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When is enough, ENOUGH?!


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Alright ladies and gents, we are all here because we love Indiana wrestling..  At what point are we going to quit tolerating the disgrace that is IU and Purdue wrestling?  They finish 10th and 11th in the Big 10's respectively, each finishing over 20+ points out of 9th, so it's not like they were anywhere near the middle of the pack.  They are perennial bottom feeders who occasionally will produce an All-American.  At some point, this has to become unacceptable to us as Indiana wrestling fans and both need to make a change.  I know we all love Coach Hinkel and his staff, and the IU guys are probably nice guys as well, but at some point enough is enough and I've reached my breaking point.  Between the 2 schools, they qualified 5 guys for NCAA's, only 3 of which went to HS in Indiana (Chalfant, Quiroga, and Atwood).  I can name that many Indiana-born NCAA qualifiers that didn't stay in-state in Petrov, Tsirtsis, and Howe, and 2 of those are slated to be seeded quite high.  IU has done nothing with Roach. That's been a disappointment.  Eppert, a guy who has won matches in back to back years at the NCAA's failed to qualify.  Nelsen, who qualified last year for Purdue, failed to make it back.  I can't stand to see another year of either one of these 2 as they sit currently.  ENOUGH IS ENOUGH! Who is with me?

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In addition,  what are either one doing for Indiana HS wrestling?!  I understand that Purdue runs their RTC, but the Lafayette area has produced next to no talent whatsoever over the past 10+ years.  With schools the size of Lafayette Jeff, etc, and being so close to Big 10 wrestling, that area should be thriving with the help of Purdue.  The Logansport regional is lucky to come up to the Merrillville Semi-State and come away with more than 5 or 6 state qualifiers.  The same goes for IU.  Bloomington South is respectable, but what about Bloomington North, or the other large schools in that metro area?  It's time for Purdue and IU to start pulling their weight for Indiana wrestling.  A change is needed.

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I'm with you.  As a Purdue grad and someone who has had cousins wrestle for both Purdue and Indiana it is a shame that they do not do better recruiting in state.  It is sad when I can just drive up to Evanston and see Indiana's last 2, soon to be 3, best high school wrestlers.

 

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So are you saying Atwood, Lynde, and Griffen are no talent?

 

Yes, 2 of those never won a state title in Indiana, but yet all 3 somehow found their way into Purdue's starting lineup this year.  When you're starting 3 Logansport Regional kids out of 10 weight classes in the B10, things aren't going to go too well for you.  No disrespect to any of the 3 mentioned, but Atwood is the only legitimate starter at this point, but yet Purdue keeps running all 3 of them out there every match

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Purdue is starting 8 Indiana HS kids, 5 of whom never won a state title here, and we're all shocked that they aren't having any success.  It starts with the recruits.. 

 

Why could Purdue not land Andrew Howe, when his older brother Eric wrestled at Purdue and was on the team at the time of Andrew's commitment?

 

Why could Purdue not land Alex Tsirtsis, when Chris Fleeger was training with Alex when he was still in high school?

 

Why could Purdue not land Stevan Micic, who spent time last summer in Purdue's room at the RTC?

 

 

What's it going to take for Purdue to start landing the top recruits again?  It's been 10+ years since they got a recruit like Chris Fleeger that panned out.  Cameron Doggett was one who people were excited about in the mid 2000's but he never materialized.  Since him, they've landed no big names straight out of HS (they did get an AA year out of transfer Loupochanski). 

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Griffen is a beast!  Anyone that has been in that room knowns that.  Every match lynde has lost is by a small margin.  Next year those small losses will be wins!  Purdue is a young team on the rise.

 

I'm sure Griffen is a beast in the Purdue wrestling room, and in the Logan Regional.  This doesn't necessarily translate to B10 success, obviously, as Griffen went 0-2 at B10's and finished in 10th place out of 12 this weekend.

 

Also, I've never heard of a young team that started 7 juniors and seniors out of 10 weight classes.

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Every match lynde has lost is by a small margin.  Next year those small losses will be wins!  Purdue is a young team on the rise.

 

I appreciate your optimism, but that doesn't change the fact that Lynde lost to a redshirt from Indiana this year named Mitch Sliga..

Why couldn't Purdue land Sliga and start him immediately?  Sliga spent a ton of time training with Pendoski, a former Purdue wrestler..  Why is Purdue not getting these guys?

 

Lynde may very well pan out, but he shouldn't be starting in the B10 at this point.  He went 6-15 this year and was majored 4 times, so not all of his losses we "by a small margin".

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Lynde beat D3 qualifier Jeff Holm from Olivet 3-2.

 

Riley LeFever of Wabash beat him twice, 6-1 and 7-1.

 

How do you let Wabash out-recruit you in-state?

 

Bobby Steveson (now signed with Minnesota) was in the Purdue RTC training last summer?  Why could you not land him?

 

Same goes for Fletcher Miller, who was training all summer in the Purdue room and signs with IU..

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Bobby Steveson (now signed with Minnesota) was in the Purdue RTC training last summer?  Why could you not land him?

 

 

Considering he goes to high school now in Minnesota, probably wasn't a real chance for him to choose coming back and going to Purdue. I think the obvious choice is to choose Minnesota.

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Considering he goes to high school now in Minnesota, probably wasn't a real chance for him to choose coming back and going to Purdue. I think the obvious choice is to choose Minnesota.

 

If you're the head coach of Purdue Scott Hinkel, and your brother Dave Hinkel is a teacher at Merrillville, you'd think you'd have a decent chance of landing a Merrillville wrestler and keeping him in the state he wrestled in since he was 5 years old..

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Obviously every kid is different want different things in life. Being an alum, I'd love for Purdue to be a title contender every year. Purdue or IU could have all the Indiana studs, but they also need to land some other out of state top tier guys every once in a while to bring them to the top as well. So not just Indiana boys want to go there. They'll need to pull a couple off like Northwestern just did, but the education could have also influenced those two to go. Penn State is becoming the new Iowa, but when I was growing up, every kid wanted to wrestle at Iowa.

 

Just as with top high schools, once you build it, they will come.

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Just as with top high schools, once you build it, they will come.

 

How much longer are we going to give them to "build it"?

 

This is Duane's 22nd season at IU.

 

This is Scott's 8th year as head coach at Purdue following 14 years as an assistant.

 

They've each had 22 years, how much longer do they need?

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Mud- Not all these guys are on full rides. Many not even close to getting much more then their books paid for likely. Lynde and Atwood included. So why recruit a guy like Lefever when you basically have to put zero into recruiting Atwood, Lynde, Griffen. All those guys were locks. When you can get guys who place top 3 in your own state and have to do nothing to get them thats a good thing. Now I believe Purdue really needs to get their coaching staff in order. Hinkle is on the end of his give him some time pass. Fleeger just getting his first major college roll. But look at the other guys on staff. Who are these guys? That's why Purdue will never get out of the basement.

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Fleeger just getting his first major college roll.

 

This is Fleeger's 8th year out of college.  He spent time as an assistant at Cornell under Rob Koll, as head coach of Darton College in Georgia, and then back at Purdue.  He is hardly a spring chicken..

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Purdue and Indiana are the perennial doormats of the Big 10 every year in wrestling (and football)......every now and then they have a decent basketball team but that's about it......Fabio is right......until they start winning, kids will look to go elsewhere.......but how do you start winning if most of the really good kids don't want to go there?.......coaching, coaching, coaching.......you think if Cael Sanderson became the head coach of either one they would become contenders?........i think so.......

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I'm talking about with an official title. Not Grad assistant. Yeah one year at Darton College. I know he's not a spring chicken. I'm saying he can ban out to be a good college coach. Mud you should call Morgan Burke and tell him you want to be head coach of Purdue wrestling.

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You have to also wonder how much does an assistant coach even make? Most might come help as they continue to pursue their international level, but I would imagine that wrestling assistants might not earn that much for the time and effort. We all love the sport of wrestling, but this is their job and would like to make a decent living as well. Maybe athletic departments are limiting budgets or something behind the scenes that we don't know about? Purdue & IU's budget, might not be that of Ohio State, Iowa, Minnesota's. Just a thought.

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I'm talking about with an official title. Not Grad assistant. Yeah one year at Darton College. I know he's not a spring chicken. I'm saying he can ban out to be a good college coach. Mud you should call Morgan Burke and tell him you want to be head coach of Purdue wrestling.

 

I think Fleeger already is a good college coach. 

 

Why does any criticism of either one of the in-state teams end with "well why don't you apply and do it better yourself?"  I'm certainly not qualified to be a Division 1 Big Ten Head Coach, but then again, I haven't had a combined 44 years of toiling in college wrestling anonymity either..

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I'm with you, but same goes for their football programs. Why and how do you let in state recruits go to other schools?  We have great talent in indiana! Let's start recruiting our top guys and stop worrying about kids from Florida, Texas, and New Jersey!

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Let's not forget, these are public positions.  Our tax dollars are paying Duane Goldman and Scott Hinkel's salaries and have been for a combined 44 years with little to no success.  As an Indiana wrestling fan and a supporter of both programs (donated money to both in the last 5 years), I think we deserve better.

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