hammer

Congratulations to your son!  That is a great accomplishment, in my opinion! 

That was awesome!  He wrestled his match, and is a National Championship as a Freshman!

Andy Uhl from East Noble 99- SQ, 00- 4th , 01-3rd, 02-2nd lost to Andre Hernandez from Griffith in the finals senior year then went on to be a DII College National Champion for the University of Findley Roughnecks he pretty much paved the way for East Noble wrestling

I thought he beat Hernandez in the semis and lost to Hector Mendez in the finals?

Thomas Hammock - Bishop Luers.  3rd as both a JR and a SR. 

I think I have seen it posted that Jade McCammon lost in the ticket round at SS all 4 years. 

Then you can throw in what the accomplishment looked like on paper vs. what the actual circumstances/level of competition was. In some cases studs end up taking out young studs which take a little away from their total accomplishments on paper, but not from the great talent they matured into.  Angel beats out Reece to prevent him from being a 4 time state champ, then Reece's beats Andrew (yes Howe was that small once) to prevent him from being a 4 time state champ.  From that perspectice its hard not to at least mention guys like Reece or Andrew in a list of top guys even if they were only 3 time champs. 

 

Too  many variables betweeb generations, competition level, high school season or all styles, in-state vs national accomplishments, lifetime accomplishments vs. in a certain time frame vs one year,  to ever narrow it down.  Better just to list some big names and how they have contributed to IN national recognition in wrestling.

I believe that it is stretching it to say that Reece would have won State at 112, if not for Angel.  More likely, he would have won it if not for his own teammate at 103.

Considering there have probably been about 10 freshman state champions in the history of Indiana wrestling no matter the age they are it is an elite club. 

 

Eric Galka may have been 14 when he won state also, he was a first year cadet his freshman year.

Galka looked very young as a Freshman. 

184 makes the most sense, but I have no inside knowledge.

This is the KEY issue. If the following lineup shows up for ILLINOIS, it's going to be a long day for the INDIANA squad.

 

106lbs: 2A --Nkosi Moody, Sr. Nationally Ranked.

113lbs: 2A --Tommy Pawelski, Sr. Signed with Stanford.

120lbs: 2A--BJ McGee, Sr. Natonally Ranked, signed with Mizzou; 3A Sebastian Pique, Sr. in/out of the National Rankings.

126lbs: 2A-Cameron Kennedy, Sr. or Jordan Laster, Sr., signed with Princeton. 3A--Jordan Northrop, in/out of the National Rankings

132lbs: 3A George Fisher, Sr. Nationally Ranked, signed with Michigan.

138lbs: 3A Dem Spraggins, Sr. in/out National Rankings. 3A Cullen Cummings, Sr.

145lbs: 3A Wade Lardy, Sr. Runner-up to Bryce Brill. 3A Justin Weber, Sr., signed with Wisconsin.

152lbs: 3A Kyle Langenderfer, 2X State Champ, Nationally Ranked; Brian Murphy, Sr., Ranked 2nd in the nation, signed with Michigan.

160lbs: 3A CJ Brucki, Sr., or Hunter Rollins, Sr. 2A Vosburgh, Friedman, or Frazier.

170lbs: 3A Colin Holler, Sr. Nationally Ranked, signed with S.Dakota St.; Dan Rowland, Sr. State Runner-up

182lbs: 3A Joe Arioloa, Sr., Nationally Ranked and State Champion.

195lbs: 3A Ricky Robertson, Sr., Nationally Ranked-signed with Wisconsin (I believe?); Jordan Ellingwood, Sr., Nationally Ranked and has beaten Sliga in the past...but Sliga has beaten him too, if I recall?

220lbs: 3A Tom Howell, Sr. State Champion.

285lbs: 3A Andrew Geers, Sr., lost to Brian Allen-one of the nation's best HWT's who is a junior.

 

This list doesn't have the 1A wrestlers included but there are many strong 1A kids.

If their line up closely resembles this, it could get ugly!

Boston had a close match against a Frosh or soph in ky. Boston will likely meet up with Dezmber from union county who lost to Kennedy Floyd central 7-8.

 

 

I think if he would have state in Indiana the competition would have been tougher than Kentucky. Imo

Better in state competition, here, likely.  But I am guessing that KY doesn't share IN's stupid travel rules.

A personal favorite of mine....2003 Adam Myers vs Brandon Garner

Was that the one that Garner spent 5:30 minutes attacking, while Myers did no attacking, and then Myers scored right at the end to win?  If so, that match should be under the "losing with class" topic.  Garner never complained, and he had every right to.  He just shook hands in the middle and walked off.

Compare both of their high school careers...Sliga, assuming he wins out which I believe he will, has lost 4-5? Matches...Howe's only loss was in the finals match too Reece Humphrey by a point...I'm not saying Sliga isn't tough as nails, but I think Howe would beat him pretty easily

I guess I have a difference in opinion, because of the size difference.  Sliga taking 3rd as a freshman, at that weight class, in my opinion, is as impressive of any freshman performance that I have seen.  He was a 14/15 y/o kid wrestling mostly 17/18 y/o kids.  I don't knock him for losing the few matches that he did.  Does anyone have any knowledge of Howe defeating opponents as much larger that Sliga is as a senior, when Howe was a senior?

He only major decisions Duckworth from Union County in the finals at state. He was 2 points away from a tech fall though...I would give the nod to Howe though seeing as Duckworth beat Sliga too...yes that was a couple of years ago but still something to go by

Senior Duckworth vs. Freshman Sliga is not a good thing to go on, in my opinion.  You have to compare wrestlers when they are the same age, to have a fair comparison.  Senior Howe vs. Senior Sliga would be a good match.  I would expect low scoring, because Howe would be giving up a lot of size.  Howe is one of the greatest, but Sliga is in that discussion, too.

Oh brother - this again?  Howe would destroy Sliga, even giving up 20 lbs, no disrespect to Mr. Sliga.

 

Howe was college ready right away - went 2nd, 1st, and 3rd at the NCAA's.  Do you know how hard it is for a true freshman to place at 165? That guy has a head you could beat with a tire iron and he would not feel it.  He would likely be considered Indiana's best high school wrestling product to date. 

 

Everyone can agree that Mr. Sliga is accomplished at the Cadet level, has the opportunity to go 3,3,1,1 in Indiana, but rarely do you find big guys committed to wrestling full time, thus one could question the level of competition he faced in Indiana.  Because of that, we may not be able to fully appreciate Sliga's credentials until is college career is progressing.  That's why you look at the NCAA rankings each year at 197, you see a lot of no-names guys from MAC schools, Wyoming, mid-size Pennsylvania schools, etc. because these guys were probably very good football players / athletes that also wrestled part time, but  then dedicate full time to wrestling in college and take off...

Do you know how hard it it is to place at 189# as a Freshman in IN?  I would guess that over the past 30 years, that has happened less often than a true freshman to place in the NCAAs at 165.

He won on DQ.

Sorry this touch screen screws me up when I'm in a hurry sorry to confuse you

Does your touch screen have no (.) or (,)?  Both would help in making your posts make more sense. 

Not arguing against wrestle backs at all, but someone said that wrestle backs are the way to ensure the best 8 are the state placers.  I would like to counter that with as long as we take 4, and only 4 from each Semistate, that we will rarely, if ever, see the 8 best wrestlers placer.  Honestly, the only way to ensure that, would be if we took 8 from each Semistate.  I know that I have seen years where you could make a strong argument that a couple kids from a given Semistate, in the same class, got left behind, and not just because of draws.  They were just the 5th and 6th best kids in that weight class at that Semistate.  They also might have been the 6th and 7th kids in that State in that weight class.

I'm not convinced it's that easy.

 

That is a lot of weight to give up and it's not like Robinson is a cream puff.  He is likely the best pure athlete in the sport right now.  I would be dumb to suggest that he is anywhere near as good a "wrestler" in the technical sense, but I think it would be much closer than a major.  If they wrestled 10 times it would probably be 7-3 in favor of Sliga but I wouldn't be surprised if Gelen did better.

If they wrestled multiple times, I think there could be some close matches, but I would imagine they would have to wrestle a lot more than 10 times before Robinson could win. 

 

Who were the twins that moved in from Alabama?  They were awesome on their feet but nothing on top and I don't think they were great on bottom so neither one ever on state championship.

Milius

I am sure Donte is honored to be nominated, considering he has yet to win a state title.  The hwt. chosen for the team is a 3X Prep Champ from Blair.  His resume is quite impressive.

I enjoy watching the guys who are pinners.

While I agree that stalling is often called questionably, one thing that every one needs to remember, is that even within the rules, the same match will often be officiated differently, depending on who is officiating.  Look at stalemate calls, and stalemate non-calls.  If a ref makes a stalemate call, early, the wrestler who was in better position at the time is going to be upset.  If the ref doesn't call a stalemate when he should, and it eventually leads to a take down, the wrestler who gives up the take down is going to be upset, and for good reason.  You just have to adjust to how the match is reffed.  As long as the ref is consistent......if not, then there are plenty of reasons to complain.

Because you are in the match until the final whistle blows.    No other sport that I know of has anything comparable to the great equalizer, the pin fall!

I think his point is that wrestling in a stupid manner can cost your team, and can cause injuries to kids that are otherwise highly avoidable.

As someone who once coached a team loaded with first year wrestlers, I will attempt to give ChargerDad some perspective, although I have my doubts as to it being well received.  I took over a program that was in the bottom of our conference.  The enthusiasm of a coaching change, though, helped this team go from less than 10 wrestlers, to around 30.  We opened our season with a dual against the best team in our conference, by far.  We got hammered!  I lost 10 of those kids by our next meet.  Some of them had some pretty good potential, but were just really inexperienced, and not prepared to get thrown to the wolves.  The next year, when the same situation came up, I chose to wrestler my experienced wrestlers varsity, and the new kids in jv matches.  That meant that we wrestled some kids jv in weights that we forfeited varsity.  The opposing coach didn't like that, and voiced his opinion about it, but not to me, directly, but to the referee.  The referee, and a former coach both told me the same thing,"always remember that it's the other coach's job to coach his team, and your job to coach your team.  You have to do what's best for your team."