Winning Ugly Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 I think we can all agree that wrestle backs are needed now more than ever. I feel this is a step in the right direction. Yes, it's not where it needs to be yet. If we have competitive wrestle back rounds ,instead of a lot of forfeits because a wrestler doesn't have the heart to carry on, we may get what we want in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 How would you get a senior, who just had his dreams of going to state dashed, ready for one or two meaningless matches for the off chance someone gets hurt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripleB Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 We have to take it and embrace it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 We have to take it and embrace it. I can hear the "Wrestleback...Wrestleback...Wrestlebacks" crowd chant during this entire round echoing in my head now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winning Ugly Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 I sure wish I could have two more matches added to the end of my senior year. It's probably why I am coach. With your way of thinking why would a senior walk out to wrestle the 7/8th match at state. Its pretty meaningless. Not to mention team score at regionals and semi state are now influenced. Are they going to change the team state points to reflect the 5th place finish? I am 100 percent behind full wrestle backs, but this is a start. That is how we should approach this or we will lose this like we lost Ihsaa team state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 In the 7th and 8th place match you are wrestling for a prettier medal. In the pseudo wrestle-backs you are wrestling for.... a couple team points? When you are 35 you would love to have a few more matches in high school, when you are 18 not so much in that situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbrick132 Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 We might as well wrestleback to see who finishes in completely last place also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XCard Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 I agree with winning ugly. It is not exactly what was wanted but it is progress. Y2 being the coach you are I am sure you will get that senior ready for those two matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winning Ugly Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 I think you lack vision in this instance. At the beginning of this year we didn't have wrestle backs, now we do. What will next year bring if the wrestle backs turn out to be the difference in team regional or even semi state championship. Then we have evidence that wrestle backs can influence the outcome of a team race and we can make a case to expand. Or we can choose not to send are wrestlers out on the mat and really prove to Ihsaa that we shouldn't ever have wrestle backs. My point is there can be value in these wrestle backs if we're not short sighted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aoberlin Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 I don't think it is a lack of vision. This is a total lack of understanding for wrestle backs. IMO it is a step back. You either do it all the way or don't do it all. This is setup in a way that is more likely to fail which will hurt us for full wrestle backs. Kindly say thanks but no thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 I agree with winning ugly. It is not exactly what was wanted but it is progress. Y2 being the coach you are I am sure you will get that senior ready for those two matches. Going to be hard to motivate someone that has just lost what they have been working for to wrestle for a couple team points. Plus on top of that I have to coach these matches when I could be eating the fine food in the hospitality room! My guess is there will be a lot of "injuries" and kids that barely go out there to wrestle these matches. I can't blame a kid for doing either as wrestling another match is the last thing I would want to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aoberlin Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Plus on top of that I have to coach these matches when I could be eating the fine food in the hospitality room! Are you talking about the FW Semi-state hospitality room that ran out of food last year and closed before heavy weight was over? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 I think you lack vision in this instance. At the beginning of this year we didn't have wrestle backs, now we do. What will next year bring if the wrestle backs turn out to be the difference in team regional or even semi state championship. Then we have evidence that wrestle backs can influence the outcome of a team race and we can make a case to expand. Or we can choose not to send are wrestlers out on the mat and really prove to Ihsaa that we shouldn't ever have wrestle backs. My point is there can be value in these wrestle backs if we're not short sighted. The only kids that will feel compelled to wrestle are the ones that have a team in the race. The others will have nothing to wrestle for. I couldn't imagine trying to wrestle again after knowing my career/season was done and I wasn't going to state. I can't honestly find a reason to get a kid excited to wrestle again for a few team points that might get us to the top 20 in semi-state. This is what the IHSAA will do. 1. They will implement these pseudo wrestle-backs 2. They will see coaches/kids/fans making a mockery of these pseudo wrestle-backs 3. They will then say this is why we can't have wrestle-backs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Are you talking about the FW Semi-state hospitality room that ran out of food last year and closed before heavy weight was over? Talking about the Carroll regional! If I miss out on Casa I will not be a happy camper! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XCard Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 No doubt it is gonna be hard to motivate them. It will only fail if coaches allow it to fail. Screw it, I don't know why the hell we even wrestle any wrestle backs at all. I mean most of theses kids are working for a state championship, so lets just make it a single elimination tournament. Only place that matters is first anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aoberlin Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 1. They will implement these pseudo wrestle-backs 2. They will see coaches/kids/fans making a mockery of these pseudo wrestle-backs 3. They will then say this is why we can't have wrestle-backs Agreed. That is exactly what will happen. Thanks but no thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aoberlin Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 No doubt it is gonna be hard to motivate them. It will only fail if coaches allow it to fail. Screw it, I don't know why the hell we even wrestle any wrestle backs at all. I mean most of theses kids are working for a state championship, so lets just make it a single elimination tournament. Only place that matters is first anyway. When you are a senior you aren't necessarily wrestling for the championship. You are wrestling for making it to State. Just making it there for some kids is everything they dreamed of. The walk of champions. Walking out onto to the floor. Getting a name tag you get to wear around. Don't start talking like them. You know what we are saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 No doubt it is gonna be hard to motivate them. It will only fail if coaches allow it to fail. Screw it, I don't know why the hell we even wrestle any wrestle backs at all. I mean most of theses kids are working for a state championship, so lets just make it a single elimination tournament. Only place that matters is first anyway. The IHSAA has stated they only care about the champion in the past. See http://www.indianamat.com/toe-to-joe-with-ihsaa-assistant-commishioner-bobby-cox/2010/02/ The IHSAA individual tournament series is about determining a state champion in 14 weight classes. We have already seen how the coaches do with the team series when their team is a heavy underdog, this won't be any different unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winning Ugly Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 The only kids that will feel compelled to wrestle are the ones that have a team in the race. The others will have nothing to wrestle for. I couldn't imagine trying to wrestle again after knowing my career/season was done and I wasn't going to state. I can't honestly find a reason to get a kid excited to wrestle again for a few team points that might get us to the top 20 in semi-state. This is what the IHSAA will do. 1. They will implement these pseudo wrestle-backs 2. They will see coaches/kids/fans making a mockery of these pseudo wrestle-backs 3. They will then say this is why we can't have wrestle-backs Obi Wan: Than the Emperor has already won. You were our only hope. As for Carroll Kids we will wrestle hard to the bitter end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winning Ugly Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Talking about the Carroll regional! If I miss out on Casa I will not be a happy camper! By the way Casa is out is year. We're thinking about peanut butter and jelly sandwiches! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aoberlin Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Obi Wan: Than the Emperor has already won. You were our only hope. As for Carroll Kids we will wrestle hard to the bitter end. I believe that. You have a great team this year and I will be rooting for you and East Noble. But honestly have you been that person out in the hallway talking to the senior that you have coached since he was a little kid after he lost that close ticket round match? If you have I am sure deep down you know what we are saying. I could be wrong and talking more out of emotion. But that is truly a heart breaker and IMO a time to talk about all the accomplishments and positives that have come from their high school career. But hey who knows maybe that is just coming from a guy that has been stuck with no wrestle backs at all for over 20 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 As for Carroll Kids we will wrestle hard to the bitter end. That is because they are SUPER Chargers. By the way Casa is out is year. We're thinking about peanut butter and jelly sandwiches! It might be time to find another sectional and regional for the Railroaders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Other than saying "hey just go out and have some fun in your last season/career matches," I'm not sure what else a coach can really do if the kids not found some random motivation of his own (unless your one of the few team who could win a team title). Then other than seeing a few fancy moves attempted, I don't see most matches living up to their potential when you compare them to two wrestlers still fighting for a legit advancement spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestling Scholar Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 The IHSAA has stated they only care about the champion in the past. See http://www.indianamat.com/toe-to-joe-with-ihsaa-assistant-commishioner-bobby-cox/2010/02/ Interesting article. The executive committee only cares about crowning the champion and there's no support for wrestlebacks. That's insane. So these other wrestlers that place or come close to placing is just a little side show, and its not really not that important. Where do we find the list of representatives on the so called "Executive Commitee". Are these wrestling guys or just a bunch of basketball lovers that want to keep wrestling down so it doesn't compete with their beloved basketball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Where do we find the list of representatives on the so called "Executive Commitee". http://www.ihsaa.org/AboutIHSAA/CurrentInfo/BoardofDirectorsExecutiveCommittee/tabid/109/Default.aspx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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