FormerHornet

First, it is dumbfounding to me (assuming) grown men are arguing over the internet. Very childish from both constituents. Second, policies/rules are skirted all of the time at every level of athletic competition it would be foolish to think otherwise. The NBA, MLB, and NFL are surely free from cheating and conduct themselves with the utmost professionalism at all times and rules are never skirted. And the NCAA continues to be a beacon of transparency seeking the best interest of all their student athletes and not just the superstar athletes, my apologies student-athletes, and would never grant exceptions to students who have not made "satisfactory academic progress toward a degree." (Hint: as someone who has worked for multiple large universities in major conferences rules/policies are constantly being skirted or worked around). So ultimately what is the point of this argument other than ego? Third, between IHSAA, ISWA, and the coaches association it simply shows how at times inefficient too many governing bodies can be, especially when other governmental bodies seek to deviate from their contemporaries. Bottom line let the kids wrestle. I would even advocate let the coaches have contact with their athletes since they are going to be participating in athletic events during moratorium regardless of IHSAA policy. Elite athletes and athletes that desire to become elite or compete at a very high level rarely take a day off.

http://www.flowrestling.org/article/40254-by-the-numbers-2016-ncaa-s ^ interesting article by flowrestling and I think really contributes to this discussion. Every state is going to drink their own kool-aid to some extent but when it comes down to the numbers between Illinois and Indiana there is no comparison, which most people on this board have agreed. However, the same could be said when it comes to PA and every other state... there really is no comparison. So Illinois should come down off of their pedestal and join the rest of us. Chad Red is a 4x undefeated wrestler in what is an ever improving wrestling state. He has earned his number 1 national ranking and like all 4x undefeated wrestlers he experienced some luck with his timing blended with obvious hard work, technical skills, and natural talent. NCAA Qualifiers By State: PA - 63 OH - 31 IL, NJ - 27 CA - 19 MI - 15 NY - 12 IA - 11 MN - 10 CO, MO, VA - 9 FL, GA, IN - 7 OK - 6 MD, OR, WA - 5 AZ, CT, SD - 4 KS, KY, NC, TX, WV - 3 DE, HI, NE, WI - 2 AL, ID, NM, SC, TN, UT, VT, WY - 1 Canada - 1 Finland - 1

I'd second the Nick Lee vote, especially since there is "inarguable evidence" that it was Chad Red this year (which I agree), and Nick Lee and Chad Red put on an awesome show at state. Then my vote would go to Mason Parris. The future is undoubtedly bright in Indiana high school wrestling a lot of talented young wrestlers.

I suspect if Indiana ever consistently beats them in the Indiana/Illinois invite then respect will be earned.

If Konrath were to end up at EMD they could have 3-5 potential state champions. What is the most state champions by one team in a single season 4?

Awesome video and exposure for the state. They definitely pointed out how our state restrictions limit some of the top tier wrestlers from competing against the top national competition.

You are right classing basketball has clearly hurt the Hoosier State and made it less competitive (excerpt from an article 1976-2012 was the source of data analyzed): (To avoid potential confusion this was satire). "Indiana, living up to its reputation, may have the strongest high school basketball tradition in the country. With 41 All-Americans in 36 years, Indiana has produced more talent than Florida, Ohio, Pennsylvania, and Georgia, all significantly larger states, and trails only Illinois, New York, and California. Adjusting for population size, the Hoosier State blows the field away. Maryland is also a hotbed of talent, as are a handful of Southern states (Louisiana, Mississippi, Georgia, Virginia, and Tennessee), and neighboring Illinois." http://deadspin.com/infographics-where-do-high-school-basketball-stars-com-5984694 Indiana has and forever will be a basketball state: making it virtually impossible to compare basketball and wrestling in the state of Indiana. Classing basketball my have made the less than probable stories of "The Hoosiers" a distant memory but it still continues to produce talented basketball players at a disproportional rate in comparison to its size...

I don't think being a four timer automatically qualifies someone has being the best Indiana wrestler ever. My vote would go to Andrew Howe and then after that I would say Chad Red, Jason Tsirtsis, Angel Escebedo, and Reece Humphrey. All great and extremely talented in their own right. And the talent gap is extremely thin between any of these extremely talented wrestlers. Howe was just dominant. His junior and senior year no one was able to compete with him. Four-time talent but happened to run into Reece Humphrey as a freshman. Indiana has experienced a lot of talented wrestlers recently and it seems to be more of the norm than anomaly now with the likes of the Lee's, Maurer, Caughlin, Micic, Rypel, Streck, and etc. I know for a fact I am missing great wrestlers. All signs point to the fact that Indiana is definitely on the rise.

Mason Parris looked amazing at state. And made very good wrestlers seem average. Obviously matches still have to be wrestled but in everyone's most educated guess will anyone be able to compete with him these next two seasons?

I find it ironic people get offended that there is a simply a discussion about the last match of the evening therefore making it disrespectful to the other finalists and ignore the fact the vote reads, "No, I want to see Streck maul someone last." It seems to me if you are going to be up in arms suggesting other wrestlers are disrespected or it is not a foregone conclusion that Lee and Red will make the finals then you should be offended by the assumption Streck is going to make the finals, or that he will dominate whoever he wrestles, it is disrespectful to them. That is "why we have them wrestle the matches" right? This probably the biggest match in Indiana High School history and a prime opportunity to grow the sport. It just makes sense to make it the last match of the evening. It is just wise that the IHSAA put two of the most accomplished wrestlers in the states history as the center piece. It doesn't diminish everyone else's accomplishments in fact it might boost their exposure to the casual wrestling fans.

I'd have to say Andrew Howe is arguably the most dominant wrestler in Indiana history. Heck even as a three timer he might be the best wrestler (college career included) in Indiana history.

No idea the average age but average grade level (two decimal points if applicable): 106-9.75 113-10.5 120-11 126-10.69 132-11.31 138-11.31 145-11.44 152-11.56 160-11.12 170-11.31 182-11.63 195-11.56 220-11.44 285-11.56

Would you put Howe/Humphrey in that category as well?

I forgot about Rypel vs Davison. Three HUGE match ups for Indiana high school wrestling. Clearly testifies to the rise of Indiana wrestling.

I realize some might not consider either of them upsets but based on rankings alone of the big two matches Red vs Lee or Woods vs Parris is the most likely to happen? Or are they both to close to call at this point?