SlickRodz Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 I have never Coached a Wrestling team. I believe that one of the major advantages a Wrestler can have is conditioning. That said, do coaches actually instruct Wrestlers to use injury time to get a breather? I don't expect a Coach to come on here and admit to it, but I am sure someone has seen what I am talking about. Many time late in a match a Wrestler will signal for injury time, set on the side of the mat and receive water, a breather and coaching. Or a coach will go to the table and ask for the score to be verified and his wrestler will get water and a breather. This negates the conditioning that other Wrestlers have committed to . I do not want a rule change to allow the official to determine the extent of an injury ...I just hate this. Also, what is the rule as far as taking medication during a match, example an inhaler for asthma etc. I have seen it and since most inhalers are steroids that do give extra wind, do you agree with this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mindgames483 Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 i am a former wrestler. i went to a school where our coach was very avid about our conditioning. we wrestled harder and practiced harder in our room than most of the teams in indiana and all the regional schools and parents knew this. that is why whenever a coach or wrestler (eg MD) would take an injury time out just to catch their breath because it was obvious that they weren't injured our fans and coaches would be furious. and many times it is not even a question if they are really hurt or not because they take an injury time out every other match right after they had been forced to wrestle pretty intensley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamDad Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Its called good coaching. Do you blame a football coach for taking a time out to stop momentum and give his guys a rest? Use the rules to your advantage, not against yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allchamp7 Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 then why dont they just change the rules and have time-outs instead of injury time for those unconditioned teams, otherwise i wish there was a way of preventing teams from using injury tie for their gased wrestlers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlickRodz Posted January 26, 2010 Author Share Posted January 26, 2010 Its called good coaching. Do you blame a football coach for taking a time out to stop momentum and give his guys a rest? Use the rules to your advantage, not against yourself. Not the same, there are "Time-Outs" in football. There are no "time-outs" in wrestling. You say good coaching, I say cheating! ??? A Wrestler must call for Injury time! If he is not injured it is cheating! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigdanteague Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Not the same, there are "Time-Outs" in football. There are no "time-outs" in wrestling. You say good coaching, I say cheating! ??? A Wrestler must call for Injury time! If he is not injured it is cheating! The lungs hurt when your short of breath, i.e. injury time.....brotha! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlickRodz Posted January 26, 2010 Author Share Posted January 26, 2010 The lungs hurt when your short of breath, i.e. injury time.....brotha! Definition of Injury, "Injury or bodily injury is damage or harm caused to the structure or function of the body caused by an outside agent or force, which may be physical or chemical, and either by accident or intentional." Outside agent or force! Nice try though....I felt the sarcasm! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigdanteague Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Definition of Injury, "Injury or bodily injury is damage or harm caused to the structure or function of the body caused by an outside agent or force, which may be physical or chemical, and either by accident or intentional." Outside agent or force! Nice try though....I felt the sarcasm! The outside force is the other wrestler pushing the action. If the other wrestler would just idle down his motor there would be no need to take the injury time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhayes Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 In the rule book it states the following.. 8-2-1 Note: "Taking an injury time-out for a non-injury stituation is unethical". Coaches code of Ethics "The coach shall not seek an advantage by circumvention of the spirit or letter of the rules." Not a rules violation, but seems to be an ethical violation, which officials cannot penalize for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaMATstadon Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 I've heard that when you wrestle Montrail Johnson from Tri Central, there is no such thing as a conditioning advantage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlickRodz Posted January 26, 2010 Author Share Posted January 26, 2010 JMO but when a wrestler or team goes the extra mile to really be conditioned......it is cheating to use tactics considered unethical to get an advantage. Every elite wrestler in the state is conditioned. If not they would not be elite! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUBjj171 Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 I hate this when it happens. I always took the tempo back up immediately with shots and headsnaps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pin2win1 Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Before the days of securing one's laces, I remember some wrestlers had so clled "magic laces" those laces seemed to know exactly when their user was gassed and come untied. I swear sometimes the wrestler would even double knot his laces after they came untied the first time, but I'll be darn, the laces would somehow magically come untied again, just at the moment the wrestler was gassed again. It seems like every since the IHSAA has mandated that ones laces be taped or secured, that many wrestlers began using injury time to rest up from their lack of conditioning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimtown 138 Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Before the days of securing one's laces, I remember some wrestlers had so clled "magic laces" those laces seemed to know exactly when their user was gassed and come untied. I swear sometimes the wrestler would even double knot his laces after they came untied the first time, but I'll be darn, the laces would somehow magically come untied again, just at the moment the wrestler was gassed again. It seems like every since the IHSAA has mandated that ones laces be taped or secured, that many wrestlers began using injury time to rest up from their lack of conditioning. Come to think of it you don't see anymore breaks for shoe laces, but I've seen complete shoes coming off! There sure isn't any lack in breaks otherwise is there? I have seen this year some of the refs not allowing this type of thing to happen, by telling the wrestler to speed it up between whistles... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrecoCoach Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Dr SlickRodz, You must be a great doctor to be able to so accurately diagnose an injury from the stands. I am thankful that you have kept this discussion civil by not calling out any individual wrestlers or teams. I don't deny that this type of thing happens occassionally, but from my experience it does not happen nearly as much as you make it seem - especially this late in the season when everyone has had plenty of time to get in condition. However, opposing coaches, officials, and fans do not know the extent of previous or current injuries that can cause a kid pain during a match. I still think we should play it safe and honor a kid's request for injury time. Even though my program emphasizes conditioning throughout the season, as a coach I can tell when one of my wrestlers doesn't seem 100% whether it's from an injury or not doesn't matter. I want my wrestler to be safe. Since nobody has responded to your inhaler question... Asthma is a medical condition and cannot be ignored by the official. I had a wrestler with asthma who was one of the hardest workers in the practice room. He could practice and run for hours. But when he added in the anxiety of a match, his breathing would almost stop. He used his inhaler in every match that went past the first period. He would inform the ref of his asthma before the match and would request it when needed. He was never denied that opportunity. He was a smart kid and knew the rules that it counted as his first injury timeout, and a few times he had to take a second injury time (sometimes asthma again or an actual injury) and his opponent got choice afterwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlickRodz Posted January 26, 2010 Author Share Posted January 26, 2010 Dr SlickRodz, You must be a great doctor to be able to so accurately diagnose an injury from the stands. I am thankful that you have kept this discussion civil by not calling out any individual wrestlers or teams. I don't deny that this type of thing happens occassionally, but from my experience it does not happen nearly as much as you make it seem - especially this late in the season when everyone has had plenty of time to get in condition. However, opposing coaches, officials, and fans do not know the extent of previous or current injuries that can cause a kid pain during a match. I still think we should play it safe and honor a kid's request for injury time. Even though my program emphasizes conditioning throughout the season, as a coach I can tell when one of my wrestlers doesn't seem 100% whether it's from an injury or not doesn't matter. I want my wrestler to be safe. Since nobody has responded to your inhaler question... Asthma is a medical condition and cannot be ignored by the official. I had a wrestler with asthma who was one of the hardest workers in the practice room. He could practice and run for hours. But when he added in the anxiety of a match, his breathing would almost stop. He used his inhaler in every match that went past the first period. He would inform the ref of his asthma before the match and would request it when needed. He was never denied that opportunity. He was a smart kid and knew the rules that it counted as his first injury timeout, and a few times he had to take a second injury time (sometimes asthma again or an actual injury) and his opponent got choice afterwards. As I said in my post I do not favor a rule change! No way an official should have to determine the status on an injury. That said, I have seen (and would never call out a team or individual) wrestlers call injury time and drink water, get coached and no one in the wrestlers area is even looking like they are treating an injury. I all so do not intend to say this happens a lot. But it does happen on a regular basis. As for the medicine question I was looking for a "Rule". I really don't have an opinion, just wanted to know if a wrestler is allowed by rule to take medication during a match. As too your comment, you claim this happens occasionally so are you a Doctor or just have a better view?. It does not take a doctor or a great view. Some of this is done with no attempt to fake an injury ....they just use the rules to their advantage. The reason I brought this up is some teams seem more likely to use this tactic year after year. As I said I would never name, names because I cannot be sure. But when it becomes a pattern it truly pisses me off! For what it is worth "I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catfish Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Slickrods, If this bothers you, do not go to the Evansville Sectional this week. There will be a wrestler that has a pattern of doing this. They may have asthma? They may get hurt alot? They may just get tired? Since there will be a lot of wrestlers there and teams, I am not naming the team or wrestler. Just go to another sectional if it bothers you, because they always stop the match and let the wrestler that is at a disadvantage catch his breath. Aggravates everyone that understands the ethics of hard work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AC Computer Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 Both of my daughters have inhalers and there are times when they have trouble catching their breath even after using them, especially after extreme exertion or under stress. That said, I was keeping score at a match several years ago when a wrestler from the opposing team ask for a break to use an inhaler. During the break the manager for his team, a high school girl, who was keeping score told he didn't have asthma. He kept an empty inhaler for when he was tired and needed a break. If the students knew it I'd have to guess the coach at least suspected it, but went along anyway. I'm sure this was an isolated case, but my point is you can't legislate ethics. The inhalers and injury times have to stay the way they are for the protection of the wrestlers. There will always be a minority who abuse the rules. I only hope coaches who teach those kind of ethics are held accountable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12andcounting Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 Catfish Are you speaking of the 145 pound weight class?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catfish Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 Not naming weight class either. It is not about who, it is about the integrity of the sport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinwrestlersmom Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 Also, what is the rule as far as taking medication during a match, example an inhaler for asthma etc. I have seen it and since most inhalers are steroids that do give extra wind, do you agree with this? Ever have an asthma attack? Do you know what it feels like to have an elephant sitting on your chest, struggling to breathe? The panic that goes with it? Do you want to be responsible with the out come of someone NOT getting to use the inhaler , death from an asthma attack can happen quickly. There isn't always time to use it before the match due to quick pins . You act like someone is asking for Tylenol, when you ask about the rule to use medication during a match. These kids CAN NOT breathe(not just winded) thats why they need it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlickRodz Posted January 27, 2010 Author Share Posted January 27, 2010 Ever have an asthma attack? Do you know what it feels like to have an elephant sitting on your chest, struggling to breathe? The panic that goes with it? Do you want to be responsible with the out come of someone NOT getting to use the inhaler , death from an asthma attack can happen quickly. There isn't always time to use it before the match due to quick pins . You act like someone is asking for Tylenol, when you ask about the rule to use medication during a match. These kids CAN NOT breathe(not just winded) thats why they need it. Just because I ask a question does not mean I am for the death of wrestlers with asthma! I am just looking for "THE RULE". I would like to know what the book says as far as taking ANY medication during a match. And is an inhaler a SPECIAL circumstance. I don't even have a problem with it. I just want to know what the rules say! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrecoCoach Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 Post your medication/inhaler question in the "Ask the Official" section and you'll probably get a detailed answer from the state rules interpreters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinwrestlersmom Posted January 28, 2010 Share Posted January 28, 2010 I asked the question on the "officials section " Stripes said "injury time is used". So there's your answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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