JakeandBreighton

I know I'm going to get a little off topic with this one but though I recalled having to deal with his headlock a lot.  But maybe old age is creeping in and I'm thinking of someone else.

idk, I think he had a good head lock as well. He spladled Kieth from Portage either ticket round, or Friday night. I'm thinking Friday night. I know he use to stick his leg out, baiting you to take it, so he could do one or the other.

Ask Coach Pendoski, he'll agree with me

Cassidy Wilson

I remember back in my day before the interweb when just having to wrestle someone from Delta put the fear of Kahn in you.

I agree, that was when you were happy you had to wrestle Yorktown instead! Even though it still probably meant a loss!

Yorktown would :'(  if you brought Penn and Mishawaka over to the Ft Wayne Semi-State.  They wouldn't get 8 kids through that weak semi-state anymore!

 

HELL!  Penn would take 12-14 kids to state every year!

where was everyone during the early 80's, when that was the premier ss? Didn't see anyone saying send delta to Merriville or New Castle.

Baker was at 138 this year.

this was the only year both my son's placed. It's funny this one is posted, I talked to Drake Dewitts father Saturday at fwss. His son Drake, decided to focus on soccer, and Saturday was the first wrestling meet he had been to, since he made that decision. It was nice taking to him. It's nice catching up with allot of the dad's, of the sons my boys competed against.

http://65.61.23.146/tournaments/07%20tournaments/07indianastate.htm

I thought this was pretty cool. Lots of familiar names!

The one that stands out for me is Clayton Moore from Manchester.  Hasn't been ranked at all this year and untill sectional when he beat Kern wasn't even talked about in the SS Rankings.  He came out and wrestled his butt off beating Schmucker and then the upset of Lovejoy was a great match as well.  Then in the finals what a great triple OT match going down the wire with Campbell.  Last year he had a fantastic year and I truly thought he could make a run at State but was beaten by the BEAST Crume in the ticket round.

 

I'm really looking forward to watching him this weekend, and most definitely next year as well!

X2, that was pretty cool!

Can you show a break down, by class size, for the 3 classes? Also, when classing them, for next year, do you use the out going senior class, or incoming freshman class?

yeah, of course there are plenty of scenarios like that.  But we have to go off of averages and generalities to develop a scoring system.  We can't possibly incorporate all the what-ifs that don't normally happen.

what do you do to account for move ins, move outs, and incoming freshmen?

It seems that some people continue to forget that the IHSWCA State Duals are not a perfect animal but they are what we can have at this time based on IHSAA limitations etc etc.

 

1. we cannot have the event after individual state.

2. we cannot have a multiple week tournament series.

3. we cannot have a waiver to allow more weigh ins (scheduling points) for teams.

 

We have to have a single day event and do the best we can to get the most deserving teams invited.  That can only happen by having some type if a qualifying system in place.  Whether its right or wrong, there is a system and you do control your own destiny.  If your team wrestles well on the mat you can qualify.  If your team does not wrestle well you do not qualify.  Either way, I would rather have this system than a system that includes coaches polls (popularity contests), media polls (very few media outlets cover our sport very well), and any other type of "poll".

 

I will use our team at Evansville Memorial as an example.  The first year of the event we qualified and wrestled to a 2nd place finish losing to a tough Yorktown team in the finals.  Danville was clearly better than us but we got a good "seed" and we won a dual against a great Southmont team and then squeaked by Culver Academy in a tremendous semifinal.  It was a HUGE day for our program.  We were very excited.  We were also young.  We were sitting pretty to qualify again this year but then the sectional day arrived.  We had 3 underclassmen wrestle very poorly and we did not perform anywhere near what we were capable of.  We scored enough to make the "at large voting" list but we were not voted in.  Did I think the committee made a mistake not voting us in?  Yes.  Do I think we would have placed high this year in the 2A team duals had we been voted in? Yes.  However, I also don't have a problem with us not being there because the fact of the matter is that we did not wrestle ourselves into the event based on the system that is in place and we put our fate in the hands of others.

 

The qualifying system we have in place is not perfect but its had a TON of thought put into it.  Its been tweaked here and there and its pretty thorough.  Can a team get left out due to weird little quirky stuff like having 9 seniors in their lineup? Yes...and yes that stinks, but that team qualified this year didn't they?  In the end its about getting 12 "deserving" teams to the event.  Unfortunately there could be more than 12 deserving teams, just like in college football where there will be more than 4 deserving teams to get into the championship event next season.

 

Whether its fair or not, whether it has loopholes or not, you still qualify by how your team performs on the mat and I would rather have that than something else.  As a coach I know going in what my team has to do to qualify.  We can discuss that, we can make sure our team knows what its going to take to qualify and if the chips are stacked against us because we are senior laden or not.  Not everyone gets to qualify every year...some years your chances are better than others.  Its not perfect but its what we got and its 1000 times better than nothing.

 

lastly....one silver lining...look how many new teams wrestled in the event in 2A and 1A this year versus the first year???  Already this event has given 20-30 teams who would have NEVER made the IHSAA Team State the chance to be in a great event that I wish all coaches and wrestlers could experience at least once.  The IHSWCA State Duals is a great event and I thank the coaches association for putting in the hard work to make it a reality each year.

those are some valid points, but again, I don't see the state results, being the same as dual. Ask Penn State or Minnesota about that one.

So all these senior loaded teams...how did they perform last year in the state tourney? If they have so many great seniors wouldnt they have had a few staties and ticket rounders and regional champs last year?  Were these seniors move ins, under perform last year, were they hurt?? I have heard people complain about where they stack up and then when looking at their state performance they fit in exactly where they should based on performance in the state series.  I would be interested to see how all these senior loaded super teams did last season...Did these returning guys all qualify for semi state and a couple go to state last year?

again, I don't understand what that had to do with it. How many more seniors are there left in the state tourney, than all the rest. Our last state qualifier, didn't make it out of regionals till his senior year. You're saying you can't be a good senior, if you didn't go to ss or state. I'm arguing for the team. Peru had a good team this year, and was senior heavy, with like 9 ssq's and a state q retraining, and they were in the rankings, but didn't get an invite. Western did, and if they had last year's team, they would have done much better, but they had at least 2 ssq not come out, one moved, and 2 reg q graduated mid term. There are some many things, other than returning state placers from last year, that figure into this, that is not being figured in. That's my only point.

Unfortunately, you earn points right now in the tournament in proving whether you might be better than others next year.  This year's results, in a sense, don't matter.  With that said, if you can get up to about 260, you'll have a very nice resume when being considered in the voting.  You would need 6-7 victories in the first two rounds of semi-state (from the 18 potential matches available to you).  You have the greatest possibility for points this week among all the 2A teams in the state, in fact.  Otherwise, the system believes that your advancement of a bunch of guys out of a regional where the 5th and 6th best teams have Genius levels of 25 and 31 was mostly based on facing lesser competition.

Sorry, but that still doesn't explain how Whitko, Garrett, and Hamilton Heights are all ahead of us, and I think the closest score was 48-18. I don't think there's any way you can fairly rank dual meet teams, based on tourney scores. I think looking at the bcs system in college football, shows where this should be headed. Why not go to a 4 class system. Have rankings based on results posted on here, if a coach doesn't report, they obviously are not interested in the dual state. Have a media poll, and a coaches poll. Have 4 regionals per class host super 8's. Top to advance to state. Then do a tourney style for each class. It would take 2 Saturday's, but it would be a better dual format. Obviously, the yearly powerhouse teams will usually win, but each year would offer a senior heavy team a chance to see how they stack up.

Here's a scenario, you have 9 champs, I have a solid team. My 9 4th place finishers all lose decisions to your champs. My other 5 wrestlers, pin your other 5. My "TEAM" wins 30-27, but according to this formula, your team is considered better, because they went further in the individual tourney.

Now updated through regional

Sorry, I know this is loads of work, but I still don't understand how 3 teams we handily beat are a head of us, and going to be hard to catch, and we only have 3 seniors still wrestling.

You are right, Cause 10 through still isn't good enough to qualify for next year's 2A Team State.

Western only had 7 or 8 last year

It is usually an estimation.

haha, well it's almost my bedtime!

Why hasn't it started?

At 182 Anglin has pinned Shivley 3 times this season. Once in regular season twice in the tournament but I agree with everything else

they won't see each other till the final 4 any way

Oak Hill sends school record 9, 5 runner ups, 3 3rds, and a 4th.

I guess I don't understand the magic of the math. 2 trans that are way higher than us, we handily beat head to head thus year, and they lose more than we do this year. But it's what ever.

I was told there's a form you can fill out, so if your school decides not to go to regionals, or semi state, you can drive your child there. Anyone know where to go, to get this done, if it's not to late?

I seen the top four finishers for weight classes. Anyway you could get the scores?

I can email them to you, if you give me your email

Oak Hill Sectional

[table]

1Oak Hill244.5

2Kokomo200.5

3Western189

4Eastern (Greentown)153

5Marion127

6Eastbrook108

7Taylor87

8Mississinewa57

9Madison Grant54

10No Team[/td]

11No Team

12No Team

13No Team

14No Team

15No Team

16No Team

[/table]

106 Swisher EA, Wright KO, Bledsoe, MA, Lechner WE

113 Davenport OH, Downing MI, Elmore TA, Allen KO

120 Maddox WE, Nelson KO, Price MG, Reed EA

126 Hetzner EA, Gunter OH, Lowe KO, Heady WE

132 Bratcher EB, Smith OH, Arnold EA, Williams MA

138 Hinkle WE, Sholty TA, Curtis OH, Pharris EA

145 Feuerstein MA, Hardcastle OH, Turner EA, Wickline EB

152 Gaddis KO, Rucker TA, Braden WE, Johnson OH

160 B. Mullinix OH, Sarber TA, Webb MG, Turner MI

170 Ross KO, Elliot EB, Biddle EA, Cunningham OH

182 Hinkle WE, J Mullinix OH, Staggs EB, Hiles MA

195 McDorman WE, Hiles OH, Etherington KO, Bush EB

220 Miller KO, Ellis EA, Scott OH, Graham WE

HWT Perkins OH, Fitts KO, Ryan WE, Rigsby MA

 

I I'll post them this evening, what are you wanting to know?

Joe, McCown from Southwood at 182, is at 220. Also, Akers 160 from Northwestern is 35-0