Injury times are out of control

[Y2CJ41]

11 minutes ago, Lawdiggity said:

Agree. Serious question though - could the referee stand next to the injured coach and athlete?  If they are discussing an injury or anything of that nature (examining them, stretching them, using an inhaler) and the conversation is about something medical let it continue. However if the discussion is about anything non-medical (example - match advice or strategy) and they are just drinking water and talking or even just catching their breathe then the ref has the ability to ask “is something injured”. Limit the discussion to assisting an injury. If not, call time and have them wrestle. And I know there are lots of ways this TOO can go sideways. Just curious if this has ever been discussed? 

The best way to curb that is for injury time that the coach cannot attend to the wrestler and a trainer/doctor must attend to them. Along with not allowing water or anything like that.

[Wrestling Scholar]

1 hour ago, SIACfan said:

 

But what you are referring to is calling for injury time during a stoppage. That is a lot different than calling for an official to stop live action for injury time.

 

It is my understanding that in tennis, a player can't turn to the official and call time-out in the middle of playing for a point. If they are injured during play, they have to play though it &/or concede the point & can only then call for injury time during a stoppage.

 

There is a big difference between a wrestler calling for injury time during live action verses calling for it during a current stoppage. It is still against the spirit of the rule if there is no injury, but a big difference just the same.

 

And just FYI, it is in the NFHS wrestling rules that it is unethical to call for injury time if there is no injury. So any coach who would teach using the one allowed injury timeout without penalty as being smart or strategic is without a doubt wrong & unethical.

1.  Tennis has more defined stoppages, and yes they call there injury time-outs after a point.    But it really isnt that much different.  In wrestling a) the wrestler works through injury until stoppage (out of bounds, end of period, PD,etc )then calls injury T.O. b) or calls injury T.O.during no significant scoring activity which happens a lot c) Or its called during scoring action where uninjured wrestler is awarded points if there is imminent scoring  or awarded an additional nearfall point.

 

My point is that just like tennis,  a lot of injuries are called after stoppage or occur when no significant action is occuring.  But the similarity is where there can be an advantage to the tennis player in catching wind and recovering  from exhaustion and/or to change/slow momentum.  It is also against the ATP/ USTA rules in tennis to call an injury when no injury has occurred.  But there is not a tennis umpire that would call it.

[CoachJoyce]

18 hours ago, Y2CJ41 said:

As logical as this sounds I would hate for a referee to be on the hook to determine if the athlete is injured during action. That seems like a lawsuit waiting to happen and refs have enough to deal with.

I'm not sure the referee wouldn't be on the hook any more than they would be if they missed another call. The athlete/coach can still stop the match, just with a consequence. If the athlete is truly injured, its worth the price. To me, it reduces the incentive to stop the match unless absolutely necessary (an actual injury). I feel that is as close to an even trade for stopping the action mid-takedown or mid-turn as is reasonable. 

[SIACfan]

17 hours ago, Wrestling Scholar said:

1.  Tennis has more defined stoppages, and yes they call there injury time-outs after a point.    But it really isnt that much different.  In wrestling a) the wrestler works through injury until stoppage (out of bounds, end of period, PD,etc )then calls injury T.O. b) or calls injury T.O.during no significant scoring activity which happens a lot c) Or its called during scoring action where uninjured wrestler is awarded points if there is imminent scoring  or awarded an additional nearfall point.

 

My point is that just like tennis,  a lot of injuries are called after stoppage or occur when no significant action is occuring.  But the similarity is where there can be an advantage to the tennis player in catching wind and recovering  from exhaustion and/or to change/slow momentum.  It is also against the ATP/ USTA rules in tennis to call an injury when no injury has occurred.  But there is not a tennis umpire that would call it.

 

But tennis players can't call TO during live action - wrestlers can. That is a big difference. And most complaints about Injury TO's in wrestling stem from a contestant calling it during live action.

 

And you are correct that an official can award points if they felt a score was imminent, but I have never seen this happen. The vast majority of officials are going to be hesitant to award points that were not yet achieved but were "imminent". Whether points were imminent or not is very subjective, especially between 2 highly skilled opponents. How many times do we see a wrestler extremely close to a TD or turn but then his opponent is able to narrowly avoid the scoring scenario?

[THECountyFan]

On 2/21/2024 at 6:44 AM, Justin Ratliff said:

It's a difficult situation.  On one hand, it's designed to protect a wrestler and determine if they can continue wrestling.

 

One the other hand, some wrestler's use injury time like an Iranian with a shoe untied.

Saw a picture of Brewers knee at a past practice at a academy the other night, looked like two knee caps in one. for what its worth

[Justin Ratliff]

15 hours ago, THECountyFan said:

Saw a picture of Brewers knee at a past practice at a academy the other night, looked like two knee caps in one. for what its worth

I'm didn't name anyone, nor will I.  I think the rules need adjusted in general.  Brewer is a warrior.  He's wrestled on several of my travel teams.  Love that kid!

 

Just like the Iranian untying his shoe to catch a breather, there was no rule against it.  There is no rule against it but we have all seen wrestlers use injury time to get out of a bad position and/or catch a breather.  I don't know the answer but it definitely needs to be looked at. 

[HornetSloan]

Shame is a weapon. There is no way to stop the finding and utilizing of loopholes and gray areas. The only thing that can inhibit such actions is inner pride and/or shame. 

 

[greco165]

On 2/21/2024 at 4:06 PM, Wrestling Scholar said:

1.  Tennis has more defined stoppages, and yes they call there injury time-outs after a point.    But it really isnt that much different.  In wrestling a) the wrestler works through injury until stoppage (out of bounds, end of period, PD,etc )then calls injury T.O. b) or calls injury T.O.during no significant scoring activity which happens a lot c) Or its called during scoring action where uninjured wrestler is awarded points if there is imminent scoring  or awarded an additional nearfall point.

 

My point is that just like tennis,  a lot of injuries are called after stoppage or occur when no significant action is occuring.  But the similarity is where there can be an advantage to the tennis player in catching wind and recovering  from exhaustion and/or to change/slow momentum.  It is also against the ATP/ USTA rules in tennis to call an injury when no injury has occurred.  But there is not a tennis umpire that would call it.

A combat sport vs. Tennis...

[Wrestling Scholar]

1 hour ago, greco165 said:

A combat sport vs. Tennis...

Well similarities are both individual sport, and endurance and fitness are key elements that are affected by injury time outs.   You guys got to think outside the box