Has Freestyle and Greco wrestling run its course?

[PTK-time]

Has Freestyle and Greco wrestling run its course? The last few tournaments we have attended the numbers are low even in the kids side. Without blocking kids together you would be lucky to get 1-2 matches. Is it time to look at extending folkstyle. We all attend camps in the summer they don't teach freestyle its almost all folkstyle.

[2016GrecoGold]

And that's why we struggle to get medals at Worlds and the Olympics.

[bsisson]

The extension of the Folkstyle season has already hurt the Greco and Freestyle numbers.  I think wrestling in a "State" Tourney 3 weeks after high school gives a lot of guys a false ending date.  I wrestled at state so I am done.  I have personally been fighting to get my wrestlers more involved in the Greco and Freestyle.

[Infolady]

I understand the dilemma regarding Folkstyle vs Freestyle & Greco. There are those who say the ISWA is a FS & GR organization This is simply not the case. The ISWA exists to offer an organized program for wrestling in the state of Indiana, whatever style(s) that may be.  There have been many long discussions regarding the style of wrestling and length of the seasons at ISWA board meetings.

 

A history on off-season wrestling in Indiana.....When the ISWA started a program for off-season wrestling in 1978, the IHSAA agreed to allow the program to exist provided they offer a FS & GR wrestling only..not Folkstyle.  They deemed that Folkstyle (high school style) wrestling would be a violation and jeopardize eligibility and therefore they would not allow it in the schools.  This continued to be their position for many years. I think it was when Blake Ress became commissioner that the IHSAA  began to relax their position and said that as long as the high school wrestlers did not participate until they were eliminated from high school competition and as long as they participated as an individual or a member of a club and not a high school team, the ISWA could offer Folkstyle.  

 

The ISWA exists to offer a structured program for wrestling in Indiana. The goal is to improve wrestling...period.  Some questions are:

Do we want to do away with FS & GR? I know from speaking with many Cadets & Juniors that they look forward to these styles because they enjoy something different and for those who want to showcase their talent, Fargo is still a big hit with college recruiters.

 

Should we do away with FS & GR for the younger wrestlers, especially pee-wee and bantams? The season is awfully long for little guys when they participate in all styles.

 

Should we shorten the FS & GR season even more?

 

These are just a few of many questions on the table. The bottom line is the ISWA wants to give the wrestling community what they want. The problem is trying to determine exactly what that is.

 

[RW177]

I sure hope that it hasn't. Being able to wrestle three different ways is wonderful and if you throw in jui jitsu you can wrestle four. All styles help every other style and I think help with burn out. I think folkstyle state should be the week after the high school season and then freestyle and greco should start. Folkstyle season starts November 1st for most high schools and clubs. Four months of hard wrestling aren't enough?  I know after the high school season I'm ready to coach something else.

[TripleB]

Taking away the qualifying aspect for state has also really hurt local tournaments IMO.

[Penguin145]

We need more outreach for freestyle and greco. It helps in folkstyle in so many ways. For example, Jared Mckinley, he headlocked his way through state. Freestyle and Greco needs to be more advertised  and talked about to the kids. Most kids only know folkstyle, and we dont put in thier head really that freestyle and greco will help them in the long run. If we extend folkstyle and shorten the freestyle and greco season, how can be improve in the olympic aspect? We need to put more emphasis on wrestling in freestyle and greco.

The last few tournaments we have attended the numbers are low even in the kids side. Without blocking kids together you would be lucky to get 1-2 matches.

Even if those kids get those matches, those matches are making them better still. The kids who put in the time during the summer and do all those tournaments are usually the kids who do well later on. Those matches are benefitial.

[dstruck]

I hope somebody tells my kids Greco has ran it's course!!!

 

off the top of my head..............

Alonzo shepherd - 2x State Q and 1x placer - Greco State Champ

Jimmy Pratt - 7th at state - 2x Greco State Champ

Jon Clark - 3rd at state - Greco State Champ, Greco 3rd @ Fargo

Daniel Rosbottom - 2x SQ - Greco State Champ

 

 

"If he is scared you might throw him, then your a much better shooter."

[IMAWRESTLER]

 

Who is Playing our College Wrestling Chess Board?

Martin Floreani on April 23, 2011, 2:56pm | More Posts

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5.0/5 (1 votes)

This spring and summer is going to be slow, excruciatingly painful, and may cause lasting damage to college wrestling. More wrestling programs besides Fullerton, UNCG, and Liberty will drop. Make no mistake about it, the damage this year is because of the chess pieces that were played 10 or even 20 years ago.

 

 

College wrestling's chessboard is looking worse and worse. So who is playing the wrestling chessboard to keep wrestling alive and relevant on the high school and college level? It aint Bobby Fisher.

 

 

Is USA Wrestling playing the college wrestling chessboard? Not directly. Why should USA Wrestling be responsible for the Collegiate/Folk-style wrestling in this country? They are a freestyle and greco movement. USA Wrestling doesn't care one bit about the long term sustainability of collegiate wrestling and it isnt their job to do so. Those are the facts without the spin. They care about winning Gold Medals at the world championships and Olympics. That is a big enough job! USA Gymnastics have proven a model where a governing body can be even more relevant without a college system. Im sure USA Wrestling has noticed.

 

 

There was a video post recently on Flowrestling called "CEO Kills College Wrestling". This video got a lot of attention because it creates a parody of Rich Bender; CEO of USA Wrestling. I thought about whether we should highlight it. We decided against highlighting it because it didn't feel right. It took shots at Rich Bender and I don't believe he has the intent shown in the video.

 

 

However, I did find that the video has some element of truth to it. The main one is the over reaching relationship that USA Wrestling has with the NWCA. I say "over reaching" because their missions are truly different and at times can be conflicting. USA Wrestling has a job to do: Produce Olympic and World Champions.

 

 

A clear example of this USA Wrestling influence is to have women's College Wrestling be freestyle. This decision was made because of the influence USA Wrestling has with the NWCA. It isnt about expanding and preserving collegiate wrestling its about building Olympic and World Champions. Its a piece on the chessboard that USA Wrestling has gotten through their influence over the NWCA.

 

 

In what other successful collegiate sports are the rules so different for men and women where the sport arguably becomes two different sports? None. Why would the NWCA want to create a whole other college infrastructure for women wrestling? It doesnt make economic sense. You lose momentum with the women's initiative from day one. Its like a drag on the whole movement. You need different mats, referees and scoring system. Furthermore fans and administrators are going to be perplexed at the different sports. It also doesnt flow with the high school wrestling. Why not use the infrastructure in place for men that already works? The obvious answer is because USA Wrestling bought their influence. Can you blame USA Wrestling? They are doing what is in their best interest, to build World and Olympic Champions. Can you blame the NWCA? Absolutely. They need to go to rehab and get off the crack.

 

 

The point of the blog post is to clarify roles and positions not argue over Women's rules on the collegiate level. That is simply example where USA Wrestling's over reaching influence impacts the NWCAs choices. There are plenty of other examples. USA Wrestling's interest is NOT in collegiate or folk-style wrestling. If it was it would be financially supporting colleges across the country every year with hard cash like Myway is doing in Michigan. I would argue that USA Wrestling leverages off of the folk-style movement to fulfill their mission. Why? Because the folk-style movement has a lot of infrastructure that USA Wrestling does not have. Can you blame them? They are trying to do everything it takes to fulfill their mission.

 

 

USA Wrestling cant be responsible for the destruction of college wrestling. They can only be responsible for creating or not creating World and Olympic Champions. (They did horrible in the last World Championships so they got a lot of pressure on them, lets hope we get better results this year.) So when a college program is dropped the wrestling community shouldn't be looking to USA Wrestling for support....and that goes for the NWCA as well.

 

 

[Hutt]

This is my son's 1st year. He is a pee-wee and I will say it has been a long year but we have enjoyed it.  We have been to some folkstyle tournaments that don't have a good number of kid or in our class. I say keep the schedule the same we need all three.

[dstruck]

A Call to Our Wrestling Community

By Steve Fraser

May 2, 2011

 

The 2011 NCAA Championships in Philadelphia were fantastic. While enjoying this year?s close team race between Penn State, Cornell and Iowa, I was struck by how much talent we have in the USA. The competition was fierce among the many tough and skilled athletes.

 

As national Greco-Roman coach for our U.S. team I could not help but think how we might capture this great wrestling talent and turn it into Olympic gold medals. I sat in the crowded Wells Fargo Center thinking about how we can help many of these wrestlers go on to the biggest sporting event in the world? the Olympic Games. My thoughts were, ?why do so many of these great athletes end their wrestling careers after college? Why are there so few wrestlers that go on and compete in the two Olympic styles, Greco-Roman and freestyle??

 

The Olympics! Without a doubt the Olympic Games are the most prestigious sporting event on the planet.

 

You think winning the NCAA Wrestling Championships is a thrill?! Think about the title, ?Olympic Champion.? I can tell you it is the thrill of all thrills! Winning a medal in the Olympic Games or a World Championship is the ultimate high.

 

Even the big money professional athletes realize how special the Olympic Games are. That is why so many famous pro-tennis players and pro-basketball players try so hard to compete in the Olympics.

 

So what is it ? with our sport? Why does it seem so difficult for the wrestling community to get together and work toward a common goal of creating a wrestling country that promotes all three styles of wrestling? folkstyle, freestyle and Greco-Roman?

 

Am I wrong when I imagine that ?all? wrestling people in the USA feel proud when our country does well in world and Olympic competition? Don?t middle and high school folkstyle coaches walk a bit taller when they see the U.S. wrestlers winning these medals?

 

I get the fact that the three styles of wrestling in the USA have vastly different rules. But still?. it is wrestling! And the fact is - the wrestlers that wrestle and learn all three styles actually do better in high school and college wrestling than the athletes that specialize just in folkstyle.

 

For our country to win Olympic and world medals it takes a unified nation. It takes an organized and interrelated approach to guide and develop our talent. As the Greco coach I can tell you that we need help. We need a lot of help from our youth coaches throughout America. We need young wrestlers getting more experience and learning Greco and freestyle skills early in their careers. We need more kids wrestling Greco and freestyle in the spring and summer - throughout their high school and college years.

 

Why not? We are a smart country. We can surely figure out this dilemma.

 

These days more and more wrestlers are wrestling folkstyle year-round and do not experience Greco or freestyle at all. I submit that this is a huge problem, a problem that all wrestling enthusiasts, coaches and athletes will regret down the road.  You don?t have to be a brain surgeon to figure out that this system is not helping our nation?s Olympic effort.

 

It is frightening how few Greco wrestlers we have coming up through the youth ranks. It is amazing how well we have been able to do world-wide considering this fact.

 

In 2007 Greco-Roman actually won the World Team Title. In the last four Olympic Games the U.S. Greco team has won more Olympic medals than every country in the world, except for Russia.

 

Just think if we had a U.S. system that better developed Greco-Roman and freestyle wrestlers. I am telling you we would be beating the Russians consistently.

 

Agree or disagree? I would love to hear your comments, ideas and/or suggestions regarding our nation?s international wrestling effort. Please email me at sfraser@usawrestling.org.

 

As always?Let?s expect to win, in all styles of wrestling!