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IHSAA High School Women's Wrestling

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Here you go!!  Share your opinions of Women Wrestling in High School.  The poll is to determine what people feel about women's wrestling in High School.  Should they have their own State tournament and division now?  All the way to the opinion that there should not be women wrestling in High School.

 

Vote as many times as you want.  Share your thoughts!!

 

Darren Strub

ISWA Women's Director

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I believe that there should be a seperate womens division. But if a school doesn't have a female team then the girls should be allowed to wrestle on the guys team!

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build it and they will come....lots of girls have intrest, but won't wrestle the boys....start it now,  every year it will grow more and more....on the above note, a girl's gottta do what a girl's gotta do....so those not in favor of girls wrestling boys, make the IHSAA come around

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Funny cdpd8b... I said the same thing on the high school board.  Build it and they will come.  I agree 100%.  If it's available, I think girls will flock. 

 

There has been increased girl's participation in the youth divisions, I have definitely noticed that.  And... I have had several parents tell me about their girls' desires to wrestle... but then I never see those girls actually go out for their school's team.  I am sure it is intimidating for girls, especially beginner wrestlers, to come onto a team full of boys, many of whom have been wrestling since they were wearing diapers.

 

Texas and Hawaii (and maybe one other state) have women's division wrestling, and their programs have become very successful and respected.  I don't know about the numbers in Hawaii, but Texas has over 150 women's teams in their high school, with full season competitions, and sanctioned state tournaments.  Gotta love that!

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Hawaii has a large number of teams, not quite 150.  Don't forget about California and Oregon having women's HS teams.  Our model program should be closer to that of Tennessee.  They have a state sponsored state tournament and women's programs, but on a small scale.  They ARE taking the outlook of build it and they will come.  I have just spoke with a coach of women wrestlers in Tennessee and they had just 3 last year and now she will have 6 this year with the first 3 returning. 

 

I don't think anyone is asking for a massive overhaul or changing of the structure, just allowing women's teams would do it.  Most meets and tournaments for men have numerous teams involved.  If just a third of these programs had some women competing as a team, there would be an opportunity for a good women's meet during every men's meet.  There would not be any need for additional travel or necessarily even coaches. 

 

Darren Strub

ISWA Women's Director

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ok....this brings out the very opinionated personality I have....I would like to see it start now....and yes, its a very bias opinion due to having only 2 seasons left for my daughter and have to wait 15 years for my granddaughter to be of age..lol.. I believe since there is a small percentage of female wrestlers in the state, that throwing a few extra matches under the lights at Conseco couldn't be that big of a burden for these girls to take a State Championship at their respective weights....against their own gender....these girls work hard and overcome alot of adversity just to be on high school teams  let alone just to wrestle and deserve the chance to experience what their male counterparts have the opportunity to do (Wrestle under the lights at Conseco).  This would also be a great way of promoting girls wrestling as there are alot of sisters, cousins, "Mat Maid's" (respectfully of course) that would love to wrestle, but would never wrestle with boys...Eventually, I think it would grow to where the girls would have their own venue....Especially if it was something that a girl could letter in...just like girls basketball, swimming ect ect.....This is a sport, just as any other, that is "In the blood" (I was never a swimmer...and basketball courts where really made for setting downwrestling mats IMHO.).....I find it ridiculous that in order for a girl to become a "STATE" champion, she has to go to a club tourney, pay a fee and hope that another female show's up at her weight....usually, they have to be in "blocked" weights cause the participation is so small....and to be honest, the chances of a girl making it to Conseco wrestling against their male counterparts is slim....it has happened in other states, but its usually at the lower weights.  Does this make the girls any less a good/great wrestler...no.....just circumstances are different.  And before I hear about the above comment on club tourney's, I whole heartedly  support the ISWA for all they do (I luv ya guys/gals) and also Kent Bailo for all the effort he has put in Nationally to promote girls wrestling... but these girls are on high school teams and should have this opportunity regardless of club.  Girls have a future in wrestling. More and more colleges are starting womens teams and now is a recognized sport in the Olympic's..(female ski jumping isn't yet recognized by the committee and thats been around forever).  Why would the IHSAA not want to be a leader in producing some of the best female wrestlers as we do with male wrestlers???????  For my last word (probably not...but it sounds good)  There is no time like the present to get this party started.....

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ok....this brings out the very opinionated personality I have....I would like to see it start now....and yes, its a very bias opinion due to having only 2 seasons left for my daughter and have to wait 15 years for my granddaughter to be of age..lol.. I believe since there is a small percentage of female wrestlers in the state, that throwing a few extra matches under the lights at Conseco couldn't be that big of a burden for these girls to take a State Championship at their respective weights....against their own gender....these girls work hard and overcome alot of adversity just to be on high school teams  let alone just to wrestle and deserve the chance to experience what their male counterparts have the opportunity to do (Wrestle under the lights at Conseco).  This would also be a great way of promoting girls wrestling as there are alot of sisters, cousins, "Mat Maid's" (respectfully of course) that would love to wrestle, but would never wrestle with boys...Eventually, I think it would grow to where the girls would have their own venue....Especially if it was something that a girl could letter in...just like girls basketball, swimming ect ect.....This is a sport, just as any other, that is "In the blood" (I was never a swimmer...and basketball courts where really made for setting downwrestling mats IMHO.).....I find it ridiculous that in order for a girl to become a "STATE" champion, she has to go to a club tourney, pay a fee and hope that another female show's up at her weight....usually, they have to be in "blocked" weights cause the participation is so small....and to be honest, the chances of a girl making it to Conseco wrestling against their male counterparts is slim....it has happened in other states, but its usually at the lower weights.  Does this make the girls any less a good/great wrestler...no.....just circumstances are different.   And before I hear about the above comment on club tourney's, I whole heartedly  support the ISWA for all they do (I luv ya guys/gals) and also Kent Bailo for all the effort he has put in Nationally to promote girls wrestling... but these girls are on high school teams and should have this opportunity regardless of club.  Girls have a future in wrestling. More and more colleges are starting womens teams and now is a recognized sport in the Olympic's..(female ski jumping isn't yet recognized by the committee and thats been around forever).  Why would the IHSAA not want to be a leader in producing some of the best female wrestlers as we do with male wrestlers???????  For my last word (probably not...but it sounds good)  There is no time like the present to get this party started.....

I agree totally! I have a daughter that wrestles and she would do anything to wrestle at State when she is in high school!

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I to have to agree that there should be a seperation of the boy and girls at the highschool level. But also I think that if a girl is able to and is willing she should be allowed to compete in both. There are some of the girls that I have watched at the ISWA state meets that have done VERY well with the boys and lets face it we ALL enjoy it when a girl is able to place high in those meets. ;D

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I have had some people say to me that my daughter should be wrestling girls not boys(mostly in other states), but there isn't a lot of opportunity for her to wrestle girls here in Indiana.  If there were the competition in the girls division like in the boys then i know she would be fine with that, but theres not.  We enter any girls divisions that we can find, but again there isn't but very few girls.  Ex: went to Border Wars nationals the last 2 years and entered both boys and girls and for $20.00 she got to wrestle 1 girl.  Went to Tulsa this past weekend and only 5  girls out of 1300 competed and Demi was one of them.  We just figure she will keep wrestling boys and by the time she is in high school there will be a girls division if not she will already be used to wrestling the boys.  I think it would be very exciting to get more girls involvement in ISWA.

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Okay... I hope Sarah doesn't mind me throwin' her name in... but since I have such a HUGE respect for her as a wrestler, I hope she'll forgive me.

 

Since my son is in a lower weight class, he has had more than his fair share of opportunities to wrestle girls.  The first time, he was SO SO SO nervous.  His first female opponent was Sarah Schletweg from Rushville.  (Sorry about the spelling.)  AWESOME wrestler.  Now, if you've ever seen Sarah, she obviously takes wrestling very seriously.  You could tell tell she put in her time at the gym to muscle up those arms of hers, to compensate for any perceived weakness in her upper body, compared to her male counterparts.  Sarah was definitely intimidating.  She did look like she could whoop my boy's butt! 

 

The boys on my son's wrestling team started to give him a hard time... One kid even told him, "If you lose, I'll start bringing your meals out to you in the woods, because that's where you're gonna have to move after this!"  I imagine she's sent quite a few boys to live in the woods, because she was a Regional Qualfier @ 103 last year.

 

At any rate, my son did end up winning that match, but it wasn't without a huge sigh of relief.  He was genuinely scared he would have to give up wrestling if he lost. 

 

Since then, he's wrestled several other females, and doesn't get nervous any more.  He's learned for the most part, to treat them like any other wrestler.  He's even bloodied some of their noses.  In his mind, and in my mind, if a girl goes out on the mat to wrestle boys, she knows what she's getting into.  My son was once asked by a coach to take it easy on  one of his female wrestlers.  I am sure Andrew smiled in reassurance, but in his head, he probably thought, "Not likely."  You may get some male wrestlers who take it easy, but not often.  Their pride is at stake. 

 

Now that's not to say my boy is brutal to the females he is wrestling.  Just like anyone else, he can tell w/in a few minutes, what level of wrestler he's been matched up with.  I have actually see him gently place his female opponent on the mat in a "slam".  It was kind of humorous.  But, for all I know... it may have been humiliating for his opponent that he exercised so much caution.

 

Anyway... the point of my story is this... to Demi's Mom.  People who think that girls should ONLY wrestle girls are probably concerned about a couple things:  1) the bruised ego of the boy who loses 2) the girl getting hurt and 3) hands being placed in embarrassing places.  Here's my answer to those three things 1) the boy needs to spend more time wrestling year round so he won't get beat  2) the girl could just as easily get hurt wrestling other girls... after all boys get hurt wrestling other boys... and 3)  Get over it.  Why is it any less embarrassing to execute a crotch lift on a guy?  I'm just sayin'!

 

As I've said before... I have no problem w/ females wrestling on boys teams, but I would like to at some point, see a high school women's division.  I too think it would be nice to see the girl's experience the same kind of rewards (state level accolades and recognition) that the boys get.  I definitely think there would be a lot more interest from the girls if the opportunity were made available.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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WeeMom it is funny that you bring up some of those points because we have encountered some boys that have been in the same position as your son. First I want to give your son credit it sounds like he had learned about sportsmanship.  When it is a team mate that is doing the razing we as parents just have to assure our children that it is going to be ok no matter the outcome. I myself just have to laugh sometimes at them because of how much they get carreied away with it.

 

We have had only one problem so far but it was with a coach that was being even more nasty with his comments to his wrestler about having to get on the mat with my daughter. The coach went as far as telling him that he would be cut from the team if he lost to the girl (outstanding sportsmanship). But anyways when they started the boy wasnt exactly sure what he was going to do with her then the coach started to yell as we all do and then the boy just picked her up and threw her across the mat. Yeah gotta love free style anyways the ref stopped the match as soon as the boy touch her cuz he was just as amazed that it has happened. The other coach then told her after the match that she need to go and find something else to do and stay off the mat and you can just guess where that went with me and him. But thankfully when we had to wrestle this same boy at state he did not have his coach but he had his father that had told him to just wrestle the girl and not do any fancy stuff and she did have chance until the second period where she made a couple mistakes.

 

My point is the girls know that they will be treated the same as the boys but when there are some of the coachs that put undue pressure on the boys then I feel it is a no win for either of them. Please dont miss understand I do not have a problem with the boys treating the girls like another boy but just when you see the boys get ruffer with the girls because they can or thay are being told to by their coach. Yes it is the sport and yes they are out there to win. But if they all (boys and girls) dont learn sportsmanship then what are they learning??

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I officiated a match saturday where a young lady from Daleville showed that she belongs in the sport.  She was very tough and did win a few at least the match I did.  She pinned her opponent.  I was impressed with her technique and strength.

 

 

 

 

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I received word back today from the IHSWCA with an official interpretation of where Women's wrestling stands in Indiana with the IHSAA.  I am currently seeking more information, but read it for yourselves and see what you think.

 

Darren Strub

ISWA Women's Director

iswawmnsdirector@aol.com

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Thank you for the information regarding female wrestling in Indiana.  As you are aware, the IHSAA has provisions within the by-laws to allow female wrestlers to participate with male wrestlers in the sport of wrestling.  The by-laws also provide that when the membership has at least 50% of the members actively participating in a sport and a tournament series is proposed, the Association has the ability to add a sport.  In essence, this is what would have to occur to have an exclusive female wrestling program sponsored by the Association.

 

I look forward to any information the IHSWCA can collect to ascertain the actual number of female wrestlers and the number of schools that field female wrestlers.

 

Sincerely,

 

Bobby Cox

Assistant Commissioner

Indiana High School Athletic Association, Inc.

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So does that mean that 50% of the IHSAA member schools have to have active female wrestler participation before they will add a State Tournament? 

 

This doesn't seem to say anything about whether we can field all female teams or not.

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It isn't very specific.  I have requested documentation of the by-laws.  Something more specific would help considerably.  There has to be something in between where it stands now and requiring 50% participation and proposed tournament series.  When I get more info. I will post it.

 

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Thanks for the information and link for the by-laws!!

 

I believe I located the section that Mr. Cox is referencing.  The page number is 15 and reference 1-3.  Read it for yourselves and let me know how everyone interprets this.

 

Thanks!!

 

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From the regs:

 

Rule 1-2:  "The following sports are recognized and regulated: Boys ? baseball, basketball, cross country, football,

golf, soccer, swimming, tennis, track and field, wrestling; Girls ? basketball, cross country, golf,

gymnastics, soccer, softball, swimming, tennis, track and field, volleyball.

Rule 1-3:

A championship tournament series will be provided at such time as 50% of the total, full membership

schools are participating in that sport at the same time of the year and it is recommended by the

Commissioner.

NOTE: Applies only to those sports not listed as recognized and regulated in Rule 1-2.

 

According to my interpretation, this reg only applies to IHSAA supporting a State Tournament for girls.  Since Girls wrestling is not a IHSAA regulated sport, we would have to have 50% of schools participating in girls wrestling. 

 

I would assume that Women's Wrestling would be treated just like any other sport (rugby, lacrosse, etc) that is not sanctioned by IHSAA.  Once 50% of the IHSAA members schools are supporting women's wrestling, then IHSAA would sanction a women's tournament, regardless of whether or not IHSAA has actually sanctioned women's wrestling as a IHSAA sport or not.

 

Make sense?

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Perhaps one of the Officer's could explain the following and why this hasn't been done in years past as I know that several attempts have been made in recent memory and the IHSWCA has told all involved to go to the IHSAA that there is nothing that could be done:

 

-----Original Message-----

From: Bobby Cox <bcox@ihsaa.org>

To: iswawmnsdirector@aol.com

Cc: hooverc1@centergrove.k12.in.us; jdminch@nm.k12.in.us; tdolly2@yahoo.com; Blake Ress <bress@ihsaa.org>

Sent: Mon, Jan 18, 2010 4:58 pm

Subject: RE: IHSAA Wrestling

 

 

Darren Strub,

 

I am in receipt of your request.  The IHSAA does not recognize exhibition events during the regular season or the tournament series.  There will be no such recognition or addition of events allowed during this year?s tournament series.  The IHSWCA has the opportunity to make proposals to the Executive Committee of the IHSAA in alternating years.  If the leadership of the coaches? association wishes to propose such events, they will have an opportunity to do so next year.  The Association does not accept proposals from any groups other than the recognized coaches? association in that sport.  Additionally, the Association accepts proposals from their member school principals annually.

 

If you have additional questions or thoughts, you may contact me at your convenience.

 

Sincerely,

 

Bobby Cox

Assistant Commissioner

Indiana High School Athletic Association, Inc.

 

 

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We have a great opportunity here to make progress for Women Wrestling in Indiana!!

 

We need to determine the best proposal that will make progress, but is not so overwhelming that it will be turned down cold.

 

My idea is to propose a tournament for women that are currently participating in wrestling programs within the IHSAA and to have this tournament during the IHSAA state finals.  Early in the High School season (approx. Dec. 1), all Head Coaches would submit a list of women participating in their programs.  The week of the state series begins (sectionals), the Head Coaches would submit a list of all women that have participated in their programs during the seasons and are eligible for the tournament.  At that time, their records (including Varsity & JV), weight and any notable accomplishments would be entered to the IHSAA or a representative.  When the deadline for entering participates has been met, the entries will be placed into weight classes or a pool weight determined and established for groups (as the USGWA has done for many years).  Seeding will be done and brackets or pools completed by the Tuesday following Regionals.  These would be distributed to coaches with eligible participants and for return confirmation that these participants will be coming to the event.

 

My feelings is this information will be invaluable for being able to determine current women participation within IHSAA wrestling.  This will give numbers for beginning and entire season participation level by women within IHSAA wrestling.  This will make for the women to feel this is an important event and for everyone involved to be able to effectively determine and confirm the participation in the tournament.  What none of us want is for brackets to be made and times set and a good percentage of the women not show up to wrestle.  I don't expect a large number the first year (I hope I am wrong!), depending on the numbers we would work with the tournament to determine when we could wrestle the matches.  For example, let's say we have 6 pool weights with 8 participants in each pool.  Those rounds would be run in the early afternoon before the Men's tournament starts Friday evening.  The matches would be ran to Finals and Consolation Finals, then all six pools would be ran between the Men's Semis and Finals on Saturday evening.  In this case, this tourney would take less than three hours Friday and about an hour on Saturday.  By completing the tournament this way, it will bring exposure to women's wrestling and some prestige without taking anything away from the format and structure in any way of the IHSAA Wrestling Finals.  This is a very basic plan for the first year, only three or four formal contacts for HS Head Coaches and a two segment four hour tournament.

 

Let me know what everyone thinks and your ideas.  I want to build a consensus for a particular plan and bring this to the IHSWCA and for parents and coaches to contact their own HS principals to convince them that the specific idea is presentable to the IHSAA.

 

Darren Strub

ISWA Women's Director

iswawmnsdirector@aol.com

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This sounds great!  Organized and well thought out.

 

I wonder.... if something like this isn't acceptable to the IHSAA, is there any reason that it couldn't be sponsored by IHSWCA, but still presented the same weekend?  IHSWCA presents the Middle School State Championships, which is why I wondered why they couldn't do the same for the high school girls?

 

 

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not to be mean but if there was a separate womens division, i dont think Sarah Hildebrandt would be too happy bout that... she belongs wrestling guys as soon by her stout record

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Well considering that this is my last year of highschool and being a female wrestler I think it would be an amazing and honorable thing to have happen for girls to be able to have there own highschool state! There's so many girls who work there hardest now days and have a hard time showing it in highschool season because it's veryyyy difficult. There aren't many girls out there in highschool but if there was a separate state I think more girls would come out and show what they can do. Wrestling is what makes me feel proud! I know there's multiple people I have inspired by being a female wrestler and through out the years there were many things that almost made me quit especially once I hit highschool! I enjoy wrestling guys because it pushes me to the extremes, but I still think it would be great to have a separate State series for females! That way girls have a better chance of getting a shot into great colleges and being able to show how great they really are! Most of all that they can do anything boys can do regardless of how hard it may be! LETS GET GIRLS HIGHSCHOOL STATE!!!!!:):)

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Here is what I think has to happen...and it has happened in other sports such as Soccer.

 

Someone (or a group) who has a passion for girl's/women's wrestling must decide that they are going to be the driving force and not stop until the job is done.

 

This will not happen in a year or two.....it will have to be a long terms committment.

 

The person/group needs to find a group of schools in close proximity that would be willing to have girl's Club Team that would compete against each other in a league sort of situation.  As this is established then they would need to work to expand it until 50% of the IHSAA member schools are doing it.

 

This is exactly what Soccer and some other sports have done.

 

If you cannot get 50% of the member schools to have teams/clubs you would still increase the number of girls wrestling and have enough viable teams and individuals to have a legitimate State Championship event much like boy's/men's Volleyball currently has.

 

I would add this as well....Gymnastics is actually below the level where they should be sanctioned and it might be that if girl's wrestling were to get a reasonable number of schools involved (more than Gymnastics) then tey might consider dropping one and adding the other.  Most schools do not like Gymnastics becasue it cost too much.

 

The IHSAA is very concerned about the balance of boys and girls sports   Girls wrestling (if it had a decent number of teams participating) would make a nice pairing if gymnastics were dropped.

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