Jayruss Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 Is it too early to say he's Indiana's best high school wrestler ever ? I think he just might be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Ursula Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 After his performance at Who's #1 if he wins his 4th state title there is no discussion, he is the best ever. Jayruss 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluemonster Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 I would have to agree, however T-shirts has 4 state titles and a NCAA Title. Close race, we'll have to see how the next few years play out. TandTdad 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayruss Posted October 18, 2015 Author Share Posted October 18, 2015 Saying strictly high school at this point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmericanPride Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 The dance was on point! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maligned Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 (edited) If he wins out this season and goes on to win everything on the freestyle circuit, his accomplishments will be second to none. However, there is still an argument about the level of wrestling he's risen to at this point, today. He's amazing, but don't forget that Jason Tsirtsis was the number one recruit, pound-for-pound best kid in America by the time he came out. He had no close matches at all from fellow high schoolers as he took every national title on the spring tour after his senior year. No one was within shouting distance. He even went to an Olympic trials qualifying event that season and came within an eyelash of qualifying for our US Trials, beating a couple college all-americans, including a college national champ (a month after HS state finals!!). Red's on that track, but he's not quite there yet. Edited October 18, 2015 by maligned Jayruss 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headlock83 Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 Short memory. Angel has to be considered. As far as high school wrestling goes, pound for pound Angel takes him. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gator Roll Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 Blake Maurer Matt Coughlin Leroy Vega Alex Tsirtsis Jason Tsirtsis Angel Escobedo ANDREW HOWE All hold higher spots than CJ on my Indiana's "Best Ever" list. CJ is a monster -- don't get me wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayruss Posted October 18, 2015 Author Share Posted October 18, 2015 Gator roll you're living in the past my friend, a good list I might add, but come on man TheNextDynasty 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FASTMarine Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 (edited) Chad is a great wrestler along with the others listed, but I don't think any have the body of work Reece Humphrey does. Has Chad ever had to beat an Andrew Howe in the State finals? Only time will tell. Chad has all the tools to eclipse everyone. But again only time will tell... On a side note, Chad's celebration dance need work...He might want to checkout some of Reese's... Edited October 18, 2015 by FASTMarine Jayruss 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Ursula Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 Blake Maurer Matt Coughlin Leroy Vega Alex Tsirtsis Jason Tsirtsis Angel Escobedo ANDREW HOWE All hold higher spots than CJ on my Indiana's "Best Ever" list. CJ is a monster -- don't get me wrong. What is your criteria besides a strong region bias? We are talking strictly high school accomplishments. Lil Tsirtis is the only logical answer to compare and he lost a couple matches in high school. We are not counting what they did after because Chad Jr has yet to graduate. So if he finishes undefeated and ranked #1?in the country then we shall not debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayruss Posted October 18, 2015 Author Share Posted October 18, 2015 Chad is a great wrestler along with the others listed, but I don't think any have the body of work Reece Humphrey does. Has Chad ever had to beat an Andrew Howe in the State finals? Only time will tell. Chad has all the tools to eclipse everyone. But again only time will tell... On a side note, Chad's celebration dance need work...He might want to checkout some of Reese's... Andrew Howe was a freshmen when Hump beat him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FASTMarine Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 What is your criteria besides a strong region bias? We are talking strictly high school accomplishments. Lil Tsirtis is the only logical answer to compare and he lost a couple matches in high school. We are not counting what they did after because Chad Jr has yet to graduate. So if he finishes undefeated and ranked #1?in the country then we shall not debate. Who's we? Several people are talking NCAA and/or freestyles, which goes to the Sr. Division. The topic is titled "Chad Red Indian's best ever?" So that's what I was taking about, "Best Ever". If we're taking High school only, it would be hard to vote against Chad. That is given he wins State this year. I mean none of the others listed had anything like "Who's #1" on their Resume. I still say he has work to do....on his celebration dance !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 (edited) I mean none of the others listed had anything like "Who's #1" on their Resume.WNO is a very recent addition to the elite level folkstyle events, none of the others mentioned would have a chance to add it to their resume. However, a few other HS folkstyle events that IN kids can attend or be invited to maybe comparable to winning two big matches at WNO: -Winning the older version of NHSCA Senior Nationals when that was the only major Folkstyle post season event around. Obviously, the more recent versions have been very watered down. -Winning a deep bracket at Super 32 of FloNationals where you would have seen a few highly ranked kids in the last few rounds. (Note Red has these on his resume too) -Winning a USA All-Star or Dapper Dan All-Star match against a top ranked opponent. (Red is on track to add one or maybe two of these to his resume too) Edited October 19, 2015 by MattM Pops, FASTMarine and Major Ursula 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU89 Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 The 132 final at the Mater Dei Holiday Classic will be worth the price of admission! loscoz, FASTMarine and Jayruss 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 You basically have three areas to look at when determining this Undefeated High School # of State Titles National Accolades Jason Tsirtsis has the max on all of these except the undefeated high school resume. He lost to a very tough Cashe Quiroga, but has a head scratching loss Anthony Napules. His national accolades are top notch which include his whole senior year at #1 along with a Fargo title. He was a two-time Super 32 runner-up however. Angel Escobedo has a lot of these requirements also. He only had one loss to an out of state opponent. However he never won a Fargo title. Reece Humphrey has only(compared to the others) three state titles. He has a Fargo title, but that was in Greco. Alex Tsirtsis has two of the three like the others, but didn't have the consensus #1 ranking and never won a Fargo title. The biggest one to compare is Lance Ellis as he has two of the three also. He was EXTREMELY dominant during his career. However his national accolades aren't that many due to lack of events as there are today. In watching his highlights on YouTube, he looked ahead of his time with his technique and skill. Red has all three and no one has won the events he has with the Super 32 and Fargo AND FloNationals. Barring any hiccups he will have been ranked #1 for basically two years. That is pretty unheard of for an Indiana wrestler due to our in season travel rules. Major Ursula 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayruss Posted October 19, 2015 Author Share Posted October 19, 2015 The 132 final at the Mater Dei Holiday Classic will be worth the price of admission! Red and the Lees will not end up in the same weight class Pops 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ontherise219 Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 (edited) CJ just won a 4 man bracket with the top 4 in the country. One kid had just won a cadet world title. It's going to be about your personal preference. but with out a doubt Cj is the best right now. Edited October 19, 2015 by ontherise219 Pops 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki27 Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 I'd still rank my boy Lance #1 Major Ursula 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Ursula Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 You basically have three areas to look at when determining this Undefeated High School # of State Titles National Accolades Jason Tsirtsis has the max on all of these except the undefeated high school resume. He lost to a very tough Cashe Quiroga, but has a head scratching loss Anthony Napules. His national accolades are top notch which include his whole senior year at #1 along with a Fargo title. He was a two-time Super 32 runner-up however. Angel Escobedo has a lot of these requirements also. He only had one loss to an out of state opponent. However he never won a Fargo title. Reece Humphrey has only(compared to the others) three state titles. He has a Fargo title, but that was in Greco. Alex Tsirtsis has two of the three like the others, but didn't have the consensus #1 ranking and never won a Fargo title. The biggest one to compare is Lance Ellis as he has two of the three also. He was EXTREMELY dominant during his career. However his national accolades aren't that many due to lack of events as there are today. In watching his highlights on YouTube, he looked ahead of his time with his technique and skill. Red has all three and no one has won the events he has with the Super 32 and Fargo AND FloNationals. Barring any hiccups he will have been ranked #1 for basically two years. That is pretty unheard of for an Indiana wrestler due to our in season travel rules. Thanks for putting Lance in their y'all know I loved his competitiveness. People complain about Red's dances but trust me when Lance Ellis walked around Market Square Arena it was like he owned it. The throws the majesty! He was in a class by himself then. Everything else you said ditto. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 Indiana seems to be gaining ground on the National Level every year. I amazed by the travel opportunities our elementary kids now have. Guys like CJ and Nick and Joe Lee, Rypel, Streck show these kids what can be achieved with hard work and dedication. CJ is a gifted athlete but its his work ethic that has earned him the #1 spot. Something tells me he likes being the best and will continue to elevate his game to stay on top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
base Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 Strictly for High School record, I think the only one that can compare is Lance Ellis, due to his incredible percentage of victories by fall. Although I haven't seen the numbers on Chad -- maybe his is nearly as high It remains to be seen how Chad does at the next level but how impressive to put his #1 ranking on the line in this tournament and come out on top with all the pressure on him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ENoblewrestling Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 Strictly for High School record, I think the only one that can compare is Lance Ellis, due to his incredible percentage of victories by fall. Although I haven't seen the numbers on Chad -- maybe his is nearly as high It remains to be seen how Chad does at the next level but how impressive to put his #1 ranking on the line in this tournament and come out on top with all the pressure on him Alex Tsirtis was also undefeated for four years, Angel only had one loss... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ENoblewrestling Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 What about Mauer or Micic? Mauer was a four timer, I'm not real sure on his national accomplishments. I may be wrong, but I think he was the only 4 timer to win each in a different weight class. If I remember correctly the weights that he won at were higher up, so that made his accomplishments stand out too. Wasn't he like a 45 when he won as a freshmen? As for Micic, he was a three timer. Who did he lose to his first year? His national credentials are pretty solid too, correct? Anyone know much about Steven Bradley? He stood out when I first started going to state. loscoz 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabio Jr. Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 What makes CJ special is that there is not a national event he hasn't won. He hasn't dodged kids (even though some on this board might be crazy enough to argue about) he has won EVERY MAJOR NATIONAL EVENT one can while holding on to an undefeated high school season so far. How many Indiana kids went undefeated in HS, Won Fargo, Won the Major Folkstyle National Event (Flo, Super 32, NHSCA before those)? I know its not a Dapper Dan but at WNO he wrestled 4 and 2 and won both of those matches. Love him or hate him CJ Red is the BEST high school wrestler to come out of Indiana at this moment in time. Pops and Jayruss 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts