lesnar45 Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 Normally I am pretty quiet on here, but I witnessed something yesterday at the New Haven Super Dual that I have not seen in all of my years of wrestling or coaching and just wanted to get other opinions. I coach at FW Wayne and in the second round we wrestled Maconaquah. The dual started at the 126 lb weight class in which we do not have a wrestler competing (thus we forfeit). Now before I explain what happened, as a head coach, I will take the blame for this, because it is my responsibility to make sure every single issue is taken care of. At no time was this issue Maconaquah's coaches fault. As the match started, our 132 lb (4 year Senior wrestler) went to the scores table. We have not had a 126 all year, so he is accustomed to a FF before he wrestles. The scoring table then checked him in to go wrestle. About 1 minute into the match, our coaching staff realized that in fact he was wrestling their 126 lber and not their 132 lber. The official scorer had checked in our 132 at 126 and allowed him to go out without ever stopping it. As we stopped the match, the official stated that he always asks each wrestler if they are that weight and since it was dead time, not only would that match stop, but now we would have to forfeit the 132 weight class too because their wouldn't be adequate rest time in-between wrestling matches for our 132. The official said if we would have caught it 10 seconds into the match then it wouldnt have mattered? Why did our wrestler get punished for the scorer's mistake? I was just wondering if anyone had ever experienced something similar to this? Our wrestler knew we had a forfeit at 126 and thought he was being sent out for the 132 match. Again, I will take the blame for this, but I dont feel as a coach, I need to walk my wrestlers to the scoring table before every match and hold them until I get confirmation from the scorer (which the official suggested I do for the rest of the season.) Riley Johnson FW Wayne HS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AC Computer Posted December 19, 2011 Share Posted December 19, 2011 Riley, First, let me say I'm glad that wasn't me! I'd feel terrible if my mistake cost a kid to lose a chance to wrestle. Thankfully, we were on the other mat that round. I'd thing the scorekeeper would have noticed the forfeit and questioned it at that time. Now, let me address sever problems with the check process at tournaments. First, most team use a manager for a scorekeeper. These students aren't familiar with the rules and check-in procedures. They just know how to keep the score book. I only know of two teams out of the 10 there yesterday that had adults doing the scoring, AC and Yorktown. I'm not sure about all of the others since we didn't wrestle in the other pool. It's difficult to put a manager in that position and not have errors occasionally. It's two-sided, too. Your scorekeeper should have realized that the forfeit hadn't been awarded and stopped it. Again, if it was a manager they probably trusted that the officials had it right. We try to provide an official scorekeeper at every mat for the tournaments we host instead of relying on the schools to provide one, but that adds to the expense of the host school. The other big problem is that the wrestlers do not know how to check in. Most of them mumble their name. Some just give their first name. A lot of them, ours included, just walk by the table and wave because they know one of the scorekeepers know who they are. I doubt if they've ever been told how to check in, but it would really help scorekeepers at tournaments with multiple teams, it they would come to the table, give their name, school, and weight class, like "John Smith, Central, 160", then the scorekeeper would be sure who it is and where they are supposed to wrestle. And have them speak up. It can get pretty loud in those gyms when there are three other matches going on. Also, remind them they have to report to the table. There was only one match where I wasn't the official scorekeeper yesterday and some of the younger AC wrestlers tried to report to me, even though I was sitting in a chair on the bench. Hope those idea help. Sorry your wrestler had to give up a match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chambers Posted December 19, 2011 Share Posted December 19, 2011 That is a correctable error. Your wrestler should have been given 1 minute rest and then he could have wrestled at 132lbs. A match according to the NFHS rulebook Rule 5, section 17 Art. 2 is "A match begins when the proper wrestler reports to the score's table in dual matches and tournaments until the conclusion of wrestling." Because your wrestler was a 132lber and could not properly check in at 126 he did not have a match with their 126lber regardless of the fact that they were wrestling each other for a time. Rule 6, section 2, art. 2 also says that "The referee shall correct errors without penalty to the contestants." The official did penalise your wrestler by not allowing him to wrestle his match at 132lbs. As for the official saying that because one minute of bad time had been wrestled being to long to correct is wrong. If for example at the start of the 3rd period wrestler A is given the choice but it was actually wrestler B's choice and the match goes the full 6 minutes then the entire 2 minutes of the 3rd period would be bad time and have to be re-wrestled. Did you have a new official for this match? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ked Posted December 19, 2011 Share Posted December 19, 2011 Wow, sad day for you and your team and the wrestler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lesnar45 Posted December 19, 2011 Author Share Posted December 19, 2011 Thanks Phil and chambers for your insight. Again, it was my fault for not catching it before it happened. I just want to make sure it doesn't happen again and feel because it cost a wrestler mat time! Riley Johnson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils27 Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 We still raise the hands of wrestlers who win by forfeit correct? Lets not bash the referee too much on this one. So your senior 132lber had to sit out a match. So did the other teams 126lber because you didn't bring anyone to wrestle him. I think the referee made the right call. If you check your wrestler into the wrong weight class then your team should be punished not get a mulligan. What if that 126lber had gotten injured in those 60 seconds? What if he had tore an acl and his senior season was lost forever? I know this is a HUGE what if but we've all seen crazy things happen. Good luck to you the rest of the season and I hope both sides learned something from this mishap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Guru Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 That's ridiculous. I would have been super pissed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chambers Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 We still raise the hands of wrestlers who win by forfeit correct? Lets not bash the referee too much on this one. So your senior 132lber had to sit out a match. So did the other teams 126lber because you didn't bring anyone to wrestle him. I think the referee made the right call. If you check your wrestler into the wrong weight class then your team should be punished not get a mulligan. What if that 126lber had gotten injured in those 60 seconds? What if he had tore an acl and his senior season was lost forever? I know this is a HUGE what if but we've all seen crazy things happen. Good luck to you the rest of the season and I hope both sides learned something from this mishap. Devils27, how can you think that the ref. made the right call when I posted the rules that clearly show that he made the wrong call? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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