maligned Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 this week...then you'll have till mid-April to fill out info about your incoming freshmen and jv kids and get it back to us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greco165 Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 There are several teams that don't stand a chance to win! That's not the point this person is asking questions! New pal should be involved! Thanks for posting the qualifications for people to read! Trent the way you conducted yourself was inappropriate! But I expect that from someone who forfeits against good kids & not speaking of just one incident! This is why people don't want to get involved on the association because it's like a popularity contest! Keep perpetuating that victim mentality, it will take you far in life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach McCormick Posted March 20, 2014 Author Share Posted March 20, 2014 Central Noble and Cathedral come on board as of today. Still waiting to hear from the following schools: Large School Crown Point Warren Central Bloomington South Mid-Size School Southmont Small School Triton Central Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach McCormick Posted March 23, 2014 Author Share Posted March 23, 2014 Union County is in. Still awaiting response from 3A - Warren Central, Crown Point and Bloomington South; 2A - Southmont and 1A - Triton Central Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach McCormick Posted March 31, 2014 Author Share Posted March 31, 2014 Warren Central is in. Still waiting to hear from: Crown Point - 3A Bloomington South - 3A Southmont - 2A Triton Central - 1A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach McCormick Posted March 31, 2014 Author Share Posted March 31, 2014 Bloomington South (3A) and Southmont (2A) are in. Still awaiting word from Crown Point and Triton Central Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach McCormick Posted April 1, 2014 Author Share Posted April 1, 2014 Triton Central accepts 1A position! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyoung Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 Why are the final two spots a wild card that is voted in? If there's a certain number of entries for each class, and the current point system is being described by current IHSWCA board members as 'at this time the best way to determine eligibility,' why wouldn't you just use the system that was derived and currently in use? I understand that there may be JV kids and incoming freshman that might figure in and make a team stronger, but predicting one teams strength over another in that area would be like just using the final individual rankings to determine who wins a state title and who comes in 8th. By having a vote-in for the final spot, it does seem to open the door for accusations of 'politics' at the very least, and it shouldn't be surprising when accusations of such are thrown out. Voting is quite simply one man's opinion, and as a human there's no possible way to be completely unbiased. Would anyone take a bet against me if I were to say Franklin will certainly get in because they are the defending state champs? The answer to that is either: No (which suggests bias by the voters) or another logical argument is that they have the highest point total of any team not in the tournament, so they deserve that spot, which simply solidifies my argument that we should simply just use the mathematics that everyone has agreed upon as 'the best at this time.' Something to consider. Chris Young Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bog190 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 Why are the final two spots a wild card that is voted in? If there's a certain number of entries for each class, and the current point system is being described by current IHSWCA board members as 'at this time the best way to determine eligibility,' why wouldn't you just use the system that was derived and currently in use? I understand that there may be JV kids and incoming freshman that might figure in and make a team stronger, but predicting one teams strength over another in that area would be like just using the final individual rankings to determine who wins a state title and who comes in 8th. By having a vote-in for the final spot, it does seem to open the door for accusations of 'politics' at the very least, and it shouldn't be surprising when accusations of such are thrown out. Voting is quite simply one man's opinion, and as a human there's no possible way to be completely unbiased. Would anyone take a bet against me if I were to say Franklin will certainly get in because they are the defending state champs? The answer to that is either: No (which suggests bias by the voters) or another logical argument is that they have the highest point total of any team not in the tournament, so they deserve that spot, which simply solidifies my argument that we should simply just use the mathematics that everyone has agreed upon as 'the best at this time.' Something to consider. Chris Young The math isn't flawless, everyone would acknowledge that. In the 1A version, one of the best teams finished 15th. Should that team be left off since they finished outside of the top 12? There has to be SOME margin of error. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyoung Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 If one of the best teams finished 15th mathematically, then there's got to be a better way, and probably a lot of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 Pretty soon the SPCA is going to be investigating this website due to how many dead horses are getting beaten. 1. No one has said this is a perfect system. It is a very good system for the constraints that we have. 2. The voting helps eliminate outliers and other variances we cannot see with the mathematical solution we have in place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greco165 Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 If one of the best teams finished 15th mathematically, then there's got to be a better way, and probably a lot of them. I'm sure the IHSWCA has open ears awaiting your superior suggestion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyoung Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 I'm sure the IHSWCA has open ears awaiting your superior suggestion I never claimed to be a statistician. I simply claimed that there's got to be a better mathematical formula, which is a fact that no one would deny. Thanks for your sarcasm, and in no way am I being elitist as your reply suggests. The reason for my original post was to simply point out that the powers that be should expect some sort of "call out" from teams that feel slighted for the simple fact that the final teams that get in are voted upon. When humans decide there's bias, and that's a fact. If the IHSWCA could find a way to do this where a vote was not needed, they would receive less flack. Flack that is clearly bothersome to the members in charge based upon the "defensive" replies. Chris Young Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greco165 Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 I never claimed to be a statistician. I simply claimed that there's got to be a better mathematical formula, which is a fact that no one would deny. Thanks for your sarcasm, and in no way am I being elitist as your reply suggests. The reason for my original post was to simply point out that the powers that be should expect some sort of "call out" from teams that feel slighted for the simple fact that the final teams that get in are voted upon. When humans decide there's bias, and that's a fact. If the IHSWCA could find a way to do this where a vote was not needed, they would receive less flack. Flack that is clearly bothersome to the members in charge based upon the "defensive" replies. Chris Young In your words, there are probably a lot of better ways to handle the selection process. Shockingly, out of all the great coaching and administrative minds in Indiana, not a single one has proposed a superior alternative that works within the constraints handed down by the IHSAA. For the most part, schools that perform year and year out to prove themselves as an elite team in their division will get an invitation, either via auto-selection or via the voting process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maligned Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Flack that is clearly bothersome to the members in charge based upon the "defensive" replies. No one that's answered your questions has any hand in voting or had any hand in designing the event. As others have said, you came out guns blazing regarding issues that have been discussed at great length--not even realizing that New Pal is in fact in the voting to be included, and not realizing that the system is designed to find next year's best teams (not this year's). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach McCormick Posted April 8, 2014 Author Share Posted April 8, 2014 Crown Point declines their berth into the event. Franklin Community accepts the 10th position in the 3A division. This sets the initial 10 teams in each of the 3 classes with selection voting to take place later this month in filling the final 2 spots in each division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tskin Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 I would remind all teams to make sure they submit there form that has been sent to them with as much information as possible so the panel can make the best possible decision on the final two spots per division. This is a ever evolving process and based on the limitations set forth by the IHSAA this system is something that may not be perfect but it is the best we have come up with. As always my proverbial email door is always open for suggestions on this process. For all the comments on here not one person has ever emailed me concerning this process. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Short Jay Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Coach Skinner, Is it not ok to post concerns about this topic on this website for everyone to see? If sent in an email to you then you are the only person viewing the information. I feel that putting those concerns on this site allow for more to view the concerns and share thoughts and opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyoung Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 No one that's answered your questions has any hand in voting or had any hand in designing the event. As others have said, you came out guns blazing regarding issues that have been discussed at great length--not even realizing that New Pal is in fact in the voting to be included, and not realizing that the system is designed to find next year's best teams (not this year's). I did not come out gun's blazing. Re-read the posts. I am not the person who did that. I believe you are referring to the person who posted above me that everyone was upset with regarding New Pal's lack of an invitation. I just made some points about the selection process that I thought would easy the burden on the selection committee. In fact, I believe I have been 100% civil, and far from guns blazing. I will also add that I realize it's a difficult job to be in charge of the selection process, and I am certain it is hard work for very little reward (if any). I've been there where you do something that you work very hard on, and you hear nothing but naysayers as a final result. (Naysayers that don't have real answers.) I get that, and appreciate the work that is done. The point of my previous posts was that if mathematics was used, there'd be no arguments and it would make the work of the selection committee worlds easier. I am not a statistician, so I don't have a solution. I just had a suggestion. I sincerely apologize if my suggestion was offensive to the hard work that many put in. Chris Young Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infowrestling Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 I will also add that I realize it's a difficult job to be in charge of the selection process, and I am certain it is hard work for very little reward (if any). I've been there where you do something that you work very hard on, and you hear nothing but naysayers as a final result. (Naysayers that don't have real answers.) I get that, and appreciate the work that is done. I think that this is a great quote. I believe that the majority of people on this board truly care about wrestling. Individuals are suggesting or complaining about portions of the system, because we would like to see the selection and the tournament improve, but often times we forget to commend the efforts of those that are trying. Given the circumstances, the IHSWCA got off to a solid start in my opinion. The expansion to 12 teams is another solid step. The final step should be to eliminate the math involved and have an all in system......hopefully that is the direction the IHSWCA is headed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tskin Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 Coach Skinner, Is it not ok to post concerns about this topic on this website for everyone to see? If sent in an email to you then you are the only person viewing the information. I feel that putting those concerns on this site allow for more to view the concerns and share thoughts and opinions. hey Short Jay no that is fine but I might see every post or question since I am not a administration of this site so unless it is emailed to me directly I can't guarantee i will no about a certain issue and look into it. thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maligned Posted April 10, 2014 Share Posted April 10, 2014 I did not come out gun's blazing. Re-read the posts. I am not the person who did that. Chris Young I apologize for lumping you in wrongly. I didn't realize how things unfolded. As to the question as to why the scores alone don't determine the teams invited: it allows for most of the teams to qualify directly, but for some human intuition and some additional variables (injuries, incoming talent, JV talent, etc.) to be used in correctly picking the last couple teams. This past year, the 2A runner-up and third place team and the 1A champion were all voted in teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GAT36 Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 Who are the "at-large" schools to be voted in? How many? When is the vote? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 Who are the "at-large" schools to be voted in? How many? When is the vote? Two schools from each class will be voted in. The vote is this week, I believe with the announcement at the spring clinic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GAT36 Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 Who are the teams vying for a vote in each division? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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