent when you fake an injury cause you're gassed.....but that's a whole other topic being discussed...... I don't totally agree with your thought process, but I would like to see a team forced to wrestle SOMEONE at that weight if they had one. In order to get better match-ups or to get a better wrestler mat time we have taken a double forfeit or put in a JV to bump other wrestlers up. But we have never (in the years I have watched) thrown a forfeit to a top notch wrestler if we had someone healthy that could go out. Then again we do not have a strong team top to bottom so it is important to get our few good wrestlers mat time. But that does not sound like what twodogs is complaining about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewrestlingdude Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Charger dad... yeah and football teams should only allow kids to play the position they are on the roster ... no moving kids around.. listed as left guard, stay at left guard... listed at running back leave them there... no strategy involved in trying to get a win... (sarcasm in case you couldnt understand) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimtown 138 Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Charger dad... yeah and football teams should only allow kids to play the position they are on the roster ... no moving kids around.. listed as left guard, stay at left guard... listed at running back leave them there... no strategy involved in trying to get a win... (sarcasm in case you couldnt understand) Apples and oranges dude... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Hawaiian Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 I try to keep my emotion out of my post, but tonight my son had a match made wieght got bumped up by coach and then the other team pulled or bumped thier wrestler so they would not have to wrestle my son WOW. I realize I don't know alot about about wrestling but what is it teaching your wrestlers. I feel you join a team to compete win loose or draw. As a coach you teach your wrsetlers to have "character" not to have a team full of "characters". I feel tonight I watched a coach that has no confidence in his wrestlers. It wont happen again next time we meet up it wont be a team comp. it will be individual. I may loose all of my cool points but what the heck. I thank you for allowing me to rant. Understand your frustration dad, but the coaches job is suppose to be in most cases is to win the duals and do what is best for his team. With that being said if your son is a stud he is going to present match up problems in close duals, and therefore he will be dodged, forfeited, etc. It is just the nature of the beast, and as a dad or even a fan I hate seeing it done, but it is going to happen. Just understand it's nothing personnal just coaches trying to save giving up or getting every point possible. Good luck... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewrestlingdude Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Jimtown I beg to differ man.... the idea of strategy is strategy... a coach can move a guy around in football to get better matchups for his team just as he can adjust his lineup to get better matchups in wrestling... or even avoid giving the other team momentum by getting a pin or big win... don't kid yourself momentum in wrestling can be a factor!! I guess you and Charger have the strategy that you put your line up out there an wish for the best... so it is not apple and oranges it is the idea that a coach can strategize no matter what sport. The Dude abides Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinl Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Jimtown I beg to differ man.... the idea of strategy is strategy... a coach can move a guy around in football to get better matchups for his team just as he can adjust his lineup to get better matchups in wrestling... or even avoid giving the other team momentum by getting a pin or big win... don't kid yourself momentum in wrestling can be a factor!! I guess you and Charger have the strategy that you put your line up out there an wish for the best... so it is not apple and oranges it is the idea that a coach can strategize no matter what sport. The Dude abides The difference is if a coach decides not to play a quarterback or to field only 10 players, the other team's linebacker still gets to take the field therefore it IS apples and oranges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimtown 138 Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Jimtown I beg to differ man.... the idea of strategy is strategy... a coach can move a guy around in football to get better matchups for his team just as he can adjust his lineup to get better matchups in wrestling... or even avoid giving the other team momentum by getting a pin or big win... don't kid yourself momentum in wrestling can be a factor!! I guess you and Charger have the strategy that you put your line up out there an wish for the best... so it is not apple and oranges it is the idea that a coach can strategize no matter what sport. The Dude abides You may be right, but please do me a favor and don't compare me to charger.dad... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewrestlingdude Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Its a complicated case Kevin... lots of ins and outs and what have yous... obviously you don't understand. Dude Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils27 Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 I believe pulling someone from a weight is the right call. If you have a freshman (14 years old in his 2nd year of wrestling) on your team that is wrestling 140 and you're wrestling Crown Point, you sit that kid so he doesn't get hurt unitentionally and he doesn't quit wrestling because he just got owned. Don't get me wrong all situations are different. That's where a coaches judgement of his wrestlers strengths and weaknesses, physically and mentally need to be respected. There are some wrestlers that are 19 years old out there. You think it is fair for them to go up against most 14 year olds? Come on Man! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinl Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Its a complicated case Kevin... lots of ins and outs and what have yous... obviously you don't understand. Dude Dud, Obviously you have issues. You don't know me or what I know so you are better off leaving that garbage off your post. In football there is strategy as there is in wrestling, no one is arguing that. The difference is that there is NO STRATEGY that a football coach can use to force a stud on the other team from taking the field. I know that its a complicated case Dud...lots of ins and outs and what have yous... obviously you don't understand. Maybe you could ask somebody you trust to read your posts before you go making a fool of yourself. I have been in that exact situation. I have several sons that have been good enough that opposing coaches did all the y could to have their wrestler avoid them on the mat. Sure he earned six points for the team but it did nothing for him. A forfeit did nothing to help prepare them for State, a match, even against a much weaker opponent, did. Jimtown is correct. Your argument is Apples and Oranges from what was asked. It is a shame that you cannot see that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formerwrestler Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Sometimes coaching decisions are not always so easily understood. I'd bet there was a reason for the decision to FF to your son. It probably had more to do with the coach's own kid, than your son. Could be age and inexperience, could be previous injury, could be strategy thinking he gets 6 with a pin and gives your son's team 6 with a FF, etc. You may never know the reason. I am however impressed with your son's level of maturity asking you to not keep it going on the message board. Best of luck to him this season. I'm sure he will get many more matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter Sobchak Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Calm down kevin your being very undude....he was just messing with you. They don't get our humor Dude! Like a child who wanders in a movie halfway through they have no frame of reference!! Am I wrong?!?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinl Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Calm down kevin your being very undude....he was just messing with you. They don't get our humor Dude! Like a child who wanders in a movie halfway through they have no frame of reference!! Am I wrong?!?! Yes, Walter, you are wrong. If that is being dude like, then I don't want to be a dude 'cause that is just rude. Anonymity is not a license to be rude. Disagree with my point of view all you want (be ready to defend yours if you do) but don't tell me that I don't understand or imply that things are too complex for me when you don't know me at all. It is more like a father walking in hearing two children being inappropriate. It don't matter what the frame of reference is, it is still inappropriate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edb41 Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Yes, Walter, you are wrong. If that is being dude like, then I don't want to be a dude 'cause that is just rude. Anonymity is not a license to be rude. Disagree with my point of view all you want (be ready to defend yours if you do) but don't tell me that I don't understand or imply that things are too complex for me when you don't know me at all. It is more like a father walking in hearing two children being inappropriate. It don't matter what the frame of reference is, it is still inappropriate. Obviously you're not a golfer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charger.dad Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 You may be right, but please do me a favor and don't compare me to charger.dad... real nice mayor......you just hurt my feelings......i'll see you saturday!......lol...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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