Kurt Boyer Posted October 9, 2010 Share Posted October 9, 2010 Typically, the IHSAA works w/ the IHSWCA on a "give/take" system. When they take something, they give us something and vice versa. Many believe the IHSAA plans to abolish the dual meet tournament. Obviously, if there is no longer a dual meet tournament, the team scoring must return to the individual state tournament. Assuming that happens, could this be the time we get wrestle backs in the individual tournament in exchange for the dual meet tournament? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted October 10, 2010 Share Posted October 10, 2010 We had our chances to exchange the team tournament for wrestle-backs a few years ago. I really don't think the IHSAA will go back to that proposal now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cale Hoover Posted October 10, 2010 Share Posted October 10, 2010 We actually have never been offered wrestle backs in a trade for anything. The IHSAA has been very consistent in their stance on wrestle backs. We now have to figure out a way to get them to see things our way for a change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted October 10, 2010 Share Posted October 10, 2010 Typically, the IHSAA works w/ the IHSWCA on a "give/take" system. When they take something, they give us something and vice versa. Many believe the IHSAA plans to abolish the dual meet tournament. Obviously, if there is no longer a dual meet tournament, the team scoring must return to the individual state tournament. Assuming that happens, could this be the time we get wrestle backs in the individual tournament in exchange for the dual meet tournament? One issues with wrestlebacks at the semi-state level is time. I would propose at least wrestleback from the currently names ticket round on. However, even that would add more time to the event. We would need to come up with the best plan that the IHSAA would believe benifits them too. Would that be having weigh-ins and the first round of wrestling on Friday night (like state)? Do we just have a much longer Saturday than we now have? Or would we re-work the whole system and re-invent how sectionals through state is structured. I can see this occuring in the future anyway with regionals not having as much importance as it once did since one win moves you on to semi-state. With no team state to worry about I would think a move would be made to structure secionals differently. Maybe back to a smaller sectional with 2-3 moving on t0 a 4 secitonal regional then top 4 from there. That way regionals is back to being more of a two or three match grinder to get to semi-state. Or more sectionals to regional so one less round at semi-state to leave more time at semi-state wrestlebacks. Though the IHSAA may not get as much revenue from that so they may not like it. I honestly liked the idea of team state and believed it was the best way to show who the true best "team" in the state was compared to adding tournament points up. I also believe we short changed the chance of team state support and success by not getting to a true multi-class team state system. This would have allowed for more teams to go farther, more crowd at team events, and more team growth for schools of all sizes that were winning at each level of the team series. Even with keeping the individual series the same as it is now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrecoCoach Posted October 10, 2010 Share Posted October 10, 2010 One selling point we should use is that if the IHSAA is going to use the individual state tournament scoring to determine the team state champions, then let's do what it takes to ensure that the right 4 wrestlers get that chance to compete at state, which is wrestlebacks. Wrestlebacks should be from the quarter finals. Lose first round, you're done. Lose second round and you get to try to come back for 3rd which is exactly like sectionals. (IHSAA likes consistency) The time requirements at semistate are the biggest obstical. Adding 1/2 a round (2 matches per weight on 4 mats) isn't horrible, but it is already a long day of wrestling. Two solutions: 1. First round on Friday night. Pro - more revenue for IHSAA (admission). Con - daytime travel + hotel for teams 2. Go back to 3 advancing from regionals. Pro - makes regionals tougher to advance. Con - less revenue for IHSAA (less wrestlers) No solution is perfect, and unfortunately the IHSAA has in the past normally decided not to change anything unless it's perfect. But that can't keep the coaches association from making the most compelling argument possible to try to get something that is vital for our sport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildcatcountry97 Posted October 11, 2010 Share Posted October 11, 2010 BE CAREFUL WHAT YOU ASK FOR. You don't want to add wrestle-backs at the expense of excitement. Think about this. The most exciting rounds are the round to go at semi-state, and Friday night at Conseco. You add wrestle backs, you lose excitement. You lose excitement, you damage the sport. The way to go about this is demand wrestle-backs at the state finals only, as it will greatly determine team scores. Once we have data from a few years when can use this to demonstrate that wrestle-backs would or would not make a difference at the semi-state level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachW33 Posted October 11, 2010 Share Posted October 11, 2010 I think there would stil be excitment in the wrestle backs. At some point you will have two wrestlers fighting for their ticket to state, it just might not be the first two rounds like it is now. If I understand it correctly, it could be similar to how the regional was set up with wrestle backs before the change to four going through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted October 11, 2010 Share Posted October 11, 2010 Well the excitement is still there. You just have it in two parts. Part 1 in the winners backet semi-finals round. Then part two in the consolation semi-final round. It would sure keep wrestlers moving at full steam instead of getting relaxed after making past the second round. Plus the entire wrestle-back rounds could have the potential to be just as entertaining as the finals being you have to prove you can survive a few hard fought matches just to make it to state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted October 11, 2010 Share Posted October 11, 2010 Lets be realistic people, we aren't getting wrestle-backs no matter how much we plead, beg or threaten. We have proposed them in some fashion numerous times only to be shot down over and over. NOTHING will change with Bobby Cox in charge, so we need to focus our proposals in other areas to help grow the sport. We will be wasting our time if we go after wrestle-backs again and be literally laughed at by the board....yet again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cale Hoover Posted October 11, 2010 Share Posted October 11, 2010 All of you have valid points. The truth in the matter is it will be difficult for us to get what we want. I think each of us has a plan in mind for the sport of wrestling that we think would be great. The IHSAA has a plan to, however, must of us do not like it! We will be discussing this Thursday and Friday at the coaches clinic. I encourage each of you to attend and I know Trent, JD, the Regional Representatives, and I are willing to listen to all ideas. Just remember we are playing a political game here and the IHSAA holds most of the cards. It is a critical time for us to come together and work for the benefit of wrestling in our state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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