Wrestling Scholar

Yes, everybody shakes hands after the competition is over. You don't see in football players shaking the coaches hands after every touchdown, you don't see baseball players shaking the coaches hands at the end of every inning. You don't see basketball players shaking hands after every quarter and you don't see tennis players shaking the coaches hands at change overs. Nobody is saying the coaches didn't shake hands at the end of the match.

I think the importance of getting the correct top 8, is that this is our version of recognizing kids for all state recognition. In most other sports its voted on and they take the work of the whole season. In wrestling, its what you do at the state tournament, so I think we ought to do to get the right kids the right placement. I think its discouraging for a kid who has beaten another kid, but that weaker wrestler gets all state because he has a better draw.

I agree with you on everything exept terminology. I would call it "consolaton to 5th place". Wrestlebacks by definition require a wrestler to wrestle back from the championhips side of bracket via cross bracketing to wrestle a wrestler in the losers side. I say we don't call this format a "wrestle back" but a consolation bracket.

I know some coaches fist bump instead of the hand shake only for the concern of spreading communicable diseases. Keep in mind you have sweaty wrestlers whose hands have a lot of germs on it at that moment. I hope you're not construing that as poor sportsmanship. I believe the wrestling community has no problem with this practice.

Ok Sliga wins the hypothectical match against Robinson. But what about Sliga vs L Swain?

I agree that TL will have more than 2, and definitely not the two toughest sectionals in the state. I wouldn't say Lafayette Jeff is extremely weak, they still put 7 into the regionals and will be a factor at 170 and HWY and maybe 120. Also WL beat Delphi at sectionals and I think will get more into finals and qualify as many to SS than Delphi. WL to SS = 145,160,170,182,HWY (maybe 195) Delphi to SS= 120,145,152,220,HWY Just curious, why do you think Hickman is a sure win at 138? Who has he beat this season?

I got Twin Lakes winning at 126, 152,160,170,182 - So Jeff 9 - TL 5

The scholar's thoughts on the Regional. 1. Harrison edges out Twin Lakes for the team title. 2. 106 is the most loaded weight for this regional (3 semi-state ranked wrestlers). Davis Beats Johnson though in a close match. Also very good first round match with 2 guys with good wrestlers with Miller and Layer. Don't be late as they'll be up first. 3. Lukaszka looks good at 113 and should be be able to handle this field. 4. Alderman is the class at 120. But key match is Chambers vs Inman. Chambers I think outwrestled Alderman at sectional but made a big mental mistake. I'm calling Alderman Chambers rematch. Widner beats Strawsma. 5. Blake Denton is my stone cold lock at 126. 6. Atkinson (BC)looks like he's peaking at the right time. He should be in the finals vs WL kid. Is Carithers 100% yet, didn't look at sectional. 7.Roetker (H) over Hickman (Ren). Yea Roetker has 9 losses, but a tough schedule. 8. 145 is a solid weight. Jeff sectional puts 3 in her. Van Meter is peaking at the right time and beats Madison again just as soundly. 9. Thomas over Armuth based on experience. But Thomas better wrestle a smart match as Armuth is dangerous and no way he loses first round. 10. 160 is a solid weight class. Hileman over Medrano. Maybe with a good shoulder, Medrano could win, but Hileman wins here. 11. 170 is deep and tough. I'll put the West central kid over Wilkinson (Jeff). But not confident in that pick. I think Jeff sectional gets 3 in here. 12. 182- Doty (WIN) probably wins this with a wide open weight class with a lot of opportunity for upsets. TL probably gets 3 here. 13. 195- Ricks over Winkle, but definitely one I'm looking forward to. Winkle better bring A game in semis vs Beruman(D). 14. 220- Myer should get the nod here, but the West Central kid brings it. Another fun match thats a toss up. 15. HWT- Duvall has some power. Rematch of Sectional here with Franco in the final and with similar results.

Stallling is like the strike zone in baseball. Every ref has a different one. I think the problem in wrestling though is some refs metaphoric stike zones are 3 inches by 3 inches, and some other refs are 3 yards by 3 yards. Also said, everytime stalling is called (legit or not), a majority of the fans and coaches complain. As a result officials become more and more reluctant to call it. My request to officials is that in their association meetings, they discuss stalling and with video try to regulate the stalling call to incorporate more consistency. Maybe some of the associations are doing this.

But what if one of these teams has a kid with the knickname "Moose". Then they'd you were cheering for them.

I don't think that's best example. I assume you're referring to the University of Miami football team, and I don't think any of premier wrestling teams have boosters that are paying cash to kids, having huge parties, providing hookers and providing abortions as alleged at Miami for wrestling recruits coming to their school just to wrestle. If a transfer is OK'd by an AD, then the kid is another guy coming out for the team. Yes, every wrestling coach condones enthusiastically wrestlers coming out for the team.

There's a huge difference. One is an infraction of the rules and the other isn't. Id really like to the coach that would turn away a kid from a sport because he transferred from another school just because he didn't think it was right.

Fabio, I totally agree with you here. I'm going to bring out the grass is always greener on the other side lesson. You said you've seen a lot of cases of kids transferring. But I would suspect that some kids that transfer to these premier programs, and find out it was a mistake. They get there and maybe believe they're better than they really are, and can't break the lineup. They end up as a great JV wrestler, but never get that shot at the state tournament and end up regretting their decision to transfer. Have you seen this happen in your experience?

I didn't say it was fair, right or that its good for wrestling. It also it happens in other sports, the strong get stonger and the weak get weaker. I'll reference Fabio's colorful metaphor about girl friends being stolen. Do you remember the guy that got all the girls, or even took your girl. Everybody was jealous of that guy and sometimes hated him, but it was real. But you don't give up, you just keep working, hit the weights, got some new cologne and clothes, and make yourself more attractive, you might keep some of the girls around.

Look at this in a hypothetical perspective. Say a wrestling dad has a son in the age range of 9-12, is showing a lot of potential and will go to high school at one of the schools in PM sectional. The dad attends the sectional this weekend, and sees PM almost run the table and squash the school his son is scheduled to go to. The dad thinks, in 5 years my kid will be the one losing to PM and has a very limited chance of making state. He probably thinks how can I get my kid in the PM program makes it happen. PM doesn't need to recruit. What recruits for PM is there results and the flexibility of open enrollment.

Stalling is way to inconsistent, and probably not called enough. It always needs to be something officials associations should put as a point of emphasis and focus on the consistency in each situation. The stalling call that irks me the most and I saw 5 times this weekend is when the top wrestler puts legs in, and the bottom guy is fighting to keep flat from getting turned. They always call the bottom guy for stalling. I've seen so many guys put legs just to ride and not try to turn, but they never call stalling on the leg rider.

1. I hope the people who enforce this rule can distinguish between an athlete switching schools because he wants to switch schools go to a better program and a kid switching schools because he was coerced/recruited by a coach on the staff of a better program. I'd bet in most cases, its the athletete wanting to switch and less recriting by the coach. 2. And if it is recruiting, its extremely difficult to prove and enforce. And the rule is so vaguely and poorly written, if somebody does enforce it the IHSAA better bump up there legal budget, bucause a lawyer will eat this up. 3. If it does happen in wrestling, which is so low on the IHSAA radar, they probably wont spend the energy going after a wrestler. 4. This is contradictory to the recent message and path of the Indiana dept of Education. I'm talking about recent legislation (wont go into detail) that promotes the students choice to transfer schools based on Educational standards and open enrollment. Lets be honest, the voucher system is a huge incentive for a kid to transfer schools to the private schools who most likely have better athletic programs. And how are we going to be able to judge a kid if he transfers for academic or athletic purposes. 5. The IHSAA is sick if they go after 10 year olds for transferring schools.

Van Meter is the wrestler that surprised me the most at sectionals as he seems to be peaking at the right time. Getting down to 145 for him was good, as he looks strong there. His sectional wasn't a push over either

Armouth looked very good in the finals and dominated Mote. I think Armouth has a shot at Thomas.

I don't have access to the best college coaches to ask them their opinion, but have you really heard any coaches say "Indiana wrestling in decline"? I do have access to some reference materials and internet, but have never read a quote to that affect. Thats a pretty big statement to generalize, do you have a reference to back that up?

The match was very close at 2-1 and only a 3rd period takedown. This could go either way.

Whats wrong with following both sectionals. There's a lot of schools with some regional connections and its just natural to compare. You're right, someone needs to relax. My 10 thoughts on the Jeff sectional. 1. Harrison narrowly edges out Delphi for team. 2. Probably only two guys in sectional with firepower to place at State ( Ricks and Duvall). And Duvall is a question mark? I don't think he's been tested from top notch competition. Ricks is the real deal. 3. 145 and 170 are deep and wide open. Anybody could win these two weights. I think winner of Vasquez Madison match will be the winner at 145, (is Vasquez healthy). 4. Leonard is undefeated at 138, but won't be after this weekend. Roetker is too much for him. 5. Hancock vs Medrano looks like a good match. Medrano probably favored but sure has had bad luck with health this year. Will it continue. 6. Will Carithers be able to recover from an appenicitis. Another question mark. 7. Houston vs Myer is a fun rematch that went overtime the first time. I think Myer figures a way to take down Houston. 8. Benton Central for third team, West Lafayette fourth. 9. Besides Ricks and Duvall- Next best chance at Potential state qualifiers if the ball bounces right (Davis? Alderman? Lukaszka? 10. 152 is also a deep weight class, but Mote wins. Bonus: 106-Davis 113-Lukaszka 120-Alderman 126-Bailey 132 -Atkinson- (if Carrither forfiets) 138-Roetker 145-Vaszquez 152-Mote 160-Hancock 170-Doty 182-Edmunds 195-Ricks (Stone Cold Lock) 220-Myer 285-Duvall

The state qualification process in tennis is more unfair and more complicated than the wrestling process. In just a quick summary for tennis, sectionals start out in a team competition. And in the match the #1 players from #1 doubles team play each other. Only the teams are seeded. Note only the #1 singles and #1 doubles player can qualify for state and only 8 singles players and 8 doubs teams qualify. There are two ways to qualify, the four undefeated individual players and doubs team at team semi-state qualify. Also, if your team loses at sectional and regional and you individually haven't lost, you're thrown into an individual tournament. The four winners from each individual tournament also qualify. Like I said "complicated", and a good example of unfairness, the 4th rated player in the state this year was in the same sectional as the runner-up at State. The 4th rated player lost a close match at sectional, and his season was done at sectional. In tennis the disparity between the talent levels at sectional is huge, as the really good players are concentrated around tennis clubs in Indy with some good players in Fort Wayne and NW Indiana. Just to compare it to wrestling, just imagine the 4th best wrestler out all weight classes lost at sectional. That would be big news.

You're right, Red is ranked on intermat but the only Indiana kid at 106.

Just to play devils advocate. Ohio has four 106 lbs in the top 20 and Indiana doesn't have anybody ranked. Also, just because 7 guys are undefeated doesn't mean that its tougher than another weight class. All it means is there's an unusually high amount of better guys that haven't wrestled each other. For example, what if the 2-7 ranked guys at the 145 weight class wrestled the #1 guy. You only have one undefeated werestler out of the top 7. Does that mean its not as tough as 106.