manvswild1

Because population is in the millions of people and school size still means 14 wrestlers. Also there are more schools to choose from in other states. California has 20,000 wrestlers we are about a fifth of that on a good day. 308 schools is not that many and not enough to class. where california i would venture to say has almost 5 times the school numbers. They should have 5 times the wrestlers and they do not. Basically were right where we should be.

Even if thats the case the numbers for the whole tournement are down to about a third of what they were. They may be on a rise but I truly dought there will be anything close to how it was before the classing of the sport. Thats a fact.

There population is 3 times what we are. According to the numbers that I have seen a solid wrestling state should have about 1 D1 wrestler for every 100,000 people. Thats true for most states besides Iowa there well over there mark. Then again i think Iowa wrestling has been part of there communities for decades so that makes sense. Pennsylvania has 14 schools so enough said on there success. North Carolina has 8 so there success is rough on the edges. Basically indiana is probably a lil above where we should be as a state. We have had 2 top 25 teams for many years and its about where we should be. Lastly show me proof that class wrestling has in any way rose the college D1 level wrestlers within a state. Thats you arguement lets see the proof. Its not true.

Besides Florida and Maryland every other state has more D1 programs. People tend to recruit within states besides states like new york that have 7 D1 colleges. So if you want more Indiana success have more D1 colleges not classes.

In the 1990's an estimated 1.55 million people attended high school state tournement games. Now the numbers are about one third of that. In 1990 41,046 fans attended the state finals where today only 31,828 fans watch all four of the games combined. There's your numbers. It hurts the sport.

I think this shows that there is something to be said for a one class system. The state tournement allows a great wrestler too have 15 matches usually over half against quality wrestlers. Being able to win close matches in tight situations has obviously helped our wrestlers at the college level. I am proud to say our system has one champion. The best wrestle the best and both wrestlers are better for that. Win loose or draw the tournement allows a wrestler to get tested several times which helps them progress in tight match situations.

This is a very interesting poll and we thank you for bringing in the numbers. Here it doesn't look like class wrestling is doing the system justice at the college level, it looks like state programs are. I mean besides new jersey every state has more then our total number of our college wrestlers being recruited in state. Again the big ten is more dominate then any other college division with Indiana having solid programs. I read some articles from Iowa a while back that a lot of high ranking wrestling members of the state were not to fond of picking up tshirts. People like to stay within their own sate and thats what helps them get the cream of their own crop. If we had 8 college programs I am sure we would smoke North Carolina on college wrestlers. If anyone can show that there is a link between class wrestling and college success I would like to see it. I believe this shows no linkage to that. Also the three top placers this year from Indiana went out of state. If we had that type of roster on Indiana or Purdue we would be a top 5 team for sure. Two runners up Tshirts scoring more points Escobedo all American. Hernandez and Kinser scoring points. Not saying we would have one the thing but state by state we are definatly top five with our current college atheletes.

Another question I would like to ask what will we do after the state starts consolidating all these schools like they say there going to. Everyone may be in one class in the next 10 years. Y2j you never look at the downsides because this issue would hurt your situation. People who hae have voted and your wrong.

Triton's basketball may be up but lets face it on a whole its down. I don't want wrestling to help some if it hurts the whole. You should look at basketballs numbers and then decide.

60 percent individual after day one.

why ban me. This site does have an agenda. if they do ban me it just shows that this boards greatest patriot, has to have his voice snipped. You may not like me but I do stand for a just cause purifying the sport. Keeping the good that is Indiana wrestling.

Siiiikkkeee its an individual sport like it or not

Well maybe our program doesn't have the community behind it yet but we will get it and have success for year to come. The votes still say its an individual thing but maybe the focus will be shifted a lil more to a team thing if the successful programs do it.

Maybe i am wrong. I am not going to start a fight about it to most this is an individual sport with a tea side tacked on.

And the wrestlers would tell you i want an individual title more then anything.

Oh make fun of the wrestlers your a real piece of work. Honestly I thought you were for the kids. A lot of these kids work pretty hard to get where they are and you want to come down on them screw you. Besides that we will have quality programs coming up. If you want to yell at me fine if you want to take a shot at the kids now we got a problem. Your nothing but a punk.

I have never coached and my kids attend a triton middle school. Why should that matter?

They should be but as I have stated before its all about the community if I remember right there has been big clubs up in that area that do mighty fine in state now a days and I would say that this group of kids probably were trained within those clubs.

absolutly agree but one great individual can make 14 good individuals by practicing with them. Where as 14 bad individuals make 14 bad wrestlers. Your only as good as your compition. Thats why good individuals can start great programs. Sounds like the typical answer to someone asking about teams its the political answer. You can tell he was brought up right though.

Why is it a caveman attitude to want to be the best? I think it is liberal attitudes like these that make some of the worst rules. Lets not keep track of score in little leagues and all those rediculous things. Guess what life is a compitition and you can achieve whatever you like as long as you put in the work. That includes state titles individual and team. Were making equality more important then anything and in changing systems we make it less equal. Matre Dei will win 80 in a row if we change it. Is that equal? Is that better then our current system? So take your caveman lines and shove them just because I would like my child to no a thing or two about compition and every man being equal doesn't mean I am a caveman. Maybe a lil old fashion but nothing wrong with that.

they made it to team state if i rememeber right. I would say yes there a solid team.

The Ihsaa gets paid by the fans and wrestlers so maybe you should rethink those stratagies. This is not a dictatorship and yoru facts are scewed to what you would like to believe. Big deal 70% of coaches liked the change the majority of the people did not. Didn't you say you wanted class wrestling for the good of the sport? Fans don't like it. So don't do it. Numbers won't go up when support goes down. Its as simple as that. Football classing is great for cause there are not things like wieght classes to equal the compitition, but compare wrestling to basketball. The state has lost money on attendance since the change has occured, also participation ammoung other things are down. Wrestling is way more like basketball then football when you look at team size and ability to succeed even with a smaller school. Yes, economics are different for Matre Dei, but does that mean the richer you are the better you are at wrestling. What is your point I see the difference I just do not see how it would effect wrestling performance. Maybe they get an extra camp or something but your program could be doing what there doing. I am not crying I don't want the change your the one whos trying to shove it down our throats. Wrestlers didn't like it in Illinois enough said if your not changing it for them then shut it.

You think these great teams just pop out of no where? Great individuals started every great team. Maybe its one guy who made it to state and got two more guys out and one of them made it. After the ball gets rolling great teams get made. If everyone is bad no one comes out for the team if teams can get a few staters numbers go up. When numbers go up more oportunities for staters.

Yeah but what generates more attention 4 guys going to state or the team having an .800 record. Be honest with yourself. More attention usually means more community envolvement which means more wrestlers which means better teams.

Quote from: manvswild1 on Today at 04:37:35 AM You have the agenda and you scew everything. Please tell me what I have "screwed up," I'm curious as to what I have done so deeply wrong. Quote from: manvswild1 on Today at 04:37:35 AM Illinois has classes i think you said and there fans voted that it hurt the sport. Approximately 70% of the coaches voted to add another class. I think that says enough about the people that know more about the sport than the fans. I would trust people that are on the coaching side knowing what is best for the sport. Your an idiot you just scewed that. The facts are that coaches wrestlers and fans were polled and they decided it was bad for the system. You can take your selected group and say see coaches didn't like it, but fact of the matter is wrestling people of this state pay for the services of the ihsaa. You work for me and I do not work for you. So my opinion does matter and i will continue saying it. Quote from: manvswild1 on Today at 04:37:35 AM I also want to no why wrestling less competition throughout a season will benifit the wrestler. It only benifits the small school coaches. Small school coaches are just ego driven and thats a fact. "Wow that is a strong statement. I 100% disagree on that one. If we are so ego driven why would Garrett revamp their schedule to include Bellmont, Yorktown, Peru, LaPorte and Huntington North? " Well your school must be competitive if they are able to sign schools like that so why are you crying. If its not to be in a small class to have a false sense of accomplisment at the team level. Everyone wants their programs to succeed people who really want it work harder instead of try and change the system to fit their own wants. "Mater Dei can do what they want if and when class wrestling is implemented. The IHSAA allows for schools to bump up a class in other classed sports. Their administration and coaches can decide what is best for them. It is not my decision on what they would do." Quote from: manvswild1 on Today at 04:37:35 AM I want to know why we need to change a sysytem that has had a smaller school win the wrestling state title 5 of the last ten years. "Because wrestling is dying at the small school level. Plain and simple wrestling is not healthy at smaller schools. Mater Dei is not a typical small school due to the fact that they are a parochial school. If you can show me a public school of any size that has 99% graduation rate, 98% attendance, and 95% of their students that attend a two or four year college after graduation I will consider them a typical small school." So really what your saying is screw the smaller class with matre dei in it. Your out for you and only you. Its clear to see you have no answers for that question. The truth is they compete at high levels in any division just like all schools can. Who cares how many people they graduate that has nothing to do with the wrestling aspect of things. If you believe it has a big deal to do with the wrestling why don't you work on improving attendance and different things like that instead of trying to descecrate the sport of wrestling. If you care about the wrestlers more then you care about yourselfs you would do whats best for them and thats to not class an individual sport like wrestling. "I care about the kids and the health of the sport. The health of the sport at the small school level is not good. Too many teams struggle to field a full team and they are losing kids year in year out due to little to no success." How many of the bottom 100 schools by size fill a whole wrestling roster. If we take a 3 class system we already down to 102 teams. I just want to know how many teams would actually have a chance at a state title in this system. It would be an absolute joke and I hate to tell you this but classing the sport the bad teams would still be bad. Like in football most teams tend to wrestle schools of the same skill level and these teams that can't fill a roster won't have any more wrestler because there still going to be bad in the new system. Win a community to win a program don't try and make everything equal it will never ever be. Remember the ihsaa works for us and not us for them. Coaches can think what they want but we still have a say, and this is the USA Y2J and my opinion matters just as much as yours wheater your a coach or not.