UncleJimmy Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 (edited) Agree..seems fair..if you know you can do it! Pretty sure if Joe doesn't come across this and post it on his site that not a lot of local clubs would be aware it was an option? Didn't see it as an option on the ISWA site when I checked for events I could try to get Jr to. Edited April 20, 2016 by UncleJimmy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 Last year I jokingly told people we'd hold a qualifier in our practice room two or three times in the spring. Kids would pay $5 and get their matches in and go home. I like the idea, but when I jokingly said we'd do this I didn't believe it would be kosher with the ISWA. I guess I was wrong on that. I'd much rather spend two hours in our room and call it a qualifier than drive to South Bend, Indy, or where ever on a Saturday to get our qualifiers in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lewdwar Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 (edited) "Last year I jokingly told people we'd hold a qualifier in our practice room two or three times in the spring. Kids would pay $5 and get their matches in and go home." Ive been saying this. Pay your fees have a round robin tournament and be done in a few hours. Edited April 20, 2016 by lewdwar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Professor Morgan Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 I, for one, would love to see Indiana start doing weeknight freestyle and greco duals during the spring. I think it might draw more interest from the casual fan seeing the throws and turns that come about in the international styles. sudden death 7, indypharmd and gogoplata89 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattyb Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 (edited) I would suggest this.... All you guys that can. Get a gym reserved within the next two weeks. Put out four surfaces. Have two sessions (from 5 to 7 and 7 to 9). Charge $15 bucks or so. Put the kids in groups of three or four. Let them wrestle round robin for three rounds. Pop some corn and get a cooler of pops to sale. Then...... Bam! You got your kids a second qualifying tournament and you walk away with a couple thousand for your club!!! As matter of fact.... I'm going to try to make this happen if I can. Seems like the same people are always on here poo pooing everything. Spend your energy to try to make something happen. Edited April 20, 2016 by Mattyb Justin Ratliff 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFlatt Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 "Northern" wrestlers do not need to drive long distances to get their two tournaments in. South Bend this Saturday and Penn next Saturday should allow all the northern wrestlers to qualify for state and not have to spend the weekend driving hours to find a tournament. Harper and I have the blue shirts, excellent pairings people, and the facilities to get some good freestyle and greco wrestling done and be out the door in a decent time. The opportunity is there. Take advantage of the situation presented. Bill Flatt South Bend Riley Justin Ratliff and Coach_Mazurek 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UncleJimmy Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 Another good idea to support the local club..which is the objective. How bout each ISWA member club get 5 waivers! The local club could auction them off to the highest bidder or maybe raffle them off or whatever! That would help MCKAJC and others who have been told NO to waivers..only don't tell the clubs until 2 weeks before ISWA state because that would make them more valuable to local clubs! Brilliant!!!! Mattyb 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grecoref Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 Kudos to those who are thinking outside the box! PatParham and Justin Ratliff 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 I would suggest this.... All you guys that can. Get a gym reserved within the next two weeks. Put out four surfaces. Have two sessions (from 5 to 7 and 7 to 9). Charge $15 bucks or so. Put the kids in groups of three or four. Let them wrestle round robin for three rounds. Pop some corn and get a cooler of pops to sale. Then...... Bam! You got your kids a second qualifying tournament and you walk away with a couple thousand for your club!!! As matter of fact.... I'm going to try to make this happen if I can. Seems like the same people are always on here poo pooing everything. Spend your energy to try to make something happen. Why reserve a gym? Just do it in the practice room then you don't need to move mats. PatParham and Justin Ratliff 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grecoref Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 Perhaps someone can help me understand something. I am by far not the sharpest pencil in the box. Last year the ISWA said no waivers for Freestyle State and then the week of the event they retracted that policy and allowed waivers. I agree that was handled poorly. This year the ISWA again states no waivers. I have been told by the ISWA State Chairman and other Board Members that they are standing firm with no waivers and will not bend whatsoever. I don't agree with that, but that's the way it is. Now we have a few folks finding a way to give more athletes an opportunity to compete by hosting an event and people are opposed to that. If they sanction the event through the ISWA/USAW what is the problem? It's an option we didn't have a week ago. I really don't understand the issue. Justin Ratliff and JMILL 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UncleJimmy Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 The issue is several wrestlers/families have spent vacation time/money to attend events that were on a schedule that was on the ISWA website because there was no indication there would be any other way to get the 2 mandated qualifiers in. Now, similar to last years waiver debacle, 2 weeks before the state tourney there has become a new/unpublicized/EASIER/MORE CONVENIENT way to qualify. It's great it's happening, just like it was great waivers were allowed last year. The issue is putting out parameters then changing them midstream with no notice. It makes those who have followed the parameters quite upset. "Finding a way..." is great, but it shouldn't have to be found...it should be set forth as an option in the beginning. Fairness to all participants seems to be the issue. KarlHungus and Y2CJ41 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 Perhaps someone can help me understand something. I am by far not the sharpest pencil in the box. Last year the ISWA said no waivers for Freestyle State and then the week of the event they retracted that policy and allowed waivers. I agree that was handled poorly. This year the ISWA again states no waivers. I have been told by the ISWA State Chairman and other Board Members that they are standing firm with no waivers and will not bend whatsoever. I don't agree with that, but that's the way it is. Now we have a few folks finding a way to give more athletes an opportunity to compete by hosting an event and people are opposed to that. If they sanction the event through the ISWA/USAW what is the problem? It's an option we didn't have a week ago. I really don't understand the issue. According to the ISWA website, "Weigh-ins and skin checks are required for all sanctioned local tournaments." I don't see anything on the info sheets from the participating teams about weigh-ins. Usually when you advertise an event for the kids you mention weigh-in times. Secondly the event is 2 hours split up for K-6 for an hour and 6-12 for an hour. This is being held in the Warren wrestling room. I'm not sure how big it is, but an hour means very few matches. Running an event for an hour and calling it a qualifier is skirting the "rules" no matter how hard you try to do it. My kids tonight will go for an hour and a half of good hard wrestling, yet we can't call it a qualifier. However they can go to something like this and maybe be on the mat for 10 minutes and call it a qualifier. I already know of others looking to do one of these "last chance" qualifiers for state. You'll see these pop up everywhere and they'll be shady as can be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattyb Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 (edited) Why reserve a gym? Just do it in the practice room then you don't need to move mats. Because us parents are crazy. Better to give folks a little room. But...hey.....if that is what it takes and kids are wrestling more freestyle then, I guess it doesn't matter. The bottom line is that freestyle is FUN. Tons of ways to score. Teaches kids to take better shots and finish. Once kids do it a few times... most of them absolutely love it. Just plain fun!!! No need to be shady. Do a weigh-in and give the kids as many matches as possible on a week night. Heck most of the kids are only getting a few matches on the weekend (if they win the thing). Edited April 20, 2016 by Mattyb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grecoref Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 (edited) According to the ISWA website, "Weigh-ins and skin checks are required for all sanctioned local tournaments." I don't see anything on the info sheets from the participating teams about weigh-ins. Usually when you advertise an event for the kids you mention weigh-in times. Secondly the event is 2 hours split up for K-6 for an hour and 6-12 for an hour. This is being held in the Warren wrestling room. I'm not sure how big it is, but an hour means very few matches. Running an event for an hour and calling it a qualifier is skirting the "rules" no matter how hard you try to do it. My kids tonight will go for an hour and a half of good hard wrestling, yet we can't call it a qualifier. However they can go to something like this and maybe be on the mat for 10 minutes and call it a qualifier. I already know of others looking to do one of these "last chance" qualifiers for state. You'll see these pop up everywhere and they'll be shady as can be. I agree that all requirements should be met for any sanctioned event. I would think you could wrestle 3 matches in an hour if it were organized properly. I was at Warren on Saturday and they had about 450 kids. We started about 9:30 and we were done around 3:00. That's pretty organized. The issue is several wrestlers/families have spent vacation time/money to attend events that were on a schedule that was on the ISWA website because there was no indication there would be any other way to get the 2 mandated qualifiers in. Now, similar to last years waiver debacle, 2 weeks before the state tourney there has become a new/unpublicized/EASIER/MORE CONVENIENT way to qualify. It's great it's happening, just like it was great waivers were allowed last year. The issue is putting out parameters then changing them midstream with no notice. It makes those who have followed the parameters quite upset. "Finding a way..." is great, but it shouldn't have to be found...it should be set forth as an option in the beginning. Fairness to all participants seems to be the issue. I couldn't agree more that "it shouldn't have to be found." Being fair is important to me as well. If I thought for on minute this was not fair I would be taking the opposite stance. Edited April 20, 2016 by grecoref Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattyb Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 (edited) BTW... Someone suggested to me at Middle School Duals, when the Indiana teams wrestled each other..... "Hey, can we do freestyle this round, and count this as a qualifying tournament!!" Just thought that was really funny. Edited April 20, 2016 by Mattyb Y2CJ41 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 I agree that all requirements should be met for any sanctioned event. I would think you could wrestle 3 matches in an hour if it were organized properly. I was at Warren on Saturday and they had about 450 kids. We started about 9:30 and we were done around 3:30. That's pretty organized. I couldn't agree more that "it shouldn't have to be found." Being fair is important to me as well. If I thought for on minute this was not fair I would be taking the opposite stance. We had a "live night" a few years ago where kids would pair themselves up for matches. In just over two hours on two mats with about 30 kids they got maybe 3 or 4 matches. This just seems very shady in that there aren't weight classes, nor even age groups. Heck a schoolboy could wrestle a junior or a peewee could wrestle a schoolboy and it's alright. The other thing is this is only listed as going an hour. It just raises a red flag when I see that as I can't see them running 60 matches(20 weights per team) in an hour. InTheCircle 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripleB Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 Joe send in 150 and get a qualifier. I agree, hats off to the Indy guys for going outside the box and getting kids matches and a chance to qualify for Freestyle State. Justin Ratliff 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 Joe send in 150 and get a qualifier. I agree, hats off to the Indy guys for going outside the box and getting kids matches and a chance to qualify for Freestyle State. It's $175. Plus all my kids interested in freestyle have already ponied up the cash and weekends to go elsewhere. I can't wait until next year when we see about 20 of these pop up around the state. InTheCircle 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripleB Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 I'm gonna host "The Madison National Freestyle State Qualifying Championships" Should bring in all the studs w/ "National Championship" attached to it. If you win, then you are a National Freestyle State Qualfier TeamGarcia, gogoplata89, grecoref and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigdanteague Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 I'm gonna host "The Madison National Freestyle State Qualifying Championships" Should bring in all the studs w/ "National Championship" attached to it. If you win, then you are a National Freestyle State Qualfier Does this include a free registration to the Jeff County Beach Nationals as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripleB Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 Oh......now you are onto something.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Ratliff Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 This just seems very shady in that there aren't weight classes, nor even age groups. Heck a schoolboy could wrestle a junior or a peewee could wrestle a schoolboy and it's alright. The elementary duals early in the year don't go by the USA age divisions. Just K-6th grade. My 2nd grader wrestled some 6th graders who are Novices or Schoolboys but I knew he could handle it. Surely the parents and coaches involved will do the same. It's hard to get a bunch of matches in Freestyle or even in the average practice room right now for some kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaltHarris Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 Just an opinion, but I don’t feel comfortable with the sand shifting under our feet. These ‘opportunities’ seem contrived and could create inequity. I don’t want to be mean to ISWA, just want to make a point. Example from back when I was teaching. I tell kids months beforehand a term paper is due May 7. No one is allowed to use web resources. Then in the last weeks leading up to the May 7 due date, a couple students privately tell me they are having a hard time completing the paper, so can they use the web? I give the kids permission to use web. But I don’t announce that it’s now okay to use the web to the class. I think some other students and parents would be upset about that because they put in a lot of extra work. Y2CJ41 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach_Mazurek Posted April 23, 2016 Share Posted April 23, 2016 "Northern" wrestlers do not need to drive long distances to get their two tournaments in. South Bend this Saturday and Penn next Saturday should allow all the northern wrestlers to qualify for state and not have to spend the weekend driving hours to find a tournament. Harper and I have the blue shirts, excellent pairings people, and the facilities to get some good freestyle and greco wrestling done and be out the door in a decent time. The opportunity is there. Take advantage of the situation presented. Bill Flatt South Bend Riley Bill is spot on... We always like to attend SBR FS/GR... It is a nicely run tournament which does not take up your whole day... See you in the am. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InTheCircle Posted April 23, 2016 Share Posted April 23, 2016 (edited) Iswa doing this is bull cr@p. Really?!?! We now have hidden events not on the iswa official schedule that count? And this really unfair to rural schools. Indy or South Bend or Evansville can toss together a triple dual quick because there are lots of nearby schools. Try being a small rural club where the closest freestyle club is an hour away. What p!sses the most is there's ALREADY tons of tourneys in Indy and then they throw this on top of it of make believe tourneys. Just disgusting. People already are driving three hours and giving up great tourneys to comply with this rule and then hidden qualifiers that are really just practices appear to screw us. I can't believe this debacle. Edited April 23, 2016 by InTheCircle IU89 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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