Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
warsawwrestling

Disney Duals (AAU Scholastic Duals Community 1 Div)

Recommended Posts

Is there a big group of coaches and nationally ranked wrestlers wrestling in/following the red and blue pools? As benign as your request is it seems to insinuate in someway a comparison between tournaments. Truly if we want to push Indiana forward we need more Coaches coaching in the off season. This petty argument is fine and all, but the real issue here are the coaches who lack an off season and don't volunteer their time away from family to better their kids. Instead we are saying a tournament or rise of tournaments giving kids more options to improve is what's declining the State in general. I know we have been approached by Newberry's recruiter here and we have a few other kids who are getting college looks as well. Are they Big D1 programs no bit these kids are not at that level.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My two cents...

 

 

I can't speak for most other programs, but this isn't a vacation for Brownsburg. Yes, I allow my wrestlers to have a little more fun than normal. I'd never let them swim on an overnight during the regular season but do here, etc. Make no mistake, though, we came here to bang it out. We trained to be champions here. We had a thrilling dual with Perry Meridian. I can assure you it wasn't a vacation feel for them either. In our dual with Central Dolphin in the Semi-finals, we can back from 20 down. Won the last 5 weights. Slick Rick aka Rickie Clark wins by one to the decide the outcome. We were jacked up and then crushed after being hammered in the finals. Our team got better and Indiana looks impressive based off of our performance and that of other Indiana schools here.

 

Some college coaches here...I'm sure more at other events. I have never had any problem getting my guys looked at to continue their careers to the next level. There are ample opportunities to be recognized nationally these days. I'm not getting into the freestyle vs. folkstyle thing. I always say focus on training hard and getting better. That's what matters. We and the other Indiana teams here got better just as those at other tournaments did.

 

I wouldn't change our experience here for any other tournament. We made memories for a lifetime. We grew as a team. What people don't often understand is now my guys will train harder individually because of their love for th TEAM.

 

Nick aka Fabio jr. - Can you post your video of Slick Rick sealing the deal? That's what it is all about.

 

Snyder

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mr. Hull,

It is extremely sad that you want to continue to talk bad about the Disney Duals. There were ten schools that sent 13 teams to the event. If you do the math, that is over 220 kids getting about 15 high level matches. This is what Indiana needs, not just sending one team to Cadet or Junior duals so only 30 total kids get high level matches. This was my first year going and my kids got their eyes opened to very good wrestlers from Florida, Ohio, Colorado, and Pennsylvania.  They learned a ton on the mat and even more off the mat. I held off for a few years on the event, but now know why the top coaches continue to attend the event and we will continue also. 

 

I find it disturbing that you take cheap shots at the event and call it a vacation, when it is a business trip. This is a REAL event no matter how much you want to call other events "a real national championship." If Rob Koll is there, it shows it's a top tier event. 

 

One of these days you will figure it out, hopefully it won't be too late.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mr. Hull,

It is extremely sad that you want to continue to talk bad about the Disney Duals. There were ten schools that sent 13 teams to the event. If you do the math, that is over 220 kids getting about 15 high level matches. This is what Indiana needs, not just sending one team to Cadet or Junior duals so only 30 total kids get high level matches. This was my first year going and my kids got their eyes opened to very good wrestlers from Florida, Ohio, Colorado, and Pennsylvania.  They learned a ton on the mat and even more off the mat. I held off for a few years on the event, but now know why the top coaches continue to attend the event and we will continue also. 

 

I find it disturbing that you take cheap shots at the event and call it a vacation, when it is a business trip. This is a REAL event no matter how much you want to call other events "a real national championship." If Rob Koll is there, it shows it's a top tier event. 

 

One of these days you will figure it out, hopefully it won't be too late.

 

I echo that sentiment.  My kid guested with BBurg at Disney, hurt his hand half way through, watched the rest of the week and still said he learned a lot and had a lot of fun. 

 

'nuf said.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mulkey went undefeated as did Issac McCorrmick. David Eli and Tonte had a helluva match as well with Tonte pulling the W. Noah Warren had a good come from behind win over Damler. That kid is gonna be fun to watch next year and Aiden Warren man in not looking forward to dealing with him for 4 years. Kids a stud.

 

I'm biased but Mulkey is just on another level kid has improved by leaps and bounds over the past year.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lou Rosselli must think it's okay because his son Jordan was there on The Ohio team that won the Community Div 1.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So....

 

Who all went undefeated (individuals)?

 

Any significant wins from our kids?

Rypel had a phenomenal last second win over Hoffman.

Hildebrandt pinned Portillo, lost to Beard 8-7.

I'm sure there were more, those are just off the top of my head.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I find it disturbing that you take cheap shots at the event and call it a vacation, when it is a business trip.

One of these days you will figure it out, hopefully it won't be too late.

I can only speak for Penn.

We weighed in 1 team Saturday, had 5 duals Sunday, weighed in 2 teams and had duals Monday, had three teams going Tuesday and Wednesday, 12 total duals between 2 teams Thursday, and 2 teams finished up on Friday.

Some vacation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So....

 

Who all went undefeated (individuals)?

 

Any significant wins from our kids?

Larson from Avon went 13-0, Conley 12-1, Brewer 11-1, Garcia 11-2, Williamson (Zville) 11-2, Clark 10-3. Those were the best records for Avon. They were 8-5 in Dual Meets. Drew Williamson from Zionsville replaced Caden Hubner who was at Football Camp. The rest of the kids were Avon kids. Rioux 106 and Henson 285 were not released from Dr. to wrestle yet. They did not make the trip. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Great job Indiana wrestlers for going out and representing!   

 

Definitely a TEAM oriented event...and although it's business it does involve some vacation.  Nothing wrong with that and no fault of anyone's.  Again, I do not doubt it is some tough competition at Disney, kids get better, the team bonds, and there is some fun in the sun involved.  That is what the trip is for.  I wanted to know of the nationally ranked kids who were out there and the college coaches in attendance.  That was all.  No offense should be taken but I understand any resentment.  I don't have time to research the numbers and I assumed as much zeal and awesomeness this event brings that someone could spit some info out.  I guess it's because Hull asked and that's fine.

 

But since we are going here.....

 

As a coach, you can't take your high school team to the Cadet or Junior Duals.  If you could, I'm CERTAIN most Indiana teams at Disney would be competing in PA or OK.  I know Coach Harper would LOVE to take Penn, Coach Schoettle and Coach Tonte would as well.  I saw Coach Blevins had several of his kids at UWW Cadets (which was awesome by the way) so Avon is on its way. A coach's dedication is to their high school programs.  The job is to get their team and kids better, both on and off the mat, and win (sometimes not in that order).  Some coaches have more success than others although there is a lot that plays into that: qualification, vision, dedication, support, school culture, size, parental involvement, resources, timing, etc.  But one of the KEY ingredients in going after a team state championship is team camaraderie. Sure, wrestling is an individual sport, but having a tight team bond can move mountains.  Winning is a spirit and the passion and excitement created from the bench is necessary to win. It truly is something special. Disney is a PRIME opportunity and event to build that camaraderie and is a life changing experience for many.

 

I get it.

 

My issue:

 

Indiana can go down in flames but for most coaches as long as we win conference it's all good (sarcasm). 

 

Indiana isn't our problem.  It's not our obligation.  At Disney if our All-Star wrestler, most times the team leader, isn't there with us then we clearly won't do as well and can ultimately affect the team bond when season starts.  I get that too.  I propose coaches look at it differently. (I know I'm nobody) On the other hand, what if that team leader of yours got an opportunity to represent Indiana at the USAW national All-Star meet?  With an OPPORTUNITY to not only get higher quality matches, not only get a chance to become nationally ranked or move up those rankings, not only get seen by more college coaches, not only get seen by more elite college programs, not only bring more notoriety to your school (especially when you start shelling them out), not only gets better than better individually, not only comes back with more confidence because of it, not only are their expectations raised and vision emboldened, which not only spreads throughout the team, which not only raises their expectations and hopes as well - but he gets a chance to help Indiana @@#$#%^(& win!  

 

Our expectations are just too low, as wrestlers and coaches.  If you truly want to be the best, being the best in the state shouldn't be good enough. You're selling yourself short. Aim for the stars and at least you'll hit the clouds.  Where are the stars in our sport? Fortunately we get a chance to catch a glimpse of them this year. They normally come around every 4 years and this year they're in August.  Imagine for a split second if everyone in your room were programmed/training/wanting/dedicated to win the Olympics.  Olympics too scary? Okay, how about national champion?  That's better. What type of athlete and mindset does that take?  What steps does that take or path does that follow? I haven't done it but I can study those individuals and programs who have done it before. IF you had a room full of kids bought into a national title, you think winning state will be an issue? No, it's how many state titles can/do/will you win.  However, most Indiana coaches are only focused (or capped) on the state, and that's why we get state placers and semi-state qualifiers (hopefully).  No different when competing.  If my hope is to make it to state, chances are I end up a semi-state qualifier.  If I am focused on winning it on the other hand, then chances are I will at least place and probably high.  Aim for the stars and at least you'll hit the clouds.

 

Ok, so you opt in. How do you do it?  Right now, send your kids to Fargo if you can. Going to Grand River instead, or somewhere else? Good job, keep wrestling because Freestyle and Greco season are over anyway. Summer workouts, strength and conditioning? Awesome.  Now throw an Olympic wrestling party the night Burroughs is going for the gold. Start pushing your kids now. Plant and water those seeds to watch the Olympic wrestling event in August. Print out a schedule when you find it of what days and times it's on TV.  Pass it out to your kids, put it on your Facebook page, tweet it, whatever.  Just push watching it.  That's the first step and it's perfect timing, Rio.  Now go about your business, train for the Indianamat Hoosier Pre-Season Open (plug for you Y2), but as the season approaches start collecting and hanging posters and information of World and Olympic Champions, USAW posters, etc. to get your room ready.  Every wrestling room in Indiana should have an Olympic flag hanging up and you won't even have to say another word about it if you don't want.  Your kids will take note, and so will you.  

 

Now, and here is the tricky part, once ISWA Folkstyle State is over, start training Freestyle and Greco.  Go to the RTC's if you aren't comfortable or know how to teach it.  Push your kids to go.  Partner with a coach who has one and push your kids, take your kids, there and everyone learn together.  To you guys going out to Iowa and Flo, at least start mixing it into your practice schedule.  Believe it or not but if you stick with the program it ultimately doesn't affect each style because it forces you to be smarter.  But push these styles, even if you're lying to them and/or yourself about the benefits of F/G participation and training.  Yes, participate in as much F/G as possible, even if the local competition is shoddy for the time being, because believe me it gets better.  Take advantage of it and build your confidence.  The local tournaments are home work,  Central and Southeast Regionals are your pop quizzes, Schoolboy, Cadet and Junior Duals are your tests, and UWW Cadets/Juniors and Fargo are your final exams.  

 

This is where we need to be pushing our kids to not only experience but sell them the dream of winning these tournaments.  Folkstyle tournaments are practically year-round now, so if and when any and all F/G opportunities come up, we have to take advantage of them.  It's going to take some work, most if not all coaches are going to have to get out of our comfort zone, but that's the point: getting better.  Like I said, even if you can't teach it or have the time for it, hang those posters and Olympic flag in your room and you will at least have done your part.  If you want to buy in, push the Olympics.  If you want to get serious then make it a game.  Quiz kids on who did what to who, from where, with what move, what habits did you see, how did USA look, how did the other countries look, what are some differences, etc. If you end up being sold, start implementing as much as you can after ISWA Folkstyle State.

 

Either way, I am minutes away from leaving to take our Junior National Dual Team to Oklahoma.  It will be a great experience for these guys.  Indiana is not as strong as we could/should be, we lost some commits to whatever, many kids aren't interested or have other obligations, but I can promise our team will go out there and take advantage of this opportunity.  We have a great staff of coaches so I don't do much coaching on the mat, and actually prefer coaching the bench, but I guarantee Indiana as a team and as individuals will come back better....just like the teams in Disney.  I hope everyone follows our/YOUR results and see where we are at as a state versus where we could be.  This post just a cat call to us as coaches.  Raise your expectations.  Indiana needs it.  You need it.  Your kids need it. We need it.  #getbetter

Edited by Coach Hull

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sending a kid to Fargo to go 2-2 isn't going to do as much as going to Disney where they will get 15 matches of similar quality. On top of that the kid and his family will save probably $800.

 

Once again you are failing to see the light. We had over 200 kids go to Disney and get high quality matches. That is good for Indiana, that is VERY good for Indiana. We also had some teams that went to Tennessee this weekend for more matches. We also had a few hundred at Wabash getting better. I saw Franklin heading to North Carolina and Columbia City went to an ISI camp. All are good for Indiana as kids are on the mat this time of the year. Just because it isn't on an ISWA team doesn't mean it isn't good for the state.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have no dog in this discussion since I have no kids going to nationals or a team at Disney but I want to give my thoughts, and will take any criticism that goes with them.

 

How are these kids not getting better by going to Disney or making the state better for it?

It's great we are taking kids to these national freestyle and Greco tourneys to represent our state, but I'm still not sure what the issue is for these coaches taking kids to Disney or other folk style tourneys.

I'm sure it's an amazing experience to be a coach on a freestyle or Greco and getting to coach the best kids in the state. Everyone would love to coach 14 state champions from 14 different schools, and have a feeling of pride knowing you are moving Indiana into possible national prominence. But for most coaches, like myself....who should we cater to? For me, it's the kids I coach at the school that pays me to be their coach. I think that if I were able to take my team to an event like Disney or Virginia Beach, or whatever...I would. Why? Because I want to build the team bond with these boys, get us experience and get us better together. Last year I took a group of kids from around the state to a tournament in Texas, and I enjoyed it greatly and made many friendships and connections with several of the kids. If I were to be honest I would have enjoyed it more if it were my high school team I took to Texas because these are the kids I promise to try to make them the best wrestlers they can be. Several factors, however, prevent me from taking my full team to those events, such as finances, availability, etc, but that's a different for a different time.

I enjoy watching freestyle and Greco. It's flashy and fun to see the throws and rolls. And to learn these styles are great for our state. However, there is a push towards wrestling folkstyle. I believe (and this is me saying this, I do not speak for everyone) there are two big reasons why folkstyle is pushed or done more.

1.) from the end of December, to the end January, every kid in the state who is on their high school teams can participate, provided they are not injured or out for disciplinary reasons.

The other reason I think...

2.) for the most part, high school wrestling season is free. Who pays the entry fee to each tourney during the season....your school's AD. Who more than likely pays for the equipment that each wrestler wear......more often than not, the AD.

And if you are fortunate enough to qualify to the state tourney, more than likely the school will provide your hotel stay and possibly pay for a meal while you are there.

To compete or get better in the other styles, you pay for everything. You pay for a wrestling card, your singlets, your gas to every tourney, your hotels, your entry fees, your fees to go to an academy or wrestling club to train, and if you are able to be a state champ or high placer to qualify for these national events, hundreds if not thousands of dollars to compete for a few days on a team of wrestlers and coaches who may see a couple times a year.

I'm sure if I owned a wrestling club or wrestling academy my opinion would change on this subject, because it's my professional obligation to coach the best, or at least the ones who can afford it.

Now to play devil's advocate for a minute, I suppose the reward for the years of paying thousands of dollars for the training and qualifying for national tourneys is that if you are lucky, you might get your college payed for. And if you do really well and be an all American or even national champ, you might have a successful freestyle/Greco career. And then....if all goes well, you could possibly be qualify for the Olympics. How many people in the history of USA wrestling have been in the Olympics? A handful of people every four years.

 

So that's maybe 1 percent of 1 percent of

all the kids that wrestle in the US.

 

I know this is a bunch of nonsense rambling and I'm certain I'm way off base. But I think instead of saying raise your expectations and get better, perhaps we can be thankful for these coaches who dedicated a week in Orlando or Virginia beach, or texas, or wherever they go. They are raising expectations and are getting their kids better, just not the way you may think it has to be done.

It almost becomes like a political debate or religious debate. My thing is better than yours, or my beliefs are the only thing that matters. I say, promote yourself, be encouraging and do what you think is necessary for your kids to be successful and what you feel grows your team and grows out state. I think it's pretty great growth to see several indiana team finish in the top half of a national tourney, as well as the hope we will have all Americans in freestyle and Greco.

To get better, we just need to wrestle. Doesn't matter what style, we just need to wrestle.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Indiana's biggest issue when it comes to being compared against states like Illinois, Ohio and Michigan is our lack of depth. Our top guys can compete with the top guys from each state.  Getting 15 high quality matches is going to help our depth. Disney may not be prestigious to some, but it serves a purpose. ISWA only offers spots for a few kids at each weight, but Disney allows more opportunities for more wrestlers.  

 

If our state is getting more and more wrestlers on the mat, then why do we care where they are wrestling?

Edited by AJ

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Gentleman,

 

As a former Team Leader and Coach of the Junior Duals Team all I ever wanted to was for our kids (Indiana Kids) was to get matches and improve their abilities, somewhere along the way that seems to have gotten lost in what the ISWA stands for. It has been exciting to see the growth of Indiana Wrestling, I remember the days where we would have a couple of kids who could compete on a national level to the point we are at now where we have multiple kids who can compete on a National and International level. The reason this is happening is because there are more opportunity for kids to wrestle and the Coaches are taking full advantage of those opportunities and going to places like Disney or Tennessee or Iowa or Wabash. In my time working with the ISWA I never tried to take a kid away from a Team event like Disney and that is because those events are special to the growth of the kid and the Team. Now I will say I tried to get kids from Fargo because at the duals (just like at Disney) you are guaranteed matches and a great deal of kids felt like Fargo was the place to go to get noticed when in fact those kids were not ready to compete at that level.

I go on this message boards and see all the infighting and I get excited and the reason why is because so many people care about this sport their kids and programs. I encourage each and every one of you to stay the path and do what is best for your kids and programs because at the end of the day it is your kids who will get better along with your individual programs. As for the duals yes there needs to be some tweaks on the team selection process but at the end of the day it is wrestling and we need to get as many kids the opportunity to be wrestling as we can. The "elite" know were to go and get the matches they feel help them the most, isn't that how they got "elite" in the first place. If they don't we have a whole bunch of awesome Coaches in the state that are willing to help them I'm sure.

 

Tom Erikson

Head Coach 

Lyon College

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.