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Impact freshman

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20 hours ago, doctorWrestling said:

Any idea how many of those took an extra year of middle school?  

8 of the 12 listed above have taken an extra year. Congratulations to #1 Sergio and #2 Cheaney who are proving that you don’t need the extra year in order to excell! They will both be “True Freshmen” next year. 

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I guess I am old school, but that is disturbing to me.  Here are a few reasons why it should be discouraged in my opinion.  First, wrestling probably shouldn't be such a priority for parents or kids at that age to want to give up a year of future earnings and leave their classmates so they have a better shot at winning matches.  Secondly, I think a year of taking your losses is a great lesson in life and the sport that will only help you later on and missing that lesson is definitely not going to help when you finally become a freshman in college if you continue in the sport.  I personally would much rather have a kid who struggles and then succeeds than a kid who took an advantage to make it easier to succeed when it comes to preparing for the beatings you will get in college.

I am not trying to attack those who did it.  Maybe a few even have a valid reason for it besides wrestling.  I just personally don't like it and think it isn't going to help them in the long run. 

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1 hour ago, 4U2NV said:

8 of the 12 listed above have taken an extra year. Congratulations to #1 Sergio and #2 Cheaney who are proving that you don’t need the extra year in order to excell! They will both be “True Freshmen” next year. 

Interesting tidbit I learned about this subject from my daughter.  We were watching the Finals on Fox Sports Indiana, and the 120 lbs group comes up.  And my daughter, who is a freshman says "Oh cool!  There's Kysen!  He was in my Spanish class.  Dad did you know that he and I have the same exact birthday?"

I reply "Oh cool, the same date?" And she responds "No, dad...the exact same day.  Like the same year.  Not the same hospital though."

So we had a choice when my daughter was entering kindergarten to either have her be one of the youngest or one of the oldest in her class, and we choose the latter.  Obviously, since Kysen is a sophomore placer, he was in the former group and could "naturally" be a freshman right now like my daughter.  But he's a 2X state placer, which is commendable due to the whole "Greyshirt / Redshirt" idea.

The funny thing was my son, who is a wrestler in 7th grade, immediately piped in with "Well, clearly Kysen's parents didn't want him to be any good in wrestling."  

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I think that annually this is one of the silliest topics on the message board, where instead of making it about the impact freshmen, we see venom from people who are angry that some of these families moved to another district for a better opportunity in life for their child.  I can assure you that the following 8 kids did not feel any less "SPECIAL" when they got their hand raised Saturday night because they did not win for their original community or first high school:

Brennen Cernus- Columbus, OH

Jacob Moran- Crown Point

Brayden Littell- Perry Meridian

Jesse Mendez- Lake Central

Asa Garcia- Danville

Elliott Rodgers- Noblesville

Jordan Slivka- Shenandoah

Nick South- Jennings County

 

Additionally, I think the "redshirt" argument is way overdone.  As the poster above mentioned, one kid could be born in July and the other in August of the same year and they will be in different grades.  If the parent of the kid who is born in July holds their child back, they are one month older and now in the same grade as the kid born in August.  Not much of an advantage.  I think it is more telling to go through the list of 12 kids and see what year they are on the USA Wrestling calendar as they finish up middle school.  This paints a much better picture.

Lemley- 1st year Cadet

Schoeff- 1st year Cadet

Purdy- 1st year Cadet

Frazier- 2nd year Cadet

Carroll- 2nd year Cadet

Gilbert- 1st year Cadet

Lowery- 1st year Cadet

Goin- 1st year Cadet

Goodwin- 2nd year Cadet

Steenbeke- 1st year Cadet

Jones- 1st year Cadet

Willems- 1st year Cadet

 

 

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1 hour ago, doctorWrestling said:

I guess I am old school, but that is disturbing to me.  Here are a few reasons why it should be discouraged in my opinion.  First, wrestling probably shouldn't be such a priority for parents or kids at that age to want to give up a year of future earnings and leave their classmates so they have a better shot at winning matches.  Secondly, I think a year of taking your losses is a great lesson in life and the sport that will only help you later on and missing that lesson is definitely not going to help when you finally become a freshman in college if you continue in the sport.  I personally would much rather have a kid who struggles and then succeeds than a kid who took an advantage to make it easier to succeed when it comes to preparing for the beatings you will get in college.

I am not trying to attack those who did it.  Maybe a few even have a valid reason for it besides wrestling.  I just personally don't like it and think it isn't going to help them in the long run. 

This puts everything in the perspective of athletics/wrestling and it is not always about that. Although it could cost them a year of earnings, being an older student among peers in school could also have the young child more mentally prepared for rigorous/advanced schoolwork, and could also potentially set the child in a position of leadership at a young age. It could be argued that these advantages might outweigh a year of earnings. I used to feel similar to you, but realized that IHSAA has a rule in place that does not allow athletes to compete after their 20th (I think?) birthday. Is that too "old"? Possibly, but that is the rule.  And although some students are held back for athletic purposes, there may also be other factors such as maturation and behavioral issues that we do not know about.

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2 minutes ago, base said:

This puts everything in the perspective of athletics/wrestling and it is not always about that. Although it could cost them a year of earnings, being an older student among peers in school could also have the young child more mentally prepared for rigorous/advanced schoolwork, and could also potentially set the child in a position of leadership at a young age. It could be argued that these advantages might outweigh a year of earnings. I used to feel similar to you, but realized that IHSAA has a rule in place that does not allow athletes to compete after their 20th (I think?) birthday. Is that too "old"? Possibly, but that is the rule.  And although some students are held back for athletic purposes, there may also be other factors such as maturation and behavioral issues that we do not know about.

I understand that point, but when 8 out of 12 on this list do it I doubt they were truly using that as a reason.  How many people do you know do this who don't have an incentive for sports?  I considered my kids age when they started kindergarten.  By the time they are in middle school they have probably adapted.  I just think you don't see 65% of the average middle school kids being held back under normal circumstances.

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12 minutes ago, doctorWrestling said:

I understand that point, but when 8 out of 12 on this list do it I doubt they were truly using that as a reason.  How many people do you know do this who don't have an incentive for sports?  I considered my kids age when they started kindergarten.  By the time they are in middle school they have probably adapted.  I just think you don't see 65% of the average middle school kids being held back under normal circumstances.

Most of them are 1st year Cadets - born in 2004.  This means that they will be either 15 (born Jan-May) or 14 (born June-Dec) at graduation time at the end of May. Fast forward 4 years from now when they are seniors in high school, and these 1st year cadets will all be 18 years old or will have just turned 19 within a few months.  Not really extreme outliers

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My son Van had a July birthday and so based on my high school experience (I had an August birthday and graduated at 17) We decided to wait a year before putting him in K.  So with summer birthdays I completely agree with starting them later.  Now we have not held him back once since he enrolled and i can't imagine making my son who gets straight A's repeat 8th grade.

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My point is each family should do what they think is best for their kid, both in what school to attend and what grade to enter in.  A few kids moved and a few kids are a little older.  Who cares?  Everyone is just trying to do what is best for their own families.  Best of luck to all these kids.  Many talented kids in this class.

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17 minutes ago, tskin said:

My son Van had a July birthday and so based on my high school experience (I had an August birthday and graduated at 17) We decided to wait a year before putting him in K.  So with summer birthdays I completely agree with starting them later.  Now we have not held him back once since he enrolled and i can't imagine making my son who gets straight A's repeat 8th grade.

I think there a few July and August 2004 birthdays... My wife and mother are/were educators, so there was never a question of retention for sports as I knew what the answer would be... 

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25 minutes ago, Cosgrove said:

I'll be holding my son Zane back a year... well start school a year later :)

 

so @BrennanFan 's real name is Zane ?   LOL

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Deciding to wait a year before sending your kid to kindergarten or having your kid repeat one of 1-8th grades due to academic or social issues is A LOT different than having your kid who is a good student repeat one of 6-8th grades strictly for athletic reasons. That is plain weird. 

I wonder how many parents do that?

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5 minutes ago, backtothemat said:

Deciding to wait a year before sending your kid to kindergarten or having your kid repeat one of 1-8th grades due to academic or social issues is A LOT different than having your kid who is a good student repeat one of 6-8th grades strictly for athletic reasons. That is plain weird. 

I wonder how many parents do that?

Exactly. 

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There is clearly a comepetive advantage to “grey shirting”. I’m not sure when it started, but it seems like it’s a trend that isn’t going away, especially with elite level wrestlers. I wonder how prevalent it is with other sports? 

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2 hours ago, BrokenTowelRack said:

I think that annually this is one of the silliest topics on the message board, where instead of making it about the impact freshmen, we see venom from people who are angry that some of these families moved to another district for a better opportunity in life for their child.  I can assure you that the following 8 kids did not feel any less "SPECIAL" when they got their hand raised Saturday night because they did not win for their original community or first high school:

Brennen Cernus- Columbus, OH

Jacob Moran- Crown Point

Brayden Littell- Perry Meridian

Jesse Mendez- Lake Central

Asa Garcia- Danville

Elliott Rodgers- Noblesville

Jordan Slivka- Shenandoah

Nick South- Jennings County

I think your intent is positive here, but some points of clarification at least for the Cathedral kids. 

If you want to use “original community” as where they came from, you would have to take Jordan Slivka off the list as he started in the CYO. He attended St. Barnabas and competed in CYO wrestling until 3rd grade before his legendary ol’ man transferred to ‘Doah. They came back to attend catholic high school as his family situation changed. His cousins currently still rassle with the dirty CYO Southsiders. 

If “original community” means where the 8th grader graduates from, then you would have to pull Elliott Rodgers out of this group. He wrestled CYO since was in 4th grade at St. Maria Goretti, he attended middle school there, and his dad is the coach. His younger brothers currently wrestle for St. Maria Goretti. 

Edited by IndianaWrestlingGuy

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No doubt Slivka and Rodgers had ties to Catholic school before Cathedral.  A clarification could also be made for Littell, as he went to Center Grove in elementary and middle school before enrolling at Perry and then transferring back to CG.

My point is that people move around and this does not in any way diminish how special it is for these 8 kids to win a state championship, as the poster from Chesterton alluded to.  Everyone is doing what is best for their family.  Whether that is Slivka moving from Shenandoah back to Cathedral, Rodgers listing Noblesville as his home on his Trackwrestling profile and attending Cathedral, or Littell going back to CG after a short stint at Perry.

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3 hours ago, BrokenTowelRack said:

 

Asa Garcia- Danville

 

 

 

OH... BOY SOMEONE WRONG  ! 

About to make’m Famous ! 

 

 @Perseverance @Sydokun 

Tell BrokenTowelRack what Streets are we from ?

Tell the MILLIONS & MILLIONS of viewers where this 3x Champ is from . 

This BrokenTowelRack needs to gets his facts Checked real quick .

 This BrokenTowelRack needs to fix his BrokenTowelRack of False information.

Tell this BrokenTowelRack where (6) Count them (6x) State Championships trained at ?

Tell BrokenTowelRack what school Notorious graduated from ? 

THE WRESTLING PEOPLE WANT TO KNOW 

Wooooo..... They think they know me ! 

I’m Done ! 

 

The Notorious 

 

 

Edited by TeamGarcia

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Grizzly Ironman Folkstyle (04/21 - 04/21/2013)
    Schoolboy/Schoolgirt - 77 (1st)
        Quarterfinal: Asa Garcia (Danville) over () (Bye) 
        Semifinal: Asa Garcia (Danville) over Dalton Craig (Dupont) (Dec 5-2) 
        1st Place Match: Asa Garcia (Danville) over Andrew Black (New Castle) (Dec 3-0) 

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Southmont Jr High Conference 2014 (03/15 - 03/15/2014)
    85 (1st)
        Quarterfinal - Asa Garcia (Danville) 19-0 received a bye () (Bye) 
        Semifinal - Asa Garcia (Danville) 19-0 won by fall over Gavyn Warren (Northridge ) 13-6 (Fall 1:48) 
        1st Place Match - Asa Garcia (Danville) 19-0 won by tech fall over Zack Brown (Southmont) 20-6 (TF-1.5 0:00 (19-4)) 

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Hendricks County Middle School (03/12 - 03/13/2014)
    85 (1st)
        Quarterfinal - Asa Garcia (Danville) 19-0 won by forfeit over Forfeit (Brownsburg West) 0-1 (For.) 
        Semifinal - Asa Garcia (Danville) 19-0 won by tech fall over Jaxson Thomas (Plainfield) 9-5 (TF-1.5 3:52 (16-1)) 
        1st Place Match - Asa Garcia (Danville) 19-0 won by decision over Brayden Mahan (Brownsburg East) 22-7 (Dec 7-0) 

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