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Swallow his pride? He is ranked number 1 in the country. What more does he have to do? He didn't look huge to me. He looked like a 126lber. He wrestled 106 as a freshman. Nick Lee 126. No disrespect

I wouldn't take it so harshly.  Kids wrestle up for the competition all the time.  For example, last year, undefeated 106 Paul Konrath wrestled up to face Tyler Ferguson of Reitz at 113 and lost.  It

I just hope that Red, the Lee's, Kobe Woods, Konrath, etc all go to FILA Cadets and make the Cadet World Team. That would be really cool to see multiple Indiana wrestlers represented.

Red will not swallow his pride enough to face Nick Lee. I've said it before and I'll say it again. Red not only wants to go out as a 4x champ, but hopefully an unblemished record. He's had opportunities to make this happen, only to not take that chance.

If i was to eat my words on this issue, I'll take Nick by 5 or more.

Swallow his pride? He is ranked number 1 in the country. What more does he have to do? He didn't look huge to me. He looked like a 126lber. He wrestled 106 as a freshman. Nick Lee 126. No disrespect I believe Lee is bigger. James beat CJ in the offseason. CJ still won state. It's not CJ's job to wrestle Nick Lee. It's CJ's job to win state for New Pal and himself. All these mythical match ups mean nothing. All that he should make it happen stuff sounds to me like you want him to lose. That's terrible if you just want a kid to lose and he is not presently facing your kid, or a your kids teammate or club member. That's the unwritten rule or you sir have sour grapes. Nick Lee is great, matter of fact I had him against Micic. So nothing against him; who ever says they know for certain Lee would win are either clairvoyant or delusional.
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Swallow his pride? He is ranked number 1 in the country. What more does he have to do? He didn't look huge to me. He looked like a 126lber. He wrestled 106 as a freshman. Nick Lee 126. No disrespect I believe Lee is bigger. James beat CJ in the offseason. CJ still won state. It's not CJ's job to wrestle Nick Lee. It's CJ's job to win state for New Pal and himself. All these mythical match ups mean nothing. All that he should make it happen stuff sounds to me like you want him to lose. That's terrible if you just want a kid to lose and he is not presently facing your kid, or a your kids teammate or club member. That's the unwritten rule or you sir have sour grapes. Nick Lee is great, matter of fact I had him against Micic. So nothing against him; who ever says they know for certain Lee would win are either clairvoyant or delusional.

 

I wouldn't take it so harshly.  Kids wrestle up for the competition all the time.  For example, last year, undefeated 106 Paul Konrath wrestled up to face Tyler Ferguson of Reitz at 113 and lost.  It didn't affect his ranking, nor how he performed at state as he ended up with a runner up finish.  

 

It would make sense for Chad to do so, but by no means is he compelled to do it.  Don't criticize fans for wanting to see that match up.  From the match up perspective, the only way for it to happen is for Chad to wrestle up, unless Nick weighs less than we know.  I'm hesitant to think he's scared or trying to "protect" his undefeated streak because there could be many reasons and he may not have a say in it.  But I understand where those assumptions come from.  I just wouldn't worry so much about specific internet comments and think more about the general point that is trying to be made.  

 

It would be one helluva match we would ALL love to see!  And as I said last year, it seems to me, outside of off season tournaments, the MD Holiday Classic seems like the perfect time for it.

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I wouldn't take it so harshly. Kids wrestle up for the competition all the time. For example, last year, undefeated 106 Paul Konrath wrestled up to face Tyler Ferguson of Reitz at 113 and lost. It didn't affect his ranking, nor how he performed at state as he ended up with a runner up finish.

 

It would make sense for Chad to do so, but by no means is he compelled to do it. Don't criticize fans for wanting to see that match up. From the match up perspective, the only way for it to happen is for Chad to wrestle up, unless Nick weighs less than we know. I'm hesitant to think he's scared or trying to "protect" his undefeated streak because there could be many reasons and he may not have a say in it. But I understand where those assumptions come from. I just wouldn't worry so much about specific internet comments and think more about the general point that is trying to be made.

 

It would be one helluva match we would ALL love to see! And as I said last year, it seems to me, outside of off season tournaments, the MD Holiday Classic seems like the perfect time for it.[/quote\]

 

 

 

I'm not criticizing people because people want to see the match up. I do too. I'm just sick of people implying he is afraid or too proud. That's ridiculous and I'll stand on it. Especially people who have not come close to his accomplishments. If Angel or Lance was on here saying it I might give it some credence. But fanboys and haters I don't even entertain their nonsense. To win 1 state title is incredible. He has won three unblemished. I'm gonna just sit back and enjoy the ride and appreciate greatness when it's right in front of me.

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I wouldn't take it so harshly.  Kids wrestle up for the competition all the time.  For example, last year, undefeated 106 Paul Konrath wrestled up to face Tyler Ferguson of Reitz at 113 and lost.  It didn't affect his ranking, nor how he performed at state as he ended up with a runner up finish.  

 

It would make sense for Chad to do so, but by no means is he compelled to do it.  Don't criticize fans for wanting to see that match up.  From the match up perspective, the only way for it to happen is for Chad to wrestle up, unless Nick weighs less than we know.  I'm hesitant to think he's scared or trying to "protect" his undefeated streak because there could be many reasons and he may not have a say in it.  But I understand where those assumptions come from.  I just wouldn't worry so much about specific internet comments and think more about the general point that is trying to be made.  

 

It would be one helluva match we would ALL love to see!  And as I said last year, it seems to me, outside of off season tournaments, the MD Holiday Classic seems like the perfect time for it.

I don't think it is criticizing fans for wanting to see the match up. What wrestling fan would not want to see this match up. It is comments like Red won't swallow his pride enough. Like I said in another post, I hope the coach is making the final call on dual weights. And two who cares if Red desires to go out with an unblemished record. I don't know what his college plans are. If he goes out with a totally unblemished record he can choose wherever he wants to go. We can talk about imaginary match ups all day, that is what a board is for. But let's hold off on making accusations about high school kids and why they would or wouldn't bump or cut. Nick and Chad both wrestled everyone who stepped on the mat in their weight class and both had great seasons. I would love to see the match ups. I think Chad would be giving up some size against Nick so that would make it hard fro him from my perspective.

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I wouldn't take it so harshly. Kids wrestle up for the competition all the time. For example, last year, undefeated 106 Paul Konrath wrestled up to face Tyler Ferguson of Reitz at 113 and lost. It didn't affect his ranking, nor how he performed at state as he ended up with a runner up finish.

 

It would make sense for Chad to do so, but by no means is he compelled to do it. Don't criticize fans for wanting to see that match up. From the match up perspective, the only way for it to happen is for Chad to wrestle up, unless Nick weighs less than we know. I'm hesitant to think he's scared or trying to "protect" his undefeated streak because there could be many reasons and he may not have a say in it. But I understand where those assumptions come from. I just wouldn't worry so much about specific internet comments and think more about the general point that is trying to be made.

 

It would be one helluva match we would ALL love to see! And as I said last year, it seems to me, outside of off season tournaments, the MD Holiday Classic seems like the perfect time for it.[/quote\]

 

 

 

I'm not criticizing people because people want to see the match up. I do too. I'm just sick of people implying he is afraid or too proud. That's ridiculous and I'll stand on it. Especially people who have not come close to his accomplishments. If Angel or Lance was on here saying it I might give it some credence. But fanboys and haters I don't even entertain their nonsense. To win 1 state title is incredible. He has won three unblemished. I'm gonna just sit back and enjoy the ride and appreciate greatness when it's right in front of me.

 

I hear what you are saying but the two points are not mutually exclusive.  Red could be BOTH very protective of his undefeated record and avoiding the challenge of wrestling up (because it's not something he has to do) AND win 4 state championships and be considered one of the greatest wrestlers in Indiana history.  I'm not saying that is the case, but what you are stating does not eliminate the arguments of those you detest.  

 

Simply put, no one would think less of him as a wrestler if he won 4 state championships but at some point took on the challenge and lost a close match to Lee.  It's HIS and his coaches prerogative to decide whether they want to do that and they have no obligation to do so.  But us fanboys (doubt any are really haters) would love to see it and in some ways respect him more if he did.  Regardless, Chad is a superior talent and could even beat Lee.  He is no doubt on his way to an exclusive place in Indiana wrestling history!  

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I hear what you are saying but the two points are not mutually exclusive. Red could be BOTH very protective of his undefeated record and avoiding the challenge of wrestling up (because it's not something he has to do) AND win 4 state championships and be considered one of the greatest wrestlers in Indiana history. I'm not saying that is the case, but what you are stating does not eliminate the arguments of those you detest.

 

Simply put, no one would think less of him as a wrestler if he won 4 state championships but at some point took on the challenge and lost a close match to Lee. It's HIS and his coaches prerogative to decide whether they want to do that and they have no obligation to do so. But us fanboys (doubt any are really haters) would love to see it and in some ways respect him more if he did. Regardless, Chad is a superior talent and could even beat Lee. He is no doubt on his way to an exclusive place in Indiana wrestling history!

I'm from the inner city and where I'm from if you want someone to lose arbitrarily, you are a hater by definition. Not big hate, little hate like a petty individual. That's not saying you personally. Just anyone who throws salt on this kid who represents our state like you would dream for your own kid. When I'm older and greyest, I'll be aw telling my grands about this kid with the talent,swagger, and mentality and fancy pants who did it big time with flare.

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Let's start with the premise that Chad Red does not exist to entertain me. Yet I am highly entertained by him. The logical conclusion then is he can do whatever he pleases for whatever reason he pleases and my opinion of that matters not a wit (and it is just an opinion after all for how can I or anyone possibly claim to know what is in his mind), but I can still watch him wrestle and enjoy it. Of course, I would be more entertained if he and the Lee boys wrestled, but if Chad Red every weighs what I want in his thought process I would be disappointed.  That said, come on and make this happen. And I take either Nick Lee in a close one between two all out attackers. I also like Joe Lee, but in a much more tactical affair that ends up decided by power.

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I just hope that Red, the Lee's, Kobe Woods, Konrath, etc all go to FILA Cadets and make the Cadet World Team. That would be really cool to see multiple Indiana wrestlers represented.

I agree.  However, Chad and Nick will be in the same weight class (58Kg), so both won't make the World Team.

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I hear what you are saying but the two points are not mutually exclusive.  Red could be BOTH very protective of his undefeated record and avoiding the challenge of wrestling up (because it's not something he has to do) AND win 4 state championships and be considered one of the greatest wrestlers in Indiana history.  I'm not saying that is the case, but what you are stating does not eliminate the arguments of those you detest.  

 

Simply put, no one would think less of him as a wrestler if he won 4 state championships but at some point took on the challenge and lost a close match to Lee.  It's HIS and his coaches prerogative to decide whether they want to do that and they have no obligation to do so.  But us fanboys (doubt any are really haters) would love to see it and in some ways respect him more if he did.  Regardless, Chad is a superior talent and could even beat Lee.  He is no doubt on his way to an exclusive place in Indiana wrestling history!  

Do people think of Angel as a worse wrestler than Alex because he had one loss?  Is Jason considered a worse wrestler than Alex because he lost?

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Better or worse, no, but Alex is King because his wins are followed by "0". You can mention all of them as 4 time champions, just like Blake Mauer, but Alex Tsirtsis and Lance Ellis are in exclusive company in the modern era because they were undefeated.  So to answer the question at the root here, yes, it matters that he goes down with no losses. 

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I'm from the inner city and where I'm from if you want someone to lose arbitrarily, you are a hater by definition. Not big hate, little hate like a petty individual. That's not saying you personally. Just anyone who throws salt on this kid who represents our state like you would dream for your own kid. When I'm older and greyest, I'll be aw telling my grands about this kid with the talent,swagger, and mentality and fancy pants who did it big time with flare.

Chad is a great wrestler and he is a 3x state champ and is a very decorated wrestler but when you are those things then act like you are those things and that you've been there before! No need to wear a shirt with your picture on it or dance after you've won and demoralize the guy you just beat. Be humble, and if you want to do those things then do it behind the scene! That is why some people probably do want to see him get beat it's not that their "haters" they just like class! Nick Lee is not only a state and national champion but also an international champion and I guarantee you he does not act like that, he is a true class act!

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Chad is a great wrestler and he is a 3x state champ and is a very decorated wrestler but when you are those things then act like you are those things and that you've been there before! No need to wear a shirt with your picture on it or dance after you've won and demoralize the guy you just beat. Be humble, and if you want to do those things then do it behind the scene! That is why some people probably do want to see him get beat it's not that their "haters" they just like class! Nick Lee is not only a state and national champion but also an international champion and I guarantee you he does not act like that, he is a true class act!

 

He does not need to act like he has been there before...He has been there before. However he chooses to act is how a champion acts because he is one. I for one am glad he represents Indiana wrestling.

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All wrestlers have a certain swagger or confidence in their mannerisms and how the represent themselves. In my interactions with him he has always been respectful and just like any other teenager.  Remember guys like Reece Humphrey and Steve Sandefer both did a little dance after they won state titles.

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All wrestlers have a certain swagger or confidence in their mannerisms and how the represent themselves. In my interactions with him he has always been respectful and just like any other teenager.  Remember guys like Reece Humphrey and Steve Sandefer both did a little dance after they won state titles.

 

Exactly, and guys like Howe and Tsirtsis did not -- all are tremendous champions and continue to be great ambassadors of IN wrestling.

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