WaltHarris

AMEN!!!!!!!!!!!!

Damn fine humor!

Beauty! Kinda of tells you why we are still at M'ville for the SS. These clowns couldn't find metal attitude if it bit them in their fatty beaucratic butts. Gosh, I can't wait till the State Legislature buts them out of business.

Totally agree with many of your comments. I we need to update the Folk rules to something closer to the FS rules. We really have to punish coaches and wrestlers who use stalling as a strategy. Leg riding paralell is stalling; that is why you see so many stalemates call quickly on collegiate leg riding.

The practice of a matside weigh-in is an excellent idea. I will admit I love it when the ignorant and foolish parents become angry about the rules. ;D Sadly, too many parents do a disservice to their child. The kid cuts weight from K-8th grade, then the parents are 'stunned' when the kid quits wrestling in HS.

Kind of funny for us old timers. I remember in the old days (early 1980s), we had 2 Indiana organizations. AAU ran some folkstyle tourneys and ISWA ran the FS & GR tourneys. By the mid-1990s, the only AAU tournament left was the AAU folkstyle state at Arsenal Tech, which I think the last year it was held (around 1994?) had like 2-3 kids per weight class at best. The AAU's problem, at least from my perspective, was the ISWA was blowing them away in terms of organization, momentum and reward. Funny how things might possibly change. With ISWA tournaments taking a lifetime to complete, they could be the ones facing extinction like the AAU. I hope that doesn't happen, though, b/c I like my friends at the ISWA. Of course, I would love to see the ISWA get out of the folkstyle business completely, and get back to the organization's true roots which is FS & GR. I honestly believe the ISWA was a vastly superior organization back when it did just focus of FS & GR.

Very interesting! I was unaware of many of these facts and I greatly appreciate you sharing the info. I've held two strong opinions for many years. First, our tournaments in Indiana take way too long. Matside pairing was critical if we didn't want to lose kids. Second, when the ISWA was heavy-handedly push by USAW into adding lots of Folk tourneys, that FS & GR participants would decrease.

This weekend is a good example. There are 3 tourneys in Indianapolis (Avon, Greenwood, Butler U.) and none anywhere else. Yes, this is an extreme example b/c HS state is in Indianapolis this weekend. If we look more broadly, think about how many tournaments there are for wrestlers in the Northeastern part of the state. Very few. A new format to present the same schedule optimistically might open some folks eyes.

Check out how Michigan presents its schedule: http://www.mywaywrestling.com/schedule/2010%20Tournaments/2010%20schedule.htm I really like the format and would recommend the ISWA consider presenting our schedule in a similar fashion by region. One issue we face in Indiana is many tournaments around Indy, yet moderate to no tournaments in other regions. This isn't the ISWA's fault. I know the ISWA examines each weekend carefully to avoid conflicts (both between HS, MS and holidays), but also regional conflicts as well. More importantly, the ISWA needs people to set up and host tournaments; no one volunteers, then no tournament. Presenting a schedule in a regional format may show folks clearly what areas of the state need to volunteer more.

Mike Ditka would beat all of them.

I'm quite disappointed in the Perry Township Schools. They should know better than to this. Stick to the spirit of the rules, not the letter of the law.

1988 my assistant coach quits one week into the season (got a non-teaching job). Another guy (I will generically name him 'John') asks for the job a couple days later. He works outside the school. John said his nephew is on my team. The nephew is an excellent student and athlete. After an interview, everything checks out, so the AD gives John the assistant wrestling coach job with my blessing. John wrestled in HS, but had been out of the sport for 15 years. His foundational knowledge of wrestling was fine. He served as my assistant coach for that entire season and half way through the next season with no problem. Xmas break of the John's second yr. as assistant coach, we have separate varsity and jv tourneys on the same day. I take the varsity; he takes the jv. About 10 am one of my jv kid's parents shows up at the varsity tourney location (about 20 minutes away from the jv tourney) and starts telling me I need to get over to the jv tourney location immediately. I have the parent drive me over to the jv tourney. I get there and John is 3 sheets to the wind and reeking of alcohol. I found out years later that John had a number of mental health issues that he hid well and self medicated with drinking. Regardless, John is yelling at an official to call a pin as I breeze in the door; of course this was a problem for the official since both wrestlers were in neutral at the time. The school AD had tried to get John to leave the jv tourney unsuccessfully on several occasions, as did several of my kids' parents. John told all of them that he was going to be a starting defenseman for Chicago Blackhawks very soon and would enjoy practicing for his upcoming professional hockey career by pounding them all into oblivion. Mind you, John was 51 yrs old, a chain smoker and all of 130 lbs. So that was fun day for me.

I had a foreign exchange student from Russia on the team. He wasn't very good, spoke little english and was at a complete loss in regards to the our culture. I've dealt with many exchange students in our school, but this young man was by far the most clueless. We're at an opposing school for a meet. This school was/is ancient. It still had the old style troughs in lieu of urinals in the lockerroom. I'm talking to our kids prior to the match in the lockerroom, trying to fire them up. While I am, this exchange kid hangs his rear over the trough, tucks his unit in, and proceeds to defecate in the trough. A few grunts later, he pulls up his singlet like nothing happened. All of us are just staring at him. The room cleared out fast. Later, he tried to explain that in Russia they do have troughs that multiple people can utilize simultaneously to go #2. My god, I felt awful for that damn janitor.

I'm peeing myself.

Fifth and final match of LONG day at a super dual. Late afternoon and we wrestled terrible as a team. Most of us have the experience of this setting... it's late in the day, the crowd even gets tired when the matches are non-competitive and everyone in the gym can hear anything. My wrestler on the mat is in the process of getting stuck in a grapevine. Well, one kid on my team bench who loved wrestling, but had tons of emotional problems, screams at the top of his lungs, "JOE, JOE, SHOVE YOUR FINGERS UP HIS @#$^! SO DEEP YOU GRAB HIS TAILBONE. THEN JUST TEAR HIS @#$^! TO PIECES. YOU CAN GET OUT OF THERE IF YOU TEAR HIS @#$^! TO PIECES JOE!!!" I took the kid to the locker room as every spectator in the stands bore their eyes into us. That was the last time the kid was a part of our team.

1980s dual-- had official I never seen before. The official and I chat prior to the match. He previously had been an official in Arkansas for a couple seasons, but quit 10 years back because of other commitments. He recently moved to Indiana after a divorce (he was about 55 if I had to guess) and this was his first match getting back into officiating. He didn't sound real confident, but I encouraged him. As a person who has officiate thousands of GR & FS matches, I know how challenging officiating is. Well, my 98 lbs. kid comes out and tosses the opponent straight to his back. Ref counts to five in the near fall position, then opponent gets off his back, escapes and goes off the mat. Ref then signals to the scorer "7 for green, 1 for red." The other coach and I look at each other like 'what?' We both approach the ref and he states, "Green got 2 TD, then a 5 second near fall with 1 point for each near fall second. So that was 2TD + 5 NF = 7 pts. for green. Then red had 1E." Both of us coaches explained how near fall worked (2-4 secs = 2 pts., 5+ secs = 3pts.) which seemed all new to him. All he could say was in a southern drawl, "You all sure score dem near falls a lot different up here." My 98 lbs. pins the kid quickly after that. Then 112 just had to be one of those matches. You all have had them. I don't recall the precise score, but it was like 26-22 was BOUT score. Both boys knew just enough offense to be dangerous but had no idea defensively about anything. Well, my Arkansas friend was out of his Confederate mind trying to keep up with these kids. He was calling 2 pt. escapes and 3 pt. takedowns; he was just so confused. The opposing coach and I are good friends, so we are cracking up. Just the odds of having this guy from the South officiating that match were like winning the lotto. The match was stopped 6 times so the scorer could work with the official on what points he had signaled. Just the 112 match alone must have taken 25 minutes with all the stoppages. 119 forfeit; at least that was easy for him. Then at 126 my kid tosses opponent to his back immediately in a headlock. This is back when the circle was near the edge of the mat. My kid has one foot in bounds, but the rest of my wrestler and the opponent is literally on the gym floor. Both opponent's shoulders are flush against the WOODEN gym floor. The official runs off the mat, around the boys, flops on the basketball floor a good five feet from the mat, checks to see if both shoulders are down, then slaps the wooden gym floor and calls a pin. The boys on both teams are laughing so hard tears are running down their cheeks. It took myself and the other coach minutes before we could compose ourselves and explain that ain't no pin to the official. I don't know what the hell this guy was officiating in Arkansas, but it sure wasn't wrestling... maybe rasslen!

Sectional match in 1980s. At 155 Wrestler A wins championship match over Wrestler B. The official applied a rule in error during the match, although no one noticed it at the time. At end of 167 match, coach of wrestler B brings rule book to official and states "you applied that rule incorrectly." The official talks with coach A; coach A agrees with coach B the rule was applied incorrectly, however states the match is over, wrestler A won the match on the scoreboard, had his hand raised, signed the bout card and just 2 minutes prior received his ribbon and plaquer on the awards stand. The disagreement was professional and no one was shouting, but there were strong opinions. The discussion continues throughout the 177 match. The official delays the start of the 185 match to keep talking about it. Then the official goes on the mat, refs the 185 match. After 185 is complete, the official comes off the mat and says to both coaches he's made up his mind. He tells them to bring the wrestlers back. One of the kids was already outside in the parking lot about to leave with his dad. Then after the 275 match, the official changes the bout card, etc., and declares Wrestler B the victor. I think this situation was probably why we had the rule instituted in the early 90s about no changes to a match's results once both wrestlers leave the mat area.

As a side note, it cracks me up to think about the "blood rag" in the old days. Many of you seasoned coaches and officials can remember, as I do, how we had this universal towel from 1990 all the way back to antiquity. We used the same towel to wipe up our kids blood, another team's wrestler's blood, to dry off guys sweating too much, wipe our own forehead. Holy cow, it is amazing how much has changed; and I would add certainly for the better!

Around 1992 the rule started that a host school must have a bleach-water solution at matside to clean up blood. The trainer thought it was a brilliant idea to place the bleach in a water bottle that looked identical to all my team's other water bottles, then stuff it under the coach's corner chair. Sure enough, during the 3rd period of 119 match there is an injury time out. My wrestlers comes over to my coach's chair and grabs the first water bottle he sees; which of course was the bleach. He then proceeds to vomit uncontrollably like that little girl in the Exorcists. He still won the match, but had one heck of a stomach ache for the afternoon.

Plenty of fine suggestions. I don't have a strong preferences on location. I just want to get it out of Merrillville. I find it insulting that wrestlers and parents have to endure those type of conditions. If it was a women's sport, there would be a lawsuit.

Here, here.

My favorite part about Merrillville is literally nothing. It is a nightmare for a fan. It is a disaster waiting to happen for a fire marshal. It is wrestling-match-in-the-stands for a parent to just get a seat. And I won't even bring up the problems for wrestlers trying to warm-up. Merrillville was a disaster in the 1980s that folks complained about; the fact we are still there tells you plenty about the ihsaa.

1. 112 2. 167 3. 1965

It's totally insane, isn't it. I mean you could not defend nor explain this situation to a person from another state even if you tried. We are definitely our own worst enemy in Indiana.

As promised, here is a post from the old, old messageboard from 2001. Problems like the ones this weekend go deep into the past. I am quitting. That is right. After many years of coaching high school wrestling I have said to myself that this is it. I never considered myself a quitter at anything, but certain things about this sport have gotten to me over time. I love the sport dearly and always thought I would coach until I retired. But now I am going to quit two decades earlier then I had planned. Here are my reasons in order of annoyance. 1) STALLING- I am sick and tired of coaches who teach their wrestlers to stall. Most kids do not know how to stall well, unless an experienced coach has taught them how to do it. An experienced coach can teach any wrestler how to stall consistently and rarely get called or penalized for it during a match, under the current rules. I am tired of watching year after year as good aggressive wrestlers lose matches at sectional/regional/semistate/state, while average stalling wrestlers win matches and move on to the next level of the tournament. The stallers will sit back for 5 minutes and 50 seconds conserving energy, then go for a score in the last 10 seconds and win 1-0 or 2-1. Least you think I am some weak coach, I can proudly say I?ve had plenty of state place winners over my career and some very good dual teams. However, I have had many more kids wrestle for me who earned the right to move on to the next level in the tournament, but were denied simply because some average opponent was taught by his coach to stall out the match. Officials have become much better about calling stalling during the regular season. However, I still see a great fear among officials to call it at any level of the state tournament series. Officials do not want to be the one to determine the outcome and thus, stalling is called quite infrequently. A few years back, I considered changing my coaching philosophy. I contemplated if I should take the weaker/average wrestlers on my team and teach them how to stall out a match. In the end I simply could not do it. I would not consider it ethically right, nor would it be in the spirit of the sport of wrestling. 2) HILLBILLIES- The utter scum-of-the-earth white trash that has invaded our sport makes me cringe. I have coached football, baseball, and softball over the years. I almost never have seen these degenerates at any of those contests. But you hold a wrestling tournament and these greasy long hair, B.O. infested, 400 pound each mom and dad, ignorant nut-jobs come out of the woodwork. For starters, their kids regularly have ringworm, muluscom, or an assort of other contagious skin conditions. Many of them have never been treated by a doctor and continue right on wrestling every week. Officials are officials. Most of them are not trained to pick up on these diseases, so you cannot blame them. The problem is, numerous wrestlers and coaches who are very careful about watching out for these conditions are forced to deal with the results. Families have to pile up doctor?s bills and pay for medication as a result of the hillbillies inbred laziness. Then comes mom and dad hillbilly, along with their box of Krispy Kream doughnuts. I shall call them Randy Bob and Lauraleen. Randy Bob sits in the stands screaming his Skoal filled mouth off at the official, the coach, and the opposing fans. After his son loses, Randy Bob proceeds to slap the hell out of his son (15 years ago) or berate the kid into a psychological nightmare (at present). Lauraleen threatens the official as he is walking out the door and gets in the face of the young man who beat her son/brother (yes, the inbredding again). As a coach, I can no longer continue to ask good, well mannered young men to come out for my wrestling team and subject themselves to this kind of torment. Fifteen year olds should not have to subject themselves to skin disease and the rantings of a 400 pound mother in an ?I?m With Stupid ->? t-shirt in order to enjoy a sporting event. 3) THERE IS LITTLE HAPPINESS IN WRESTLING ANYMORE- Almost everyone in my family wrestled or has been involved with wrestling on some level. My brother, who was a state place winner, has this saying about wrestling: ?Almost no one leaves wrestling happy.? Sure, if you wrestle for Mater Dei?s team or are one of the 14 state champions each year, then you might leave happy. But for the vast majority of people I know, most feel unfulfilled. My brother, my dad, my sons, all think the sport is just screwed up. Too many nut-jobs, too many bad coaches, too many dreams broken by some official?s bad call. For years I have disagreed with them. Told them that the nuts were a minority, the bad coaches out there get replaced, and that I never have met an official who made a bad call on purpose. Besides, winning was not everything. The competition and hard work helped these kids out for a lifetime. My perspective was that the positives out weighted the negatives. But the time has now come that I agree with my family. There are too many nuts threatening officials and coaches. Too many bad coaches for whom winning is the only thing. Too many people who would brake every rule in the book to win a state title. I still coach football and I do not see the same thing on the gridiron. But I see it at almost every wrestling match I go to. 4) IT?S NOT THE KIDS WHO HAVE CHANGED, IT?S THE ADULTS- People think that today?s kids are a great deal more lazy than 20 or 30 years ago. I disagree. It?s the adults who raise and mentor these kids. They have caused more and more headaches for me over the years. Many parents are not only clueless about the sport, but clueless about how to raise their child. Then I go to a super dual and watch two opposing coaches almost come to blows and think ?No wonder some of these kids are going over the edge.? I witness certain officials who believe they are always correct, challenging coaches, and vice-versa. These kids are sent so many terrible messages about something that really does not even matter in the grand scheme of life: a game. That?s all wrestling is; a simple game. Yet so many of the adults make it out to be a matter of life and death. No wonder so many kids want no part of wrestling anymore. 5) THE ELIMINATION OF NIGHT DUAL MATCHES- Wrestling is being killed by the super dual. In the quest to set records, we have all but eliminated the night dual match. Everybody wants to break so-and-so?s record for individual wins/ coaching wins/ takedowns, etc. It is a legitimate argument that wrestling in a lot of super duals helps one?s team out come state tournament time. But is it really worthwhile for the sport of wrestling in the end? Basketball, baseball, tennis. All these sports play single games during the regular season, yet come tournament time they must compete several times on the same day. And we are talking about a contest in those sports that sometime take hours, not 6 minutes! What would be the big deal about requiring a team to utilize 8 of its 16 points for single night dual matches? That would still give a team 4 super duals (or tournaments), plus 1 tournament. The majority of fans, parents, and high school kids do not want to sit in some gym from 7 a.m. until 5 p.m. every Saturday from Thanksgiving until the last week of February. It is no wonder that many teams cannot fill every weight class. 6) IHSAA IS A FAILURE- I am so sick of the IHSAA treating wrestling like we just don't matter. Blake Rees in particular seems to think wrestling is the lowest wrung of athletics. The disrespect with which they treat students is sicking. I can't take it anymore. The IHSAA is literally a career killer for many high school students. Most of the people who read this message board are the good individuals in the sport of wrestling. The coaches, officials, and wrestlers who do care about the right things. Unfortunately, many of the people who should be reading this probably will never see it. And even if they did, I doubt most them would care anyway. So, goodbye to the bad coaches out there who teach kids to stall instead of wrestle, goodbye to the officials who have not read the rule book in ten years, goodbye to Randy Bob and Lauraleen?s crusty armpits and trailer park language, and most of all goodbye to the utter insanity that high school wrestling has become.