maligned Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 By now, you've most likely seen the posted announcement about the selection procedures for the 2012-13 IHSWCA Classed Duals State Finals event. A few schools may be interested in moving up in class to be challenged by more difficult competition. Any school that wants to move up in class is free to move up to any class above them. For this season, though, the time is very, very short because we will begin calculating points on Saturday. Here is the selection procedures document. The school classifications are in alphabetical order in the Appendix at the end of the document: http://indianamat.com/stuff/IHSWCA_Duals_State_Finals_Selection_Procedures.pdf If your school wants to move up in class, you MUST DECLARE your intention BEFORE SATURDAY. The official DEADLINE is MIDNIGHT FRIDAY NIGHT. Head Coaches from 1A or 2A schools, please email IHSWCA Vice-President Danny Struck at dstruck@gcs.k12.in.us and include the following information: Your school Your name Which class you want to be in (moving up, not down, of course) If you decide to move up, you are INELIGIBLE to qualify for your originally assigned class. You will be calculated for your chosen class only for the NEXT TWO SEASONS until classifications are re-calculated. IF YOU THINK YOUR SCHOOL IS ONE THAT MAY WANT TO MOVE UP, TAKE ACTION! CALL SOMEONE OR TELL SOMEONE THAT THIS IS POSTED SO THEY CAN READ IT AND MAKE A DECISION! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maligned Posted January 26, 2012 Author Share Posted January 26, 2012 Read this if you haven't already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Riesen Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Have any teams moved up a class yet? I am not expecting Matre Dei to sign up anytime soon. Back when they held the national Juniour varsity consecutive dual wins they use to take forfeits at several weights to make it happen. They enjoy padding their stats a little and I don't see that changing as of right now. FYI I don't blame anyone for taking the easy road, but I think it would make the state tourney a lot more competitive if they bumped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Doesnt bumping up in class defeat the purpose of a class wrestling system? Isnt the point of it to find out who is the best school by size? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Riesen Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 I didn't want to say it but Matre Dei is an exception to the rule. I mean if South Adams or Adams Central could stand a chance recruiting as well as Matre Dei I may say you have a valid arguement, but when you bus wrestlers and football players in from all over then you should think about moving up for better compitition. Even football is putting into place a rule where you move up if you are as dominate as they have been. I guess wrestling will have to add a general rule as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boiler10 Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Tttipton, It is obvious that you are trying to stir the pot with those silly comments. However, one point I am lost on. How does taking forfeits at the JV level help you extend your winning streak or pad stats? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WrestleMan Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 I didn't want to say it but Matre Dei is an exception to the rule. I mean if South Adams or Adams Central could stand a chance recruiting as well as Matre Dei I may say you have a valid arguement, but when you bus wrestlers and football players in from all over then you should think about moving up for better compitition. Even football is putting into place a rule where you move up if you are as dominate as they have been. I guess wrestling will have to add a general rule as well. You sir, are an idiot. MD doesn't bus any wrestlers in from anywhere. Drive into the parking lot before school some day and see how many great MD wrestlers get off of a bus. Maybe you could even name a few for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Riesen Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 I must admit I don't mind stirring the pot from time to time, but the Jv thing has some serious validity. Have you ever been to a junior varsity dual meet where a team takes forfeits? Matre Dei did during their national record. I guess I see that as a very low class move and still to this day have less respect for the program for it. Don't get me wrong I like the Jv getting some attention, but to do this in that way is cheap as far as I am concerned. Thats just my opinion though and I am entitled to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Riesen Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 I am sorry to the Matre Dei fans, but small schools do not have the volume of students to produce the talent that Matre Dei has. I can see every couple of years having a state caliber team, but when you win 5 straight titles against schools 10 times your size its a joke to say you don't recruit. Look at the feasablity of that happening and you will see that you are more likely to win powerball several times then have a school with 200 boys win a state title 5 consecutive years. So go blow your we don't have any advantage bs in a different direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indyt Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 I see the problem. TTipton is not talking about the team in Evansville. He is talking about some school called MatRE Dei. The school that I have so much respect for is MatER Dei. Must be two different schools. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Riesen Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 It is like almost like seeing Milan win 5 straight state titles in none classed basketball. One was enough to make a movie about. Maybe you can make a documentory on how you are finding all these wrestlers within a school population of arround 200 or 250 boys. Gene Hackman can play Mike Goeble I know I would pay big bucks to see that happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thornton Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 I am sorry to the Matre Dei fans, but small schools do not have the volume of students to produce the talent that Matre Dei has. I can see every couple of years having a state caliber team, but when you win 5 straight titles against schools 10 times your size its a joke to say you don't recruit. Look at the feasablity of that happening and you will see that you are more likely to win powerball several times then have a school with 200 boys win a state title 5 consecutive years. So go blow your we don't have any advantage bs in a different direction. They didn't win the state title 5 years in a row...they won it 9 years in a row. And they continued to do it with a list of familiar names. If going to the same school as your dad and your uncles and all of your brothers is recruiting, then I guess Mater Dei is recruiting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boiler10 Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 I think this recruiting thing has been beat to death hasn't it? Go look at the feeder schools and Junior Wildcat team success. Success breeds success....that simple. You are right on the JV level. MD accepts forfeits from other schools. It just really makes me wonder with MD being as small as they are and wrestling schools 10x their size (although tipton may have exagerated this point) why do all of these other schools have forfeits? Let's propose a new rule. In dual meet formats, if a school has a forfeit, we will not count that in the team scores. Then we can only wrestle the 2-3 studs on the team and just forfeit the other classes..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
812Fan Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 You sir, are an idiot. MD doesn't bus any wrestlers in from anywhere. Drive into the parking lot before school some day and see how many great MD wrestlers get off of a bus. Maybe you could even name a few for us. Pay no attention to the local Evansville idiot! Say anything about Mater Dei and you'll get banned and flogged around here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
812Fan Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 You have 2 or 3 Mater Dei coaches here at all times, so walk softly my friend! You might think Catholic equals good morals and upstanding christian. Sorry but that ain't the case they're no different than an atheist and will jump on you in a minute! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Riesen Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Thanks for clearing my statistics up it proves my point more. Don't get me wrong there are some family names in the bunch, but lets get real for a second. It is statistically impossible for a team of that size with an equal playing field to win 9 straight titles. Not improbable impossible. The math doesn't back up your claims. Even if you had the best coaches, the greatest parents, the best equipment, and every other advantage I can think about it is statistically impossible to do what they have done without recruiting. I am sorry, but to fill 14 weight classes and have years when you have 12 go to state from a school of that size is rediculous to think people aren't going to call you out. Ps. Boiler its a JV dual meet no one else in the state takes forfeits. Which bring me to my next point it is also statistically improbable to have several kids under 119(old wieght) pounds in a school of 250 boys. To do it damn near every year is a crock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoGutsNoGlory Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 I'm guessing you think they recruit these names like Wienzapfel(SP), Goebel, Maurer, Schneider's? All of which have had several generations go through MD. This is a dead horse, get over the fact that MD has and always will produce great wrestlers and 90% of them will be 2nd, 3rd, etc. generation wrestlers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
812Fan Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 You forgot Wilderman! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
812Fan Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Wienzapfel(SP), Goebel, Maurer, Schneider's Wilderman OK so I assume each has had 2 or 3 kids on the team for the last 9 years? I can see that, very probable! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Riesen Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Yeah 90% is a touch of an over statement. I would say 30% tops. That means the other 70% are either bused in or stolen from other programs like Reitz or Memorial. Again I have no reason to argue with you. The numbers do not lie. There is no mathmatical way that a school of 200 to 250 boys can produce that type of talent on a year in and year out bases. To say otherwise is to spit in the face of mathmaticians everywhere and you don't want to do that protractors can be sharp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boiler10 Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Noone in state takes forfeits at the JV level? Really? Perry Meridian snapped MDs JV streak and as I recall they took a couple of forfeits that day. I don't recall anyone saying they did not earn it or they padded their stats. They straight up won. Franklin almost beat MD this year at JV and as I recall they took 3 or 4 forfeits. In fact, every team we wrestled at the JV level accepted our forfeits at 3 or 4 weight classes....... Your other comments are just ignorant, crybaby stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Riesen Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Ha probalby taking the forfeits for all the times you cheated them in the past. Enough of that though, I am a baby because you cheat to win and i call you on it? You have nothing to say when the facts are against you. I wouldn't normally care, but someone called me an idiot so I feel I have every right to back myself up. So untill you can tell me how you defy all statistical probability then I am just going to take it that Matre Dei admittedly recruits for wrestling and football purposes. I really don't care that you recruit a lot of teams do it I just wish the school would fess up to it and be men everyonce in a while. And that ladies and gentlemen is how you beat several loud mouth cheaters at a debate. You simple bring up the truth and they can do nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoGutsNoGlory Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Actually, the o6-07 team that won state had Alex Weinzapfel, Jake Scchneider, and Zach Goebel. The 05-06 team had those 3 plus Bart Schaefer (another common MD name) and Jeremy Goebel. 02-03 had Matt Coughlin (common MD name) Craig Weinzapfel, Nathan Weinzapfel, Blake Maurer, Jason Coughlin 01-02 the same without N. Weinzapfel and J. Coughlin, with Conkling 00-01 had Craig W., Blake M., Eric DeWig (common MD name), Allen Weinzapfel, Conkling 99-00 had Goebel, Dewig, Conkling X2(MD common name), Riggs, Allen Weinzapfel 98-99 had Conkling, Dewig 97-98 had Greg Schaefer, Mike DeWitt, Brandon Boots, (Boots and DeWitt more generational names at MD) 96-97 had Schaefer, Boots, Schroeder So YES would be your answer every single MD team that has won a championship has had multiple names that have or had generations of wrestlers at MD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charger.dad Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Doesnt bumping up in class defeat the purpose of a class wrestling system? Isnt the point of it to find out who is the best school by size? exactly......i agree.....all that does is make the small school championship seem less deserving because people will always say you wouldn't have won it if so and so was there.....or vise versa, the big school doesn't win it when they would have if the smaller school hadn't of bumped up......so if schools are allowed to move around, why not just leave it as it is and crown one champion?.......i feel schools should have to stay where they are classed at and let the chips fall as they will...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
812Fan Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Good Catholic sportsman! How could you question their honor? That's just petty! : Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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