sudden death 7 Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 Fabio is on par with the junk yard dog, hacksaw jim dugan, leaping lanny poffo,& the ultimate warrior....."I WOULD NEVER AND I MEAN NEVER EVEN CONSIDER COMPARING A NATIONAL TREASURE LIKE FABIO TO A FICTIONAL CHARACTER LIKE FOREST GUMP", HE'S WAY TOO SMART.(TAKE YOUR PICK) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabio Jr. Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 I can only dream of having the kind of rhymes that The Professor Lanny Poffo had Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMILL Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 SD7..........I appreciate the life saving clarification on that issue as Fabio has a little army of ankle biters that could sneak in during the middle of the night and extract some revenge on you if he so ordered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sudden death 7 Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 I am well aware of this fact, thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greco4life Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 dont ya just love just having this conversation.... CJ has left and will leave his mark on the state of indiana wrestling. the list of 4 timers and 3 timers are stud filled and there are fond memories of all. i did notice one thing tho in a remark about humphreys beating howe. this was humps sr yr and howes freshman yr. does that make a difference ? not really or does it? just like cj and nick lee a poster stated they will not be the same wt. this also reminds me of hump and angel both going the same wt all the way up until sectional if my memory serves correct before hump went up a wt to avoid what would have been the match of the century at that time. the sight I adore..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU89 Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 dont ya just love just having this conversation.... CJ has left and will leave his mark on the state of indiana wrestling. the list of 4 timers and 3 timers are stud filled and there are fond memories of all. i did notice one thing tho in a remark about humphreys beating howe. this was humps sr yr and howes freshman yr. does that make a difference ? not really or does it? just like cj and nick lee a poster stated they will not be the same wt. this also reminds me of hump and angel both going the same wt all the way up until sectional if my memory serves correct before hump went up a wt to avoid what would have been the match of the century at that time. the sight I adore..... Nick Lee will be at 132. Will CJ be there too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maligned Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 (edited) Greco4life, in the Hump/Angel season, Hump was at 130 and Angel was at 135 the whole season. The reason you remember there being a feeling that Hump was avoiding the match was bc people assumed Angel was cutting down already and it was the lower weight guy's job to go up. As it turned out, Angel probably could have gone down just as easily as Hump going up. Angel has wrestled his entire college and international career somewhere between 121 and 126. Edited October 23, 2015 by maligned Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripleB Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 They were co-ranked #1 all year at 135 w/ Hump making the drop right before sectionals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maligned Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 They were co-ranked #1 all year at 135 w/ Hump making the drop right before sectionals. My mistake. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Guru Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 Maintaining a #1 national ranking for 2 years while regularly attending Super32, Fargo, FloNat and WNO is super impressive. IMO he has a very high ceiling at the next level. I believe his intense movement, willingness to take risk and attack has made the difference for him in big matches. How he transitions to D1 will have a lot to do with coaching and guidance. I really like the choice of Nebraska for that reason. If he were to adopt the heavily risk averse style we see from a number of college teams these days, that ceiling comes way down. Best ever in high school? He's just as impressive as the other obvious candidates. JT was already wrestling a risk averse tie-heavy style his senior year in HS and was dominant. Best ever? In the right room he has a great chance to be the best ever. I'd wait until there's a more complete body of work before giving that distinction. jjacoby 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alduflux Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 They were co-ranked #1 all year at 135 w/ Hump making the drop right before sectionals. I remember a rumor at the time saying Hump would have stayed at 135 if they could have been assured of a Finals match up, and not a semi-finals match up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
concussed and confused Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Gator roll you're living in the past my friend, a good list I might add, but come on man Isn't that the point of this post? The statement that Red is the greatest high school wrestler in the history of Indiana is a question that intrinsically requires the person being asked to look at the history (the past). I concur that the aforementioned list is an excellent one; however, I would personally include Greg Schaefer on that list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brickfor6 Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 (edited) Blake Maurer Matt Coughlin Leroy Vega Alex Tsirtsis Jason Tsirtsis Angel Escobedo ANDREW HOWE All hold higher spots than CJ on my Indiana's "Best Ever" list. CJ is a monster -- don't get me wrong. What is your criteria besides a strong region bias? We are talking strictly high school accomplishments. Lil Tsirtis is the only logical answer to compare and he lost a couple matches in high school. We are not counting what they did after because Chad Jr has yet to graduate. So if he finishes undefeated and ranked #1?in the country then we shall not debate. Major do you think if these guys would of been from down south they would of accomplished the same thing? ABSOLUTELY! For you to say this list is region bias is incredible. In my opinion Angel Escobedo is "best ever" It didnt matter who he wrestled he put a beating on them. Lets count the 4 major decisions he had under the lights against some tough opponents. Yes he had one loss in hs out of state but dont get me wrong, if we count national tournaments how many losses does red have out of state, for example he lost to indianas brandon james at 2014 flonats. Has angel ever lost to an indiana opponent? Chad red is on the all time great list, but the best? I dont know :/ Chad red is a great wrestler with great accomplishments, not taking anything away from the kid, I am just stating my opinion. This argument could go on forever. Who would win in a match?....who won this? he won that! etc. etc. etc. Indiana's best ever in my opinion is ANGEL ESCOBEDO, lets leave it at that. Edited November 18, 2015 by brickfor6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILUV2PIN Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 If Red gets through this season undefeated and gets that 4th title to his name, no doubt that he becomes a top-5 guy all-time in Indiana. However, it's unfortunate that we have hindsight knowing that Escobedo, Howe, and JTsirtsis winning their NCAA titles clouds our vision of who is truly the best Indiana HIGH SCHOOL wrestler. But if we keep college accomplishments out of the convo, I would have to say hands down that Andrew Howe is the best wrestler in Indiana history. Just my opinion though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caleb Spires Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 I pick Jason Tsirtsis. Wasn't scored on sophomore year on up, was also #1 nationally senior year(p4p too? I can't remember), and crushed an NCAA champion just a couple months after winning his 4th state title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATWP2015 Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Humphrey would have been a 4x state champ had he not let Nick Hartman wrestle the tournament in 01' to 02' season. A true sportsman, so that alone gets my vote. But in my opinion if you are a 4x state champion you are in a very small group of people and deserve all the accolades. Some from different eras as well, so no matter what way you spin it, Chad Red is still a bad ass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sportsfangms Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 So he let him win the spot? It's been many years, but Hartman placed that year in the top 5 if I recall. Have a hard time believing that story. Wouldn't it have made more sense for one to wrestle 112 and the other 103? I guess the guy at 112 didn't want to "give" anyone his spot as readily as Hump did. I do agree with the last part of your post, he's a bad dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeepingUpWithTheJones' Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Gator roll you're living in the past my friend, a good list I might add, but come on man The question was 'BEST EVER' ...you have to live in the past. ILUV2PIN 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrecoCoach Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 So he let him win the spot? It's been many years, but Hartman placed that year in the top 5 if I recall. Have a hard time believing that story. Wouldn't it have made more sense for one to wrestle 112 and the other 103? I guess the guy at 112 didn't want to "give" anyone his spot as readily as Hump did. I do agree with the last part of your post, he's a bad dude. Hartman was a senior and won state that year. Humphrey was a freshman who wrestled up a weight at 112 and was a state qualifier. I don't know if there was ever an official wrestle off between the two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MD92 Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Either way, it might be a stretch to say that Humphrey would have won state at 103 that year. If memory serves, he got majored by Angel on Friday night that year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
800lbs Gorilla Mama Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 You basically have three areas to look at when determining this Undefeated High School # of State Titles National Accolades Jason Tsirtsis has the max on all of these except the undefeated high school resume. He lost to a very tough Cashe Quiroga, but has a head scratching loss Anthony Napules. His national accolades are top notch which include his whole senior year at #1 along with a Fargo title. He was a two-time Super 32 runner-up however. Angel Escobedo has a lot of these requirements also. He only had one loss to an out of state opponent. However he never won a Fargo title. Reece Humphrey has only(compared to the others) three state titles. He has a Fargo title, but that was in Greco. Alex Tsirtsis has two of the three like the others, but didn't have the consensus #1 ranking and never won a Fargo title. The biggest one to compare is Lance Ellis as he has two of the three also. He was EXTREMELY dominant during his career. However his national accolades aren't that many due to lack of events as there are today. In watching his highlights on YouTube, he looked ahead of his time with his technique and skill. Red has all three and no one has won the events he has with the Super 32 and Fargo AND FloNationals. Barring any hiccups he will have been ranked #1 for basically two years. That is pretty unheard of for an Indiana wrestler due to our in season travel rules. I agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIME Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Maybe you should have this conversation after 2/20/16 around 10pm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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