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Some of you may have seen the video of "The Slam" from the DCC vs Davison team state championships in MI from Saturday.  It was the one where Davison's #1 nationally ranked Alex Facundo lost on a slam call that looked like a normal hard double leg.  The DCC kid ( who is a really tough kid and Fargo AA ) looked fine, got up and went to the line to start wrestling before his coach called him over to be looked at by his trainer.  DCC's version of the story is that their trainer was in the bathroom so the MHSAA sent a doctor out to evaluate the kid and the doctor said he was not fit to finish and DCC picks up 6 points in a match they would almost surely lost by bonus points.  It looked like a terrible decision to have the kid take a dive but according to DCC, the coach didn't intend it that way and it got taken out of his hands.

 

I also saw a clip on Twitter where Mocco talks about a time he hurt a guy from Iowa State and Bobby Douglas jumped out of the stands to make his guy wrestle 1 second so he could then forfeit to Mocco because he didn't want to take a win like that.

 

I thought it might help to share some stories of coaching decisions and scenarios that went well or went terribly wrong.  I am not sure I would know the rules for stopping injury time before it ran out or the concussion rules in the heat of the moment of a match.  I could see where things happen quickly and decisions are made or not made so a bad result happens unintentionally.  I don't like DCC but have made enough mistakes to see how it could happen.

 

Anyone care to share?

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The DCC one looks bad as the kid was on the line ready to wrestle and on top of that he was getting manhandled. 

 

I have had a couple situations that stick out to me.

 

In 2005 in the ticket round our 215lber put a kid down a little harder that he should have. This was at the coliseum with the old Resilite mats so by that time the mats were really hard anyway. The kid likely was injured a little and his coaches told him to get up, he wasn't going to win that way. My kid went on to be the semi-state champ that day.

 

Had a kid get slammed on a mat return in the regional first round this year. His opponent had his arm trapped and we were losing with about 25 seconds to go. He finished the match ending his season. 

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My son Carson got slammed in the ticket round his sophomore year. They actually landed on the concrete floor at the Ford Center. Hurt his hip pretty bad. Had a huge bruise. But.. he told the ref that he wanted to continue (he was winning). They restarted the match. I don’t know if his mobility was hindered, and I still have never asked. But... the next thing I know he got pinned. Could have punched his ticket to state. He never has ever brought it up. We all know that he did the right thing. Things happen... you get up and wrestle. 
 

On the flip side, his senior year... he was at emd wresting. He was up 13-0 he took the kid down to get the tech. He clearly slammed the kid. The kid could have took a dive and gave an undefeated senior a loss. The kid got up and finished the match.

 

It’s just what we do here. 

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Shout out to the 2012 Heritage Hills coaches 

 

Gelen Robinson was beating Jared Boehm first round Saturday morning at state and was called for an illegal slam.  Gelen was up big and there was only a minute left in the match.  Jared was deemed unable to continue and instead of allowing him to win by inj. default, the HH staff and Jared decided to give the match to Gelen.  Us coaches went on to praise the nobility and selflessness of the HH staff and Jared for weeks to come.  Its terrible to see injuries happen and ones bad enough to not allow a kid to wrestle, but when things like this happen it shows you what this sport instills into these young men and how coaches truly lead by example.  

Edited by indianmorg
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The first tournament I ever head coached, an opponent from Western committed two penalties that injured our wrestler forcing him to not continue; as I could see the kid didn't intend to injury our wrestler, I told the ref to blow the whistle twice so we could default to him.

 

When these situations arise, I always think of an Purdue-IU dual I was a part of. At 133, Chris Fleeger was beating Andre Hernandez by about 9 points and was called for an illegal key-lock/arm throw. The IU coaches took the default victory. My match was next and was boring in comparison to the two I was sandwiched between. At 149, the IU wrestler hit a headlock in the opening exchange of the match, the headlock was illegal, and Purdue took the default victory. I suppose IU may have thought that the key-lock/arm throw may have been malicious, but I don't know what they thought. The 149 default seemed to be retribution. These were not great moments for wrestling.

 

This dual meet was not a part of the tournament series, so the stakes aren't as high, but when in doubt, do what Bobby Douglas would do. 

 

 

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2018 regional at North my wrestler was wrestling a kid from MD that was on his way to tech falling us. I’m the process he illegally slammed my kid and automatically I knew we would continue the match, or at least restart, then default and give them the victory. But for a moment, we sure had the MD coaching staff sweating. Which I reassured them there is no way i would default a match purposely default a match just to get a win. Their kid went on to win regional, then qualify for state.

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I got DQd for an illegal slam my second to last match as a senior, I hadn't lost in a regular season match in 3 years. It molded me, it shaped me, I learned from it....

 

I learned to take the dub if ever happens to me and I'm in the corner coaching, you all are soft. You obviously didn't grow up on Jesse the Body Ventura and Bobby Heenan.... What poor role models you must of had. 

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25 minutes ago, TripleB said:

I got DQd for an illegal slam my second to last match as a senior, I hadn't lost in a regular season match in 3 years. It molded me, it shaped me, I learned from it....

 

I learned to take the dub if ever happens to me and I'm in the corner coaching, you all are soft. You obviously didn't grow up on Jesse the Body Ventura and Bobby Heenan.... What poor role models you must of had. 

 

I grew up hearing Jesse and Bobby, but listening to Gene Oakerlund and Rowdy Piper

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I seem to remember one down at Robert’s. The kid couldn’t continue the match but managed to wrestle the rest of the day for a 3rd place semi state finish. That would be a tough way to go out. 

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1 hour ago, Observing said:

I seem to remember one down at Robert’s. The kid couldn’t continue the match but managed to wrestle the rest of the day for a 3rd place semi state finish. That would be a tough way to go out. 

I forgot about that one, the wrestler from MD was Dewig and the other wrestler was from Bloomington South can't remember his name though. Dewig would have done well at state I can't remember if Dewig was a senior or not I know at one time Dewig placed 2nd at state but again I can't remember the details on that. Dewig was going for a near side cradle with his head in the kid's side getting ready to bring the head to the knee the Bloomington south wrestler turned away from Dewig thus causing Dewig to be essentially trying to force his back to bend backwards ref called it illegal the Bloomington South coaches allowed him to take the win, the Bloomington south kid went to state and there was nothing Dewig could do about it. MD crowd was not very kind to that kid all the way through the tournament and into team state, we were hoping for a rematch but it never materialized. I think the Bloomington South kid would probably change history if he could but we all know how that goes, we all make mistakes in life it's just sometimes everyone is watching.

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53 minutes ago, Ahawkeye said:

I forgot about that one, the wrestler from MD was Dewig and the other wrestler was from Bloomington South can't remember his name though. Dewig would have done well at state I can't remember if Dewig was a senior or not I know at one time Dewig placed 2nd at state but again I can't remember the details on that. Dewig was going for a near side cradle with his head in the kid's side getting ready to bring the head to the knee the Bloomington south wrestler turned away from Dewig thus causing Dewig to be essentially trying to force his back to bend backwards ref called it illegal the Bloomington South coaches allowed him to take the win, the Bloomington south kid went to state and there was nothing Dewig could do about it. MD crowd was not very kind to that kid all the way through the tournament and into team state, we were hoping for a rematch but it never materialized. I think the Bloomington South kid would probably change history if he could but we all know how that goes, we all make mistakes in life it's just sometimes everyone is watching.

Nick Dewig- Mater Dei
Tony Withrow- Bloomington South

In 2006

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21 hours ago, Y2CJ41 said:

Nick Dewig- Mater Dei
Tony Withrow- Bloomington South

In 2006


It's almost as if there is a place with a huge database to pull such info from?  

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23 hours ago, Ahawkeye said:

I forgot about that one, the wrestler from MD was Dewig and the other wrestler was from Bloomington South can't remember his name though. Dewig would have done well at state I can't remember if Dewig was a senior or not I know at one time Dewig placed 2nd at state but again I can't remember the details on that. Dewig was going for a near side cradle with his head in the kid's side getting ready to bring the head to the knee the Bloomington south wrestler turned away from Dewig thus causing Dewig to be essentially trying to force his back to bend backwards ref called it illegal the Bloomington South coaches allowed him to take the win, the Bloomington south kid went to state and there was nothing Dewig could do about it. MD crowd was not very kind to that kid all the way through the tournament and into team state, we were hoping for a rematch but it never materialized. I think the Bloomington South kid would probably change history if he could but we all know how that goes, we all make mistakes in life it's just sometimes everyone is watching.

Yes, that’s the match I was thinking of. Happened right in front of me. I believe Dewig was undefeated. Lost a lot of respect for a good program that day. 

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26 minutes ago, Observing said:

Yes, that’s the match I was thinking of. Happened right in front of me. I believe Dewig was undefeated. Lost a lot of respect for a good program that day. 

I agree. He wasn’t hurt at all. Blew kisses to the MD crowd and laughed as he skipped off the mat. Biggest chicken ***potty mouth*** move I’ve ever seen by a wrestler and coach. 

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I think it was during the 2006 Ft. Wayne semistate that a wrestler from Elkhart Concord did not make it to state and his Adams Central opponent did, due to an illegal hold/slam.  The arena erupted in raucous boos. I know the names, but will not list them.

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I wasn't thinking of limiting it to just slams.  Sometimes emotions run high and I have considered things that are probably borderline cheating and had to think it has ran through other's minds also.  Like for example something like telling a kid to try to time a whistle on a shot to get an unfair advantage.  I don't even know the rules for that anymore and I think they are much better because I don't see kids doing it, but I was desperate enough to do that a time or two as a competitor.  As much as I want to set a good example and not make it about winning, I can see how it happens.

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12 hours ago, IU89 said:

I agree. He wasn’t hurt at all. Blew kisses to the MD crowd and laughed as he skipped off the mat. Biggest chicken ***potty mouth*** move I’ve ever seen by a wrestler and coach. 

I believe he also hit somebody in the head at iswa state years ago and when our guy was beating him at adams central tournament he started gouging eyes and being grimey.

Edited by FCFIGHTER170
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19 hours ago, Y2CJ41 said:

Thats It Kenan Thompson GIF

I get what you're saying but I guess you can call me lazy but with three kids and a third shift job time to look stuff up doesn't come easy. 

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14 hours ago, busstogate said:

I think it was during the 2006 Ft. Wayne semistate that a wrestler from Elkhart Concord did not make it to state and his Adams Central opponent did, due to an illegal hold/slam.  The arena erupted in raucous boos. I know the names, but will not list them.

That happened again in 2013, but it was a Carroll kid that got DQ’d. AC kid ended up wrestling again and getting 3rd. 

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Jeremy Motl was wrestling 275 for us  against Martnsville in the Saturday Morning round of State.  He was getting beat fairly well when the Martinsville wrestler slammed him and we took a pretty good blow to the head.  It was clearly a slam (Dave Errett was the Martinsville coach and I am pretty sure he would agree it was a slam.)  I will say that the slam was due more to the Martinvile kid losing control of Jeremy than him doing something intentional.  Jeremy was stunned and i would imagine today that the Trainers would not let him continue.  I was hoping he could continue.  We were just about out of recovery time and I told Dave that we did not want to win in this manner and asked him if he would tell his kid not to come after my kid so we could restart the match and then take injury time.  Dave was in agreement so we did that.  a few seconds went off the clock and we took injury time.  At the end of injury time we were still woozy and so we defaulted and the Martinsville boy advanced,  It was the right thing to do in that situation, but I would say that in some cases it is not the fair thing thing to do for your wrestler.

 

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well to be honest the one that came to mind to me right away was when Seltzer hit an illegal move on Bettich I believe in the Semis of state  and Bettich was clearly shooken up and it looked like a possible concussion because he hit his head pretty hard. Bettich was losing pretty good and had gotten beat all year by Seltzer and he coulda layed  there and took  the win. If he had done so a whole lot of history would be changed. The first part that would be changed would be the 2020 team state champs would be Crown Point,  the second thing would be the 120 pound state champion. also it would not allow Seltzer to have the opportunity to get 3 titles and 4x under the lights. I don't know Bettich at all but after seeing that it made me a fan for life. What I have always been told  is you find out more about 1 loss about a persons character than you do after 1000 wins. Excellent Job Riley.

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