IUBjj171 Posted February 16, 2010 Share Posted February 16, 2010 The South is Rising again!!! Well kinda. Reitz and Castle are really starting to bring it to MD and that is terrific. As a whole all of the wrestling in the SIAC is getting stronger and it will be nice when they start to being titles home Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
getstuck Posted February 16, 2010 Share Posted February 16, 2010 i completly agree (Purduedad).. what is the exact definition of an elite program they want? considering mater dei and franklin don't meet the criteria? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanMcMurray Posted February 16, 2010 Share Posted February 16, 2010 Laf. Jeff and Kankakee Valley are both programs that are starting to become better every year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
back_points3 Posted February 16, 2010 Share Posted February 16, 2010 How about Martinsville, they have a sophmore class that can do great things. It started back with Runyan and Krulik. Also, theres some tough Middle schoolers coming up. And another Runyan is on his way, he's in 5th grade right now=] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abcd Posted February 16, 2010 Share Posted February 16, 2010 I was there to abcd: Obviously, Mater Dei?s program is and has been at the top in Indiana for some time. But using your logic, Mater Dei wouldn?t meet YOUR strict definition of an ?elite? program, since they brought ten wrestlers to Semi-State (one more than Franklin), and advanced ?only? two (same as Franklin) . . . Just the mention by lowsingle of Franklin brought out your quick, negative response. Whose team were you at the Semi-State to support? I was there to observe and enjoy good wrestlin.. brining only 2 to state is not elite, but what team I root for and how many SQs md has has nothing to do with how good a program is...my argument is for a program to be elite they have to win elite level matches, elite programs win when it counts year in and year out...simple as that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
getstuck Posted February 16, 2010 Share Posted February 16, 2010 abcd... Mater dei and franklin both have been able to win big "elite" matches... you cant judge a program by observing them wrestle one day.. elite programs travel for competition right? out of state competition need be.. well both of these teams do just that.. not to mention i know franklin goes to calumet to the traicoff memorial (prolly misspelled it) and that is with out a doubt one of the toughest tournaments this state has to offer... i guess i just don't get ur definition of elite.. and apparently u don 't either considering not a team in the state falls into the "elite" category in your mind.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueBolt Posted February 16, 2010 Share Posted February 16, 2010 Am I the only one that the term "Elite" bothers? I am all for the concept of Parity. I think it makes Wrestling stronger across the board when competition is tough and the teams, coaches, and most of all the fans. Who wants to watch the same teams blow everyone off the mats week in and week out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarlHungus Posted February 16, 2010 Share Posted February 16, 2010 It all comes down to semantics but when I think of elite programs, I think of: 1. Coaching 2. Support 3. Feeder system 4. Expectations 5. Results/History Based on this criteria my unscientific opinion would place schools like: Mater Dei, Bellmont, Mishawaka, Perry Meridian, Yorktown, Merrillville, Cathedral, LNorth, Castle, Portage, Crown Point and FRANKLIN at the elite level. These schools are a threat to make the final 8 year in and year out. A step below this level would be programs like Reitz, Penn, Bloom South, Elk Memorial, Roncalli, New Pal, New Castle and Carmel. These schools often have or will be making runs at team state. A third category includes schools that are building toward state power level or have been on the cusp for awhile but never have quite gotten over the hump. I would include schools like: Jeffersonville, Center Grove, Jimtown, SB Riley, SB Clay, Hamilton SE, Westfield, Homestead, Pike, Munster, Evansville Memorial, Laf Jeff, Laf Harrison, Chesterton, Avon, Warren Central and some smaller programs like Delphi, Whitko, Garrett, and South Adams. Before you all jump on me for the list, I know I probably forgot some and some may argue that their program belongs in a different group, I was just laying out some criteria that I would look at to judge programs and coming up with some schools I thought fit each of the categories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boot Posted February 16, 2010 Share Posted February 16, 2010 I think that's an accurate list and analysis, well put Karl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carrer121 Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 very true Karl I think you could throw Blomingtion South in the top groupe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tilt Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 Lowell High School will definately be adding some talent over the next several years from a strong middle school group that ol' LPD has helped produce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlevito Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 Lowell High School will definately be adding some talent over the next several years from a strong middle school group that ol' LPD has helped produce. And also having Joe as a coach won't hurt them at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y21AB Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 Prairie Heights is bringing 4 to state and bringing 3 of them back next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildcatcountry97 Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 HAHAHA. Hopefully some were just misinterpreting the question! Some of these programs are a flat out joke - if you are calling them up and comming. Perhaps you should post them to a "teams improving" thread. Ha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y21AB Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 Im sry not every school has 500 kids per grade Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pirates rule Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 It all comes down to semantics but when I think of elite programs, I think of: 1. Coaching 2. Support 3. Feeder system 4. Expectations 5. Results/History Based on this criteria my unscientific opinion would place schools like: Mater Dei, Bellmont, Mishawaka, Perry Meridian, Yorktown, Merrillville, Cathedral, LNorth, Castle, Portage, Crown Point and FRANKLIN at the elite level. These schools are a threat to make the final 8 year in and year out. A step below this level would be programs like Reitz, Penn, Bloom South, Elk Memorial, Roncalli, New Pal, New Castle and Carmel. These schools often have or will be making runs at team state. A third category includes schools that are building toward state power level or have been on the cusp for awhile but never have quite gotten over the hump. I would include schools like: Jeffersonville, Center Grove, Jimtown, SB Riley, SB Clay, Hamilton SE, Westfield, Homestead, Pike, Munster, Evansville Memorial, Laf Jeff, Laf Harrison, Chesterton, Avon, Warren Central and some smaller programs like Delphi, Whitko, Garrett, and South Adams. Before you all jump on me for the list, I know I probably forgot some and some may argue that their program belongs in a different group, I was just laying out some criteria that I would look at to judge programs and coming up with some schools I thought fit each of the categories. This is about as accurate as its going to get. your right on the money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrecoCoach Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 HAHAHA. Hopefully some were just misinterpreting the question! Some of these programs are a flat out joke - if you are calling them up and comming. Perhaps you should post them to a "teams improving" thread. Ha To most people, "up-and-coming" would be the same as "improving". You have no right diminishing these achievements by calling the programs a "flat out joke". All these "improving" programs need to do is find a way to sustain that improvement, and then they'll become powerhouses. Some won't be able to keep it going, but many have the potential to. Check your history - dynasties have a tendancy to fall. Look at EMD - either they fell apart or other schools improved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awood10 Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 penn... look for them to take over and get the best of mishawaka next year possibly. harper is doing a great job. but dont count out the way that snyder can rally his guys and get them to step up thanks someone realizes it now they almost beat them this year it was at they place but im not sure it makes a huge differince both squads come out to support at either gym. they have a solid class of freshman and sophmores that couldnt make the line up that will be look for a spot this year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MatChick76 Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 It all comes down to semantics but when I think of elite programs, I think of: 1. Coaching 2. Support 3. Feeder system 4. Expectations 5. Results/History Based on this criteria my unscientific opinion would place schools like: Mater Dei, Bellmont, Mishawaka, Perry Meridian, Yorktown, Merrillville, Cathedral, LNorth, Castle, Portage, Crown Point and FRANKLIN at the elite level. These schools are a threat to make the final 8 year in and year out. A step below this level would be programs like Reitz, Penn, Bloom South, Elk Memorial, Roncalli, New Pal, New Castle and Carmel. These schools often have or will be making runs at team state. A third category includes schools that are building toward state power level or have been on the cusp for awhile but never have quite gotten over the hump. I would include schools like: Jeffersonville, Center Grove, Jimtown, SB Riley, SB Clay, Hamilton SE, Westfield, Homestead, Pike, Munster, Evansville Memorial, Laf Jeff, Laf Harrison, Chesterton, Avon, Warren Central and some smaller programs like Delphi, Whitko, Garrett, and South Adams. Before you all jump on me for the list, I know I probably forgot some and some may argue that their program belongs in a different group, I was just laying out some criteria that I would look at to judge programs and coming up with some schools I thought fit each of the categories. This is an accurate analysis. Well put. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sb25 Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 This is an accurate analysis. Well put. I agree with the criteria but might rank them a little differently. I'd rank results/history as number 1. Isn't that what it's all about if you want to be considered elite? Coaches and support (I'm guessing this means families/school administrators) will change over time. I may even throw out expectations. If you are an elite program, you expect to be at the top every year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theman Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 Mater dei only had one senior on team this year. They will have seven returning varsity juniors plus many reserve juniors. They should be back on top next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awood10 Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 Mater dei only had one senior on team this year. They will have seven returning varsity juniors plus many reserve juniors. They should be back on top next year. they had a coaching change which explains the down years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill2106 Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 It appears that awood10 really despises Snyder. I don't know ll of the facts when it comes to kids switching schools, but doesn't someone at the IHSAA? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theman Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 Coaching change does make a big difference. Takes awhile for everyone to get adjusted I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
getstuck Posted February 17, 2010 Share Posted February 17, 2010 Karl broke it down perfectly.. i couldn't agree more.. and although i read were someone wanted bloomington south up one group.. i would have to say unfortunatly (not a BS fan at all.. haha) that they will be up there soon.. they are a force to be reckoned with for sure.. they just haven't been on that level for as long as some of the teams listed in the top (that i know of)..... so soon.. they will be considered "elite" by karls breakdown.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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