NLCards

And their large schools field smaller teams -- ones again indicating that class wrestling helps small schools and hurts large ones. Pretty much status quo.

You have a bit of a sample size issue when you are comparing 50 schools to 201 and 20 schools to 89, so I'm not sure the "full forfeit difference" is quite as telling as one might think at first look. And looking at the numbers a bit closer you will see the following:
 
IN-OH FF difference
small schools -- IN has 1.23 more FF/school
large schools -- OH has .77 more FF/school
 
IN-KS FF difference
small schools -- IN has .91 more FF/school
large schools -- KS has .77 more FF/school
 
IN-MI FF difference
small schools -- IN has .93 more FF/school
large schools -- MI has 1.39 more FF/school
 
So, the largest discrepancy is actually between IN and MI large schools. And -- if we take the average of the comparison's between IN and the 3 other states we see that IN has on average 1.02 more FF in the small schools than the other three states, and the other 3 states have on average .98 more FF in the larger schools. Really not as much discrepancy as one might think. Seems like more evidence of just shifting the problem from small schools to large one's. That doesn't seem like much of a solution to me.

I'm not saying #2 and #3 are untrue. What I am saying is that they don't answer the question I asked. While they are both very good arguments for how class wrestling can help smaller schools, they don't answer, "Why do Kansas and Ohio (and now also Michigan) have LESS participation in wrestling at large schools than Indiana?" That is the question that I am interested in.

The system actually does appear to be doing at least as well as the states where Y2 has provided data in terms of total participation. Overall forfeits of the 5 states compared are lowest in Indiana. However, I never said, "keep it how it is" rather explore other options that help participation across the board, not just redistribute the forfeits to different schools. From he data provided, class wrestling does not appear to be the answer to increase overall participation.

I don't think it's more difficult or unfair for large schools in a class system, I've not seen that argument made. However, it does appear that forfeits are up in large schools in a classed system. This thread is about forfeits, and shifting forfeits from small schools to large schools isn't a good way to solve the growing forfeit issue. It looks to me like the people in favor of that are only in favor of helping small schools not in favor of helping wrestling overall.

Quote the part on sample size, cut the rest of the post showing why the numbers aren't quite as telling as they might first appear. Classy.

And their large schools field smaller teams -- ones again indicating that class wrestling helps small schools and hurts large ones. Pretty much status quo.

I haven't seen any, I think looking for some would be a fair next step --- but I also haven't seen any data that suggest to me that classed wrestling is the solution.

Hahahaha -- you have zero answer other than some non-sense accusation that no reasonable person would gather from the statements I've made. I personally have nothing against small schools -- I coached at one for many years. But, as I said in the post you quoted, "Instead, I think looking into different solutions, like many others in this thread have proposed, that are good for everyone is a much better solution."

Hahahaha -- you have zero answer other than some non-sense accusation that no reasonable person would gather from the statements I've made. I personally have nothing against small schools -- I coached at one for many years. But, as I said in the post you quoted, "Instead, I think looking into different solutions, like many others in this thread have proposed, that are good for everyone is a much better solution."

Because I'm not proposing a massive change to the system only to spread the pain out differently. It's rather disheartening to me that your answer is (paraphrasing) "We've hurt small schools long enough, lets change things and hurt the large school for a change. Who's with me!!!!!" Instead, I think looking into different solutions, like many others in this thread have proposed, that are good for everyone is a much better solution. Not just doing whatever is best for one group.

Ok -- so you believe that class wrestling actually hurts large schools. Which leads me to my second (and more important) question. Why is it OK to hurt one group of athletes (large school wrestlers) in order to help a second group of athletes (small school wrestlers)? And does hurting one group in order to help another really mean that class wrestling "works?"

High school and lower level wrestling should cater to the masses not just to the elite -- that means folkstyle. My opinion is that if we changed to freestyle, wrestling would be a less popular sport in the US. Sorry, but only a VERY small percentage of successful wrestlers and an even MUCH smaller percentage of all wrestlers are ever going to wrestle on the international or even national stage. Catering to the few elite at the expense of the masses is a bad idea.

High school and lower level wrestling should cater to the masses not just to the elite -- that means folkstyle. My opinion is that if we changed to freestyle, wrestling would be a less popular sport in the US. Sorry, but only a VERY small percentage of successful wrestlers and an even MUCH smaller percentage of all wrestlers are ever going to wrestle on the international or even national stage. Catering to the few elite at the expense of the masses is a bad idea.