TripleB Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 So I'm way to lazy to dig up my rule book, plus I think it's at school. Arm Triangles are illegal, yes or no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripleB Posted November 24, 2009 Author Share Posted November 24, 2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lefthanded Headlock Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 So I'm way to lazy to dig up my rule book, plus I think it's at school. Arm Triangles are illegal, yes or no? I believe it is an illegal application of a legal move. Like the anaconda choke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solid51bs Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 I believ ethat a head lock is legal when the head and arm are held in the lock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhayes Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 All headlocks (an arm triangle is basically a headlock) are pottentialy dangerous, so they can be stopped at the refs discression. Any hold that restricts breathing is illegal and will be stopped immediately. Because this is a MMA hold and not a wrestling move it is not specifically listed in the rule book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oscar Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 The Arm and Triangle is, with out question, illegal. The intent is to cut off blood to the brain via the arteries on the left and right side of the neck . Carodid Arteries are the criticl blood supply to the brain. MMA fighers know this and will "TAP OUT". High School wrestlers are often not aware of what they are doing, and some coache as well as refs. Some coaches are playing Russian Roullette with this stuff looking for 6 points and hoping nothing bad happens. Big Mistake. Ask the "GrecoRef " he is one official I have seen consistently stop this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thatguy Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 I think it is at the discretion of the official. Most of the time you can tell whether a kid is trying to put thier opponent on their shoulders for the pin or ust trying to cut off their breathing. It is legal if they have an arm but ust like every other move a referee can stop any move that is potentionally dangerous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCKAJC Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 In the past year I?ve been very concerned about anaconda chokes. On several occasions I?ve argued the point with officials that refuse to call it, or just don?t know what it is. With an under hook on one side the other fore arm goes under the chin to front headlock the hand then locks on the under hooked bicep or fore arm(Anaconda choke). I?ve not seen it called one time. Just last week I saw it used in a Middle School match, it wasn?t called. Last year at the ISWA State Championships I saw Anaconda used three separate times, once in a championship match, it was not called and was the difference in a close match. It seems that referee?s need to make sure they recognize an anaconda choke and call it when it?s used. Not only potentially dangerous but also illegal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripleB Posted November 30, 2009 Author Share Posted November 30, 2009 That's an illegal front headlock isn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solid51bs Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 If stopped, can a penalty point or disqualification occur? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 If the move is declared illegal, yes. Illegal could mean an intentional choke. If the move is just simply declared potentially dangerous, no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stall me out Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 The Arm and Triangle is, with out question, illegal. The intent is to cut off blood to the brain via the arteries on the left and right side of the neck . Carodid Arteries are the criticl blood supply to the brain. MMA fighers know this and will "TAP OUT". High School wrestlers are often not aware of what they are doing, and some coache as well as refs. Some coaches are playing Russian Roullette with this stuff looking for 6 points and hoping nothing bad happens. Big Mistake. Ask the "GrecoRef " he is one official I have seen consistently stop this. ocsar im not sure what you r looking at the move as shown is legal the rule bood at rule 7 section 1 illegal holds art5 a says a headlock in which the arms or hands are locked aroundthe opponets head without encircling and arm (elbow or above) the picture swhon has the top mans arms encircling the head with an arm above the elbow is it potential dangerous yes but not illegal and for you guys talking about the anaconda you need to come up north the refs up here call it they get down and look for it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B Campbell Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 What I find interesting is this is now an interpretation of the headlock rule that was NEVER called prior to MMA becoming popular. I have both used and taught a very similar headlock finish for 25 years or more. It is very effective in controlling your opponent's position, prevents bridging, and has never forced a "tapout" so far! If the arm does not cover the mouth or nose and the controlling wrestler does not use his hands to restrict bloodflow....I see no problem. Let's leave the Anaconda in the cage and enforce the rules as written without tainting them with new interpretations. Plus, an anaconda is technically a choke hold, if I read this thread correctly, and at no time is this headlock obstructing air flow. Anyone with questions as to the headlock I describe can get a free demonstration!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JakeandBreighton Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 This is a very interesting subject, and really needs to be studied by the powers that be. You can choke some one out with a one armed head lock. Also, there is a new front head lock where they have arm and head, but there is a certain way you hold your arms, it looks like a normal front head lock, but it is actually a choke. I have seen this several times and tried to point it out to the ref, with no sucsess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oscar Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 Stall Me Out I am not looking at the picture in this post. I am referring to arm and triangle(anaconda) by definition and purpose. Please google this "Purpose of arm and triangle or anaconda choke . It should come up under Wikipedia Reference. Also "Submission Holds" and possible results. This stuff was originally developed for self defense usually in combat for the purpose of disabling,rendering unconciousness or death. In MMA if you get "Caught" you will TAP OUT or suffer the desired result. As I said in my earlier post many people at all levels are clueless. I hope I do not offend any one here , but some morons think this is ok as long as no one dies "This Time". Don't get me wrong here my son uses a head lock from time to time. But never has he tried to cut off air or blood to the brain. NEVER--- because I would stop the match. Not everyone feels the same way so people should beware and protect there kids. I suggest everyone keep a list of head lockers at thier sons wt. class and watch out and be ready to tap out. Best bet just don't get "Caught" Respectfully Oscar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B Campbell Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 If the anaconda is the front headlock type as I think it is....it is definitely illegal, as it's sole purpose is as a choke. The arm triangle when on the mat can definitely be potentially dangerous, but not likely illegal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flightinstructor Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 THANKS so much Oscar, I just completed my sons list of headlockers and we are working the free hand (depending on the respective headlockers preferred side)really hard these days. I think we can tap out on anybody with a little more hard work. My advice to all would be, keep giving those high and low fives and the kid will be tapping out without any effort in no time. I know this may seem rediculous to some BUT.... IT IS !!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 If the anaconda is the front headlock type as I think it is....it is definitely illegal, as it's sole purpose is as a choke. The arm triangle when on the mat can definitely be potentially dangerous, but not likely illegal. If the ref feels the wrestler is purposely choking his opponent then it is deemed illegal. Just as a double leg can become illegal if you pick someone up and slam the, the same can be said for a headlock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JakeandBreighton Posted December 3, 2009 Share Posted December 3, 2009 If the ref feels the wrestler is purposely choking his opponent then it is deemed illegal. Just as a double leg can become illegal if you pick someone up and slam the, the same can be said for a headlock. Are the officials being tought what is used to cut the blood flow off? I know a lot of them are set in thier ways, and if you try and point something like that out, they take offense to it. There are several "legal" holds that can do this if tought that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripleB Posted December 3, 2009 Author Share Posted December 3, 2009 Are the officials being tought what is used to cut the blood flow off? I know a lot of them are set in thier ways, and if you try and point something like that out, they take offense to it. There are several "legal" holds that can do this if tought that way. No that is why this thread was started Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
italianmom Posted December 3, 2009 Share Posted December 3, 2009 Flightinstructor THANKS so much Oscar, I just completed my sons list of headlockers and we are working the free hand (depending on the respective headlockers preferred side)really hard these days. I think we can tap out on anybody with a little more hard work. My advice to all would be, keep giving those high and low fives and the kid will be tapping out without any effort in no time. I know this may seem rediculous to some BUT.... IT IS !!!! Your picture explains everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCKAJC Posted December 3, 2009 Share Posted December 3, 2009 Are the officials being tought what is used to cut the blood flow off? I know a lot of them are set in thier ways, and if you try and point something like that out, they take offense to it. There are several "legal" holds that can do this if tought that way. I've had dialog with several officials over this during and after matches, each time without success. I do have to concede the anaconda arm lock can be difficult to see during a match. I think officials need to be aware as a group that this is going on and watch out for it. The fact that I've seen it not called (more than half a dozen last year) and that when I've demonstrated to the officials I've met with at the scorers table, tells me they just aren't aware that it's illegal. I have confidence that the officals will correct this. Bringing light to such issues is another great asset of this message board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flightinstructor Posted December 3, 2009 Share Posted December 3, 2009 Flightinstructor Quote from: Flightinstructor on Yesterday at 07:45:53 AM THANKS so much Oscar, I just completed my sons list of headlockers and we are working the free hand (depending on the respective headlockers preferred side)really hard these days. I think we can tap out on anybody with a little more hard work. My advice to all would be, keep giving those high and low fives and the kid will be tapping out without any effort in no time. I know this may seem rediculous to some BUT.... IT IS !!!! Your picture explains everything. I happen to be one of many who appreciate the brutality of wrestling. This sport is brutal by nature, all of your greats are/were brutal themselves. Even the moves and wrestlers as discussed are mean or tough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JakeandBreighton Posted December 3, 2009 Share Posted December 3, 2009 I happen to be one of many who appreciate the brutality of wrestling. This sport is brutal by nature, all of your greats are/were brutal themselves. Even the moves and wrestlers as discussed are mean or tough. Agreed, but the object of wrestling has never been to choke, or break someone's limbs for no reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JakeandBreighton Posted December 3, 2009 Share Posted December 3, 2009 No that is why this thread was started I understand that, I tried this last year in the "Ask the offical" forum, and it was deleted! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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