WaltHarris

Julio, Y2CJ41 and MattM all make excellent points. I think there are 2 separate issues we face. First, the ISWA exerting more control on how local tournaments are run. Second, combating the ignorance of some parents and coaches.

I have always wondered how guys get on the NYAC team. For example, were Angel and Reece asked by the club to join? It's easy to see how a wrestler would be on the Hawkeye (Iowa) or Gator (Ok. State) club. But I was just curious about NYAC club. I doubt (but really don't know ??? ) that Angel and Reece are practicing at the NYAC clubhouse in New York City. Do they get paid or get stipends from NYAC?

My fourth year coaching in the 1970x, I had one junior football player named Jim, who had never wrestled before and thought he was quite a "bad ass," come out. Jim weighed 140 pounds and was one of those boys who constantly had to let everyone know just how athletically talented he was by talking a good game incessantly. I let our 98 pound varsity wrestler, pair up with Jim for the entire practice. Our 98 pounder had been a state qualifier the year before and was a pretty good wrestler, but giving up 40 pounds I thought he could only teach Jim a minor lesson in why not to talk trash. Well, about 30 minutes into live wrestling, Jim started calling for his mother. Our 98 pounder had Jim in a headlock so tight that Jim REALLY believed he was about to die. The way Jim's voice shrilled "Mommy!" was like one the war movie. Jim tried to leave the wrestling room after that, but one of our assistants miraculously convinced Jim to stay a little longer. Jim cried on the side of the mat for about 10 minutes, then started acting like he was getting real fired up to go back out and kick our 98 pounders butt. Well, ol' Jim heads back out into his circle and our 98 pounder gives him a wink. Jim lurches at our 98 pounder mad as hell and well, the 98 pounder just starts running a clinic on Jim. After a couple more headlocks that once again scared the hell out of Jim, our 98 pound wrestler places Jim in an unbelievably tight cradle. I think all the pinning combos scared Jim something fierce, perhaps due to claustrophobia. Jim started screaming ?Let me go, let me go! I want to go see my mom!? Tears were running down Jim?s face like Niagra Falls. Our 98 pounder started giggling, released the cradle, then ran a double chicken wing. Once Jim got upside-down in that double chicken wing, all hell broke loose. Jim, while still sobbing away and crying out few seconds for maternal comfort, began to pissed his pants. Our 98 pounder had sat-out on the double chicken wing, so as a result the back of his neck and much of his shirt were urinated on by Jim. Our 98 pounder released Jim once realized the situation, then Jim stood up and sprinted out of the room embarrassed as hell and crying. I got hauled into the administration, but nothing happened because nobody had really done anything wrong. Of course this was a long, long time ago.

Do we need to register for ISWA FS/GR State on TrackWrestling? I had hoped so because it worked so well for ISWA Folkstyle State. And btw, ISWA folks, I am quite thankful for that! If we are not utilizing TrackWrestling for FS/GR registration, could someone kindly place a pdf of the registration & waiver form on the ISWA web site? This way, people can fill it out beforehand and bring it with them.

I would definitely nominate Tom Dolly. Tom is one of those behind the scenes guys that only hardcore wrestling people know. He won the iswa John Hurrle Memorial Award in 2007. He also was the Central Regional Developmental Coach of the Year in 1997. He knows as much about technique and mat attitude as anyone I know. Tom has also coached at Mishawaka HS, Penn HS, South Bend Adams HS, Mishawaka Marian HS and 2 or 3 different elementary school teams. Moreover, for the last 20 years Tom has virtually been the lone person running an active FS/GR club in the South Bend-Mishawaka area. There have been other clubs in this area, but they go in and out of existence and often don't have much quality of instruction. If it wasn't for Tom Dolly, wrestling in South Bend and large parts of Mishawaka would be quite different; in a really bad way. Almost every state qualifier in the last 20 years from South Bend and Mishawaka (and some from Elkhart and Michigan) has been a member of one of the incarnations of Tom Dolly's club.

Some folks are quite challenged by the cost of our national team trips for freestyle and greco. I would suggest the ISWA look into establishing an endowment. Yes, the endowment might not payout much interest for a good 20-30 years. However, such long term strategic thinking of establishing an endowment will pay off in the future. Just the interest alone from a nominal endowment could annually cover the cost of Fargo in another 25 years if it is managed well.

JTM2004, the numbers you displayed are right on par with my experience as a coach. My wrestlers doubled their regular HS season match totals in FS/GR.

Here is my suggestion: I would request the ISWA commence running FS or GR tourneys right after HS team state. Prior to 1998, (which is around the time I retired) it was much easier for a coach to tell that kid who LOST @ sectionals/regionals/ss and was motivated to improve, "Hey, FS/GR starts next week. Let's start training." Over the last 12 years since we have implemented folkstyle as part of the ISWA schedule, there is typically 4-6 weeks between end of HS wrestling season and the start of FS/GR. Your typical HS kid gets out of the wrestling practice routine and back into the going home after school and tv-watching routine. That makes it tough for a coach to get that kid's engine restarted and have them wrestling again after 4-6 weeks of downtime. Presently, I see very little motivation for HS kids to wrestle in those 3 weeks of iswa folkstyle tourneys and folkstyle state. And the folkstyle numbers of HS kids bear that out. So why not start FS/GR earlier like we did for nearly 20 years with success?

I would like to hear your suggestions for how we can improve Freestyle & Greco in Indiana? I've been involved since the 1970s. It seemed like Indiana's number of kids at FS/GR tourneys peaked in the 90s. We still have good, but not great attendance and we still have plenty of kids wanting to go to Fargo. Please keep in mind, Indiana has zero effect on what FILA is going to change or not change about the international rules. But how can we make things better and get more kids 18 & under wrestling FS/GR?

Darn well said!!!!

Here is where I would diverge... 1) Wrestling folk constantly leads to a much higher burnout rate by the time kids get to HS, then when you combine folks/FS/GR. 2) Folkstyle imop is ungodly boring. Stalling is just killing any excitement in folk, where FS/GR attempts to combat stalling with the rules (push-out, win 2 of 3 periods). The FS/GR solutions to stalling aren't the best, but at least they try to combat it. 3) I actually see many kids smiling at FS/GR tournaments. The atmosphere is so much more relaxed. Whereas at folk, I see plenty of depressed kids and a much darker aura. More people need to realize wrestling is a sport which should be enjoyable. 4) As true red-white-and-blue American, it pains me to make this statement, but it's important we aren't the "Ugly American." Just like football or softball or nascar, there is no interest in folkstyle outside the U.S. As wrestling community, we should not be ignorant about the entire world's view of wrestling versus our own little corner. Oh, some people are gonna be awfully mad now...

You are correct... and also imprecise. I could show you a post from this board in 1998 stating nearly everything you did verbatim, with the exception perhaps of the push-out rule. Yet, here we are with FS/GR still going on in 2010. People said the same things back in the 70s & 80s; still, we have kids lined up around the block to attend FS/GR nationals in Fargo each summer. Man, you are so right about the constant FILA rule changes. It makes FS/GR harder all the time to wrestle, officiate or even watch. Try just reading pages 30-49 of USA Wrestling Officials guide (taken from the FILA manual). Gee wiz, every paragraph seems to contradict the one before. And I have been heavily involved since the 70s. I can't imagine what its like to a new person. You are correct too about the availability of folkstyle tourneys and the lack of penalties for illegal holds.

Been to 7 tournaments this season. Columbia City was by far the best run. I take my hat off to their pairings folks. Bouts sheets came out fast and furious. There was almost no waiting. It has literally been years since I've been to a tournament that well organized on the local level. And the plaques were fantastic. Nice job!!!!!!!!!!!!!

This is only for cadets and juniors, correct?

A lot of credit goes to the ISWA for having well qualified personnel on site to handle such situations immediately and professionally.

There is no confusion, like the confusion of a simple mind.

I would suggest that some folks have a "coaching numbers" problem and not a "tournament organizer" problem. A challenge all tournament organizers face is efficiency. They must keep a tournament moving at a good clip. Slowing down a whole tournament for one coach/wrestler is not reasonable. If a club needs more coaches, then recruit more people to be coaches. I have been a part of several clubs over the years and they have always effectively recruited new coaches. A lot people like "coaching" at a club, but they hate "running" the club (i.e., recruiting coaches, officials, table help, finances). My suggestion is to improve the "running" of your club.

This is an excellent and reasonable suggestion. Regretfully, when I have suggested moving back a match, several opposing coaches have been indignant. Most often the opposing coach will say, "Hey, I only have a period and a half left on mat #3. I will be at mat #9 in just a few minutes and don't want to wait when I get there." Think about the selfishness of that statement. Essentially, 30 people must wait so I don't have to wait when I come over to this mat.

It concerns me when a match is held up for one single coach, to the detriment of all others. I've seen this occur at Folkstyle State and local tournaments. Yes, it stinks as a coach when we have two kids wrestling at the same time on different mats. However, you must make a choice. Asking all the wrestlers, parents, coaches, officials and table help on mat #3 to wait until your first wrestler finishes on mat #8 so you can come to the other side of the gym and coach a second wrestler is not fair. The selfishness alone that it would even take to make such a request is beyond arrogant entitlement. I would like to respectfully request the iswa inform table help and officials to deny any such request in the future.

What day, time and location is the kids freestyle club practicing in Mishawaka? Is it open to all?

Jake, I remember you as a wrestler. You were quite good. Son, I have no agenda. My only hopes are having fun with my grandson at wrestling and making sure future Indiana wrestlers have reasonable length tournaments so we don't hurt wrestling. I am sure you are a good kid, Jake, as evidence by the fact that a young man like yourself spends so much time volunteering with ISWA and the kids. However, the response posted cuts right to the heart of issue. Every time someone raises the issue of tournaments taking a long time to complete, the 4 standard ISWA responses come out: 1) Don't blame ISWA, its the local tourney's fault. 2) We used to go to midnight; be grateful its only 8pm nowadays. 3) Wrestling tourneys take a long time, so just get used to it. 4) Join/volunteer more and then we'll allow you to complain. (But for 20 years I've seen that coaching/officiating on the local level is NOT merely enough volunteering to be respected.) In 10 years, I have not heard one new or innovative response from the ISWA. One of the most powerful words in the English language is "sorry." Never once have I heard anyone from the ISWA say they were sorry for the length of a tournament, taking away family time, or failing to force local tourneys to update their format. If there were two things I wish the ISWA staff would comprehend it is: 1) Kids do quit wrestling because of the outrageous time length of tournaments. 2) 90% of the families at tournaments are NOT wrestling lifers like you, me and the ISWA board. They are families and kids who want to wrestle for a few hours on a Saturday and then go home. Plenty of states went to 4-man round-robin tournaments a decade ago. Yes, I have seen a few of them in Indiana, like Munster, but that is the exception. There are plenty of other format options also. Sadly, I think the ISWA will continue down this path disengagement. And once a large percentage of people have abandoned the organization only then will it perform a needed self evaluation, much too late.

I really hope the ISWA takes an honest look at itself as an organization. Ask: What have we historically done well? What should we focus on long term? Has the addition of folk to our schedule crippled our former achievements with FS/GR? Are we truly following the traditional John Hurrle saying of "Do it for the kids" by keeping children at tournaments from 7am until 8pm? The ISWA is a great organization, but I would describe the last few years as 'wandering in the desert trying to find its self" period. Based on the talented people on the ISWA board, I do think it has the ability to bounce back. They just need a new strategy that is abundantly clear to membership and well supported.

I am a retired HS coach. However, I still take my grandson to folk and FS tournaments. I have grown very disappointed (well, actually angry) at several ISWA tournaments over the last few years. I always volunteer either as table help or as an official at these tournaments. So I don't want to hear any b.s. from ISWA people about "get off your tail and get involved." About half of the ISWA tournaments I take my grandson to just take forever to complete. I mean, we are getting home at 8-9 pm sometimes. At Jimtown two years ago, my grandson weighed-in at 8 am and didn't wrestle his first match until 2PM!!! That's crazy. More importantly, it's a solid recipe for destroying a child's interest in the sport of wrestling. I've been involved with Indiana wrestling since the 1960s as a high school kid and the 1970s as a coach. The ISWA has done a ton to improve wrestling in the state. The thing is, ever since the ISWA was pressured by USAW to implement a folkstyle season around 1998(?), things began to go off-kilter for ISWA.

Under the old scoring system: 1994-95 Evansville Mater Dei Mike Goebel Bellmont,Brent Faurote 82-60 1993-94 Bellmont Brent Faurote Castle Bob Harmon 89-45 1992-93 Lawrence North Frank Svarczkopf, Jr. Southport Steve Dildine 72-53 1991-92 Lawrence North Frank Svarczkopf, Jr. Perry Meridian Phil Strader 90-48 1990-91 Mishawaka Al Smith Lawrence North Frank Svarczkopf 70-57.5 1989-90 Muncie Southside John Smith Decatur Central David Walpole 83.5-59.5 1988-89 Chesterton Bob Trzeciak Lawrence North Frank Svarczkopf 59.5-51 1987-88 Bellmont Dennis Hays Indianapolis Cathedral Lance Rhodes 70.5-65.5 1986-87 Bellmont Dennis Hays Evansville Mater Dei Mike Goebel 85.5-59 1985-86 Evansville Mater Dei Mike Goebel Delta, Indianapolis Cathedral Don Patton Lance Rhodes 92-75 New Castle High School 1984-85 Delta Don Patton Muncie Southside John Smith 51.5-46.5 Market Square Arena, Indianapolis 1983-84 Delta Don Patton Calumet Kenneth Stiggall 90.5-49 1982-83 Delta Don Patton Warren Central Gene Nesbit 72.5-51 1981-82 Delta Don Patton Terre Haute South Abdul-Raheem Ali 70.5-44.5 1980-81 Delta Don Patton Chesterton Bob Trzeciak 99-50.5 Southport High School 1979-80 Warren Central Allen Morgan North Central (Indpls.) Keith Farrand 56-48 1978-79 Indianapolis Arsenal Technical John Hurrle Bellmont Alan Kalver 46-43.5 1977-78 Bloomington South Kay Hutsell Warren Central Allen Morgan 48-47 1976-77 Bloomington North John Henry Martinsville John Roontz 47-40 1975-76 Indianapolis Arsenal Technical John Hurrle Bloomington North John Henry 38-31.5 1974-75 Muncie Southside Jim Cartwright Hammond Morton Fred Kepler 42-23 1973-74 Muncie Northside Fred Ginther Bloomington South Kay Hutsell 46-36 1972-73 Bloomington South Kay Hutsell Indianapolis Bishop Chatard Richard Dullaghan 36.5-25.5 1971-72 Bloomington Kay Hutsell Beech Grove Bill Bane 33.5-33 1970-71 Bloomington Kay Hutsell Penn Richard Daffinee 54-22 1969-70 Bloomington Kay Hutsell North Central (Indpls.) Keith Farrand 43-34 1968-69 Bloomington Kay Hutsell North Central (Indpls.) Keith Farrand 28-23 1967-68 Elkhart Rollie Hoover Franklin Central Allen Morgan 34-23 1966-67 Indianapolis Shortridge George Bohlin Franklin Central -- 25-22 1965-66 South Bend Adams Morris Aronson Carmel -- 28-22 1964-65 Indianapolis Arlington Jim Ellis Kokomo -- 45-23 1963-64 Southport Chauncey McDaniel Indianapolis Arlington -- 33-29 1962-63 Hammond Don Clark Anderson Don Pyle 27-24 1961-62 Hammond Don Clark South Bend Central -- 31-25 1960-61 Indianapolis Wood Frank Svarczkopf New Albany -- 24-22 1959-60 Indianapolis Wood Frank Svarczkopf Southport -- 32-27 Bloomington High School 1958-59 Indianapolis Shortridge Paul Dill Southport -- 37-32 Lafayette Jefferson High School 1957-58 Indianapolis Broad Ripple, Richmond (Co-Champions) William Sirka Charles Hilton -- -- 25-25 Bloomington High School 1956-57 Bloomington Clifford Myers Southport -- 44-35

1988-89 1st Place Chesterton - Coach Bob Trzeciak, Points 59.5 2nd Place Lawrence North - Coach Frank Svarczkopf, Points 51 Hard for me to recall, but I though Chesterton only had 3-4 placers that year. Kind of tells you how well Yorktown did THIS year.