Reasons for a class system for team state

[pin2win1]

sorry karl I made a typo.... My bad I only have 9 full fingers, (cause my sister cut part of one of my fingers off when i was 2 years old) and have to modify my typing style because of the fact it lends to a decent amount of typos. my bad.

 

But unlike you and y2 i don't cry and whine about the fact that other people have a typing advantage over me like you do about wrestling.

 

But hey, if you are not going to take me up on my offer, I guess I will just call you keyboard warrior from now on.

[KarlHungus]

And that is where your simple mindedness comes is. You see all things being equal that would work. However, there is this little thing called variables, they are little things that upset the balance. It would be like saying that since 35 percent of the population are snow skiers, that anywhere I go I will find 35 people who snow ski out of every 100 people I ask. Now, I know that if i go to florida I am probably not going to find 35 snow skiers, because of variables such as climate, and geography. At the same time if i go to colorado I am going to find more than 35 people who ski out of every 100 people i ask. Why? because the opportunity is there.

 

Same thing could be said about people with college degrees. Each state does not have the same percentage of college graduates. Like if i were to go to Akron, IN.... probably very low percentage has a college degree because the job market in Akron does not attract those with college degrees. Now if i go to a city like South Bend I would find a higher percentage because well, the job market is more job friendly to college degrees plus there are a number of universities around giving more access to education.

 

thats why i said random sample

 

I think the variables you mentioned are at all schools and effect schools equally

 

Thank you however for calling me simplemided and having the mental abilities of a 4 year old.  I will endure these personal attacks without a call for a Mexican stand off.

[KarlHungus]

sorry karl I made a typo.... My bad I only have 9 full fingers, (cause my sister cut part of one of my fingers off when i was 2 years old) and have to modify my typing style because of the fact it lends to a decent amount of typos. my bad.

 

But unlike you and y2 i don't cry and whine about the fact that other people have a typing advantage over me like you do about wrestling.

 

But hey, if you are not going to take me up on my offer, I guess I will just call you keyboard warrior from now on.

 

Welcome to the club that resorts to the whining and crying argument. 

 

You have called me simple minded, a whiner, a cryer,a chicken, a coward, and possibly mentally challenged.  Now what on earth makes you think I would be offended by the term keyboard warrior?

[pin2win1]

Random samples still have varibles Keyboard Warrior... sorry. But if you want me to take a large sample base, i could still poll the whole United States, and I can gurantee you that I would seldom find 35 people out of 100 who would call themselves snow skiers. (That is if 35 percent of americans were skiers).

 

I gave you your chance to say things to my face without any chance of violence occuring because I am a non-violent person, but you refuse to.

 

And somepeople love to be called simpleminded, they take it as a compliment. I figured being from a farm area like Akron you might think simplemindedness was a good thing.

[pin2win1]

Not whinning or crying, just apologizing for my error... i actually like my half a finger, great conversation piece. I own my history without crying about it.

 

 

You have called me simple minded, a whiner, a cryer,a chicken, a coward, and possibly mentally challenged.  Now what on earth makes you think I would be offended by the term keyboard warrior?

 

well seeing as you are simple minded, a whiner and a crier, not cryer (i figured since we are now resorting to making fun of typos i'd put that in), and now a chicken/coward. I have no problems with you saying that. But I never called you mentally retarded. I have never called anyone that, and i never would!!!!! Seeing as my baby sister was physically and mentally handicapped. 

 

Peace out keyboard warrior.

[KarlHungus]

Random samples still have varibles Keyboard Warrior... sorry. But if you want me to take a large sample base, i could still poll the whole United States, and I can gurantee you that I would seldom find 35 people out of 100 who would call themselves snow skiers. (That is if 35 percent of americans were skiers).

 

 

I am not sure you realize the hole you are digging for yourself.  Reread what you typed.

 

You state that 35% of Americans are skiers.

 

You then poll all of American and somehow, magically, 35% are not skiers anymore?  How does that possible make the slightest shread of sense to you?

 

 

[KarlHungus]

 

And somepeople love to be called simpleminded, they take it as a compliment. I figured being from a farm area like Akron you might think simplemindedness was a good thing.

 

I said I didn't take offense, no need to justify.

 

 

simple-minded

adj

1. stupid; foolish; feeble-minded

2. unsophisticated; artless

3. Mentally impaired.

 

Not sure who would love to be called simple minded

[KarlHungus]

Not whinning or crying, just apologizing for my error... i actually like my half a finger, great conversation piece. I own my history without crying about it.

 

I never suggested you were whining (not whinning) nor crying.  I said welcome to the club that resorts to calling those that want a multi class wrestling tournament whiners and criers.  Such a strong position in defense of the single class system.

 

well seeing as you are simple minded, a whiner and a crier, not cryer (i figured since we are now resorting to making fun of typos i'd put that in), and now a chicken/coward. I have no problems with you saying that. But I never called you mentally retarded. I have never called anyone that, and i never would!!!!! Seeing as my baby sister was physically and mentally handicapped. 

 

Peace out keyboard warrior.

 

I didn't call anyone those names. 

 

And by claiming that I couldn't understand something so simple a 5 year old could understand it, you are suggesting that I have some kind of mental deficieny.  That is why I stated you possibly were calling me mentally challenged. (not retarded as you so eloquently put it)

 

Again we welcome you to the club that can no longer defend the single class system and must resort to name calling.  The list continues to grow.

[pin2win1]

You state that 35% of Americans are skiers.

 

You then poll all of American and somehow, magically, 35% are not skiers anymore?  How does that possible make the slightest shread of sense to you?

 

No, do you know anything about stats? Really anything at all? I mean I am no expert but I know a little about stats. I know that just because 35 percent of the country enjoys something, that it does not mean when that if i go out and ask 100 people if they like that activity, I will seldom if ever find 35 people exactly who enjoy that activity.

 

It has more to do with the fact that different sample groups will not always have the exact same numbers. So if i have numerous sample groups of 100, very seldom if at all will i ever get exactly 35 people who enjoy sking. Sample group A i might get 30 people who like sking, sample group B may have 40 people who enjoy it, C may have 5  people who enjoy skiing, and sample D may have 34.

 

Why all of these different numbers? Well my randomness will never guarantee that I have the perfect sample group. In my randomness I may grap a group that has 80 people from warm weather climates, or I could grab 80 who are from cold weather enviornments. Or maybe I might grab the correct ratio of cold weather to warm weather people as it relates to the ratio of the population that lives in such states, however, I may grab the only 50 people from cold weather who hate skiing.

 

Fact is variable affect even the most random of sampling.

[pin2win1]

I never suggested you were whining (not whinning) nor crying.  I said welcome to the club that resorts to calling those that want a multi class wrestling tournament whiners and criers.  Such a strong position in defense of the single class system.

 

As opposed to the club that lies about what people say and twist their words to make them look stupid like you an Y2?

 

 

I didn't call anyone those names. 

 

And by claiming that I couldn't understand something so simple a 5 year old could understand it, you are suggesting that I have some kind of mental deficieny.  That is why I stated you possibly were calling me mentally challenged. (not retarded as you so eloquently put it)

 

Again we welcome you to the club that can no longer defend the single class system and must resort to name calling.  The list continues to grow.

 

Actually i could have very easily been referring to the fact that you have less than a kindergarten education.... And no the name calling has nothing to do with class wrestling, this no longer has to do with class wrestling. It has to do with the fact that I offered you a chance to meet face to face to twist my words into lies.

[KarlHungus]

No, do you know anything about stats? Really anything at all? I mean I am no expert but I know a little about stats. I know that just because 35 percent of the country enjoys something, that it does not mean when that if i go out and ask 100 people if they like that activity, I will seldom if ever find 35 people exactly who enjoy that activity.

 

Then it is not a random sample.  A random sample by definition will give you 35% skiers.

 

It has more to do with the fact that different sample groups will not always have the exact same numbers. So if i have numerous sample groups of 100, very seldom if at all will i ever get exactly 35 people who enjoy sking. Sample group A i might get 30 people who like sking, sample group B may have 40 people who enjoy it, C may have 5  people who enjoy skiing, and sample D may have 34.

 

Why all of these different numbers? Well my randomness will never guarantee that I have the perfect sample group. In my randomness I may grap a group that has 80 people from warm weather climates, or I could grab 80 who are from cold weather enviornments. Or maybe I might grab the correct ratio of cold weather to warm weather people as it relates to the ratio of the population that lives in such states, however, I may grab the only 50 people from cold weather who hate skiing.

 

Fact is variable affect even the most random of sampling.

 

If they don't give you 35% then they are no random samples and your sample size is not large enough.  A random sample is just not just any number you or set you want to pick out.  And if 35% of Americans are skiers then a random sample will have the same percentage.

[KarlHungus]

As opposed to the club that lies about what people say and twist their words to make them look stupid like you an Y2?

 

I never said you looked stupid....Those are your words.  I have said your points are silly, hairbrained, ect. but have never call you stupid.  You however have no problem throwing insults out willy-nilly.

 

Actually i could have very easily been referring to the fact that you have less than a kindergarten education....

 

So you are stating it as a fact that I have less than a kindergarten education.  Interesting.  I didn't know my education records were public access. 

 

And no the name calling has nothing to do with class wrestling, this no longer has to do with class wrestling. It has to do with the fact that I offered you a chance to meet face to face to twist my words into lies.

 

I don't know what these two sentences mean?  But it sure sounds like your getting bent out of shape over this issue.  You may think your words are being twisted, I am just offering my interpretation of your words.  No need to red line over it.

[pin2win1]

Holy cow, now I know why you don't understand anything I post, you don't even know how polls work.

 

First off, when you poll people, you take a smaller segment of the population to try and guage how a larger group thinks or feels, or about the things they like. It would be as if you went to Tippy Canoe Valley and gathered half the student. That would be your random sample. Then figure out what percent of boys are in that random sample. I guarantee you that if you did this 10 times, there would be multiple times where the percentage of your sample is not the actual percentage of boys in your school. Infact, I bet you would seldomly get the same percentage.

 

A random sample will not, WILL NOT give you the exact same numbers everytime. I guarantee it, this is why when you see political polls, they all differ. One poll may show a 40 percent vote for candidate A while another may show 45 percent. But even the polls themselves know that there is an issue with this, that is why they add the plus/minus percent at the bottom. They say that depending on who you go to, the candidate who gets 45 percent in their poll may actually get somewhere between 42 to 48 percent with a different sample.

 

It's just like when you buy a lottery ticket, and your chances of winning are 1 in 4.... that does not mean that if you buy 4 tickets you will win atleast once, it just means that somewhere out there, there is 1 winning ticket for every three sold. Or if you flip a coin 100 times, despite the odds saying you should land on heads 50percent of the time, very seldom will that actually happen.

 

 

 

 

[pin2win1]

karl do me a favor... flip a coin 100 times, and tell me how many times it comes up on heads.....

 

Just do that, and you will see what i mean. Or you could go out and buy 100 lottery tickets, use the odds to determine how many times you should win, and then see if you win that exact amount. I suggest you do the one that is cheaper.

[KarlHungus]

Holy cow, now I know why you don't understand anything I post, you don't even know how polls work.

 

First off, when you poll people, you take a smaller segment of the population to try and guage how a larger group thinks or feels, or about the things they like. It would be as if you went to Tippy Canoe Valley and gathered half the student. That would be your random sample. Then figure out what percent of boys are in that random sample. I guarantee you that if you did this 10 times, there would be multiple times where the percentage of your sample is not the actual percentage of boys in your school. Infact, I bet you would seldomly get the same percentage.

 

A random sample will not, WILL NOT give you the exact same numbers everytime. I guarantee it, this is why when you see political polls, they all differ. One poll may show a 40 percent vote for candidate A while another may show 45 percent. But even the polls themselves know that there is an issue with this, that is why they add the plus/minus percent at the bottom. They say that depending on who you go to, the candidate who gets 45 percent in their poll may actually get somewhere between 42 to 48 percent with a different sample.

 

It's just like when you buy a lottery ticket, and your chances of winning are 1 in 4.... that does not mean that if you buy 4 tickets you will win atleast once, it just means that somewhere out there, there is 1 winning ticket for every three sold. Or if you flip a coin 100 times, despite the odds saying you should land on heads 50percent of the time, very seldom will that actually happen.

 

 

That is called sampling error (+/-), I understand it. 

 

If 35% of Americans are skiers then a random sample will be be within the sampling error percentage or the sample is not random.

[duck_and_run]

Pin2win is one of the best posters on the board.  You guys don't give him any credit because you know he would spoil your agenda.  Everything I have seen him post has been pretty dang insightful unlike you and Y2.  You guys twist words and act like your better then people.  Truth is your starting to look childish.  Thats pretty bad coming from a guy like me.  When you try and debate that D3 schools are as good as D1 schools or when you deny someone elses facts just because they don't havethe same agenda as you it hurts your cause.  

[KarlHungus]

karl do me a favor... flip a coin 100 times, and tell me how many times it comes up on heads.....

 

Just do that, and you will see what i mean. Or you could go out and buy 100 lottery tickets, use the odds to determine how many times you should win, and then see if you win that exact amount. I suggest you do the one that is cheaper.

 

My sample size must have been big enough because it came up heads 49 times, well within the sampling error.

[jcarter]

in this situation, that is saying 35% of americans like to snow ski, a random sample of 100 people will not always give you 35 people who say they like to ski. that is a fact. just saying

[KarlHungus]

in this situation, that is saying 35% of americans like to snow ski, a random sample of 100 people will not always give you 35 people who say they like to ski. that is a fact. just saying

 

If the sample size is truly random it will give you 35% (+/- the sampling error).  I doubt a sample of 100 is large enough to be considered random when talking about the entire population of the united states.

 

The larger point is that Mishawaka is highly likely to have the same ratio of athletes in their population as Garrett does.

[pin2win1]

karl, a random sample is exactly what it says, randomness. There is no method to it, you randomly pick people. You put 1000 names in a hat, 500 boys' names and 500 girls' names, you randomly pick out 100, the chances of having 50 boys exactly is very slim. that is a random sample...... Now, i could scientifically skew the sample so that i made sure i got 50 boys and 50 girls by putting each gender's names into seperate hats, but that no longer would be random, I believe that would be along the line of stratified sampling.

[pin2win1]

My sample size must have been big enough because it came up heads 49 times, well within the sampling error.

 

Or it could be that there were numerous variables that skewed your flip count. Small change in the air patterns, change in flipping patterns, starting on the same side over and over again, minor blemishes in your floor that causes the coin to land on one side.

[KarlHungus]

Or it could be that there were numerous variables that skewed your flip count. Small change in the air patterns, change in flipping patterns, starting on the same side over and over again, minor blemishes in your floor that causes the coin to land on one side.

 

Nope.  Hand controls for all those variables.

[duck_and_run]

Ok if all schools have the same ratio of wrestlers then what is wrong with the individual state tournement.  75% of the individual staters are from big schools and 25 % from small schools.  It seems if there were all these so called advantages wouldn't the ratio be more like 85% to 15%.  Basically all that data shows is that individuals have no disadvantage at all becuase the school ratio and the ratio of staters for small schools are exactly the same.  According to your own data there is no change at all in the ratios.  Thus it is fair and equal for ever single individual in the state.

[pin2win1]

If the sample size is truly random it will give you 35% (+/- the sampling error).  I doubt a sample of 100 is large enough to be considered random when talking about the entire population of the united states.

 

Poll half of america, I still doubt you will get 35 percent, especially if you randomly choose half of the population.

 

 

The larger point is that Mishawaka is highly likely to have the same ratio of athletes in their population as Garrett does

 

Are you so sure? I doubt even another hight school of 1600 students like Mishawaka would have the same ratio of athletes as Mishawaka. Why? because there are many variables that could throw this off.  

 

 

[AJ]

It says they need to change the way they do things.  

 

that easy huh????????