Coaches changing schools

[Jimtown 138]

This seemed like a thread that might provoke mind-expanding discussion and thoughfulness.  Instead, the opposite occurred and it turned into a class discussion.  AJ laughs, but it's becoming a enabled laughingstock with nothing at stake and nothing to gain other than the flexing of not only fingers on a keyboard, but other digits as well.

 

I guess I had better get that next grad course in if I want others to be involved in my mental gratification plan.

 

Crap, I'm too old to go back to school!

[KarlHungus]

He was an assistant, so maybe not a great example but:

 

Brandon Razo went from Homestead to Bluffton.  5A to 2A

 

and would likely go back to homestead in heartbeat if the head job became available

[Jimtown 138]

and would likely go back to homestead in heartbeat if the head job became available

 

So tell me Karl, would you jump ship in a heartbeat too?

[Midwest Wrestling Fanpage]

I heard a very respectable assistant and the father of a two time state champ might be landing a new Head coaching job somewhere,

[KarlHungus]

First off I am a suppoter of the team portion being classed.  Secondly I am not trying to debunk class wrestling.  I started this post as a look in to why coaches left their schools, and if most people agree that it is for wrestling success which I do not believe to be the case in all of the situations brought foward, so how that is me saying that "no one has ever left a small school for a big school for success" is beyond me. 

 

Secondly I am a class team supporter but to say that small schools cannot have success right now is not true.  Am I suppossed to look at Whitko and Garrett who won our sectional and somehow feel that my small school could never do the same?  Garrett beat us heads up this year and Whitko would have to, but im not just going to say that small schools canont have success at the sectional level.  Secondly how can we say that small schools cannot ever win when the state runner ups were a small school?

 

Your first post on the topic clearly informs the reader that your intent is to debunk class wrestling.

[KarlHungus]

So tell me Karl, would you jump ship in a heartbeat too?

 

I have no interest in being a head wrestling coach.  But if I did and wrestling was the only sport I coached, I would jump faster than a heartbeat.

[pin2win1]

Yep, messageboard posts are open to interpretation. But one would hope that people who are working in our state's educational system (either as coaches or teachers or both) would be able to make an informed and well thought out interpretation of people's comments on a message board. Then again, I guess this is why most the people who make so called "intepretations" don't have work in those big powerful schools that grab all the best people.

 

[Y2CJ41]

#1 He is already against class wrestling, so therefore the post is more than likely generated to debunk the "myth" that coaches move to bigger schools to increase their opportunity to produce a better team

 

#2 He states he only knows of one coach to do this, again trying to debunk the "myth"

 

#3 He states "I think coaching changes occur more often than not do to teaching oppurtunities than for coaching success."

 

#4 He states "What I do feel is that it doesn't happen very often."

 

#5 He states "I also found this interesting.  This is a link to the football coaching changes from 07-08.  I do not notice alot of the coaches going from small schools to big schools on this list."

 

#6 He states "I still think that just wanting to get back home could have been a possible reason that Harper went to Penn"

 

Add those up and I come to this conclusion:

I believe buscowrestling is trying to say that coaches don't move positions to improve financially and improve their chances for success.

 

[Blane Culp]

Football coaches now huh...Garrett received a fine football coach a few years ago that left a bigger school and even though he bounced around ended up at a smaller school.  Columbia City(2 sectional runner ups in a row) to Central Noble to Dekalb to Garrett.  WHy in the world would he go to Garrett? they are so small!  He has had more success there than he has had in the last 10 years at CC.  His Railroaders team would beat the Eagles easily. 

[pin2win1]

#1 He is already against class wrestling, so therefore the post is more than likely generated to debunk the "myth" that coaches move to bigger schools to increase their opportunity to produce a better team

I believe he said,

first off I am a suppoter of the team portion being classed.  Secondly I am not trying to debunk class wrestling.

#2 He states he only knows of one coach to do this, again trying to debunk the "myth"

which would then tell a logical person that he believes atleast 1 coach has moved for financial or team success as a reason, therefore one would believe that busco believes it does happen sometimes, even though it is rather limited.

#3 He states "I think coaching changes occur more often than not do to teaching oppurtunities than for coaching success."

note the words "more often" this does not mean always or only, it means in his mind most of the time.

#4 He states "What I do feel is that it doesn't happen very often."

note "doesn't happen very often".... once again showing that he does not believe it happens all the time.

#5 He states "I also found this interesting.  This is a link to the football coaching changes from 07-08.  I do not notice alot of the coaches going from small schools to big schools on this list."

note, the word "alot" and see my comment on notes 3 and 4

#6 He states "I still think that just wanting to get back home could have been a possible reason that Harper went to Penn"

Being someone who wrestled with Harper many years ago, I could see him wanting to move closer to home. Also, being someone who moved away for both college and Grad school, i can understand wanting to be closer to home. And you being someone who wanted to coach at Garrett and live in the same area as your home, well i would think you could see harper wanting to move closer to home. that being said, until someone gets word from harper as to why he took the Penn job, all we are doing is speculating.

 

In short, there are many key words in busco's statements which would lead a logical person to realize he was saying that moving closer to home or some other reason(s) besides pay or the team's success might be the biggest factor in coaches changing schools. Do I agree with him? no, i bet lots of coaches move for financial reasons or success reasons than any other reasons. But I bet there is a rather large number of coaches who move for reasons outside of finances or success.

 

BTW, why does my typing box jump around when I type a long post? It is annoying!!!!

[tspray1]

How is that the same?  Football has classes, he moved to a class where he only has to beat teams in that class to be successful.  If said coach did the same thing in wrestling  small or big he would still have to beat the 5a schools.

[pin2win1]

How is that the same?  Football has classes, he moved to a class where he only has to beat teams in that class to be successful.  If said coach did the same thing in wrestling  small or big he would still have to beat the 5a schools.

 

Doesn't matter, cause how could a tiny school like garrett pay for such a great coach? I would think he would go to the larger schools because they pay more right? I mean that is why these small schools can't compete, coaches want to go where they get paid, right?

[tspray1]

I think they go where they know they can win a state title.  Who coaches wrestling for money?

[pin2win1]

I think they go where they know they can win a state title.  Who coaches wrestling for money?

 

I do, problem is that no school i willing to pay me enough, so i don't coach  ok, so that is far from the truth.

 

 

[Y2CJ41]

And you being someone who wanted to coach at Garrett and live in the same area as your home, well i would think you could see harper wanting to move closer to home. that being said, until someone gets word from harper as to why he took the Penn job, all we are doing is speculating.

 

Of course as usual you have not a single clue, but yet want to bring my personal situation into it.  I was perfectly fine in Ohio and moved back home because I could not find a job in Ohio.  I was not planning on coming back to Indiana until a couple month job search yielded nothing and my funds were extremely low.  Even when I was back home I searched for jobs around Indiana and Ohio.  Coming back to coach at Garrett were never in my plans, it just happened to be what fell into place.  I coached at Northrop for one year due to needing money and then went to Garret due to a real job that was a heck of a lot closer to Garrett than Northrop.  I picked Garrett over other schools because of familiarity with the kids and coaching staff(I will translate, a few of the Garrett kids asked me to come coach).  If my job was in Fort Wayne I would have probably continued to coach at Northrop.

[Y2CJ41]

Football coaches now huh...Garrett received a fine football coach a few years ago that left a bigger school and even though he bounced around ended up at a smaller school.  Columbia City(2 sectional runner ups in a row) to Central Noble to Dekalb to Garrett.  WHy in the world would he go to Garrett? they are so small!  He has had more success there than he has had in the last 10 years at CC.  His Railroaders team would beat the Eagles easily. 

An opportunity to be a head coach again, the other stops were as an assistant coach.  Add to that the recent success of Garrett's football program

[pin2win1]

Of course as usual you have not a single clue, but yet want to bring my personal situation into it.  I was perfectly fine in Ohio and moved back home because I could not find a job in Ohio.  I was not planning on coming back to Indiana until a couple month job search yielded nothing and my funds were extremely low.  Even when I was back home I searched for jobs around Indiana and Ohio.  Coming back to coach at Garrett were never in my plans, it just happened to be what fell into place.  I coached at Northrop for one year due to needing money and then went to Garret due to a real job that was a heck of a lot closer to Garrett than Northrop.  I picked Garrett over other schools because of familiarity with the kids and coaching staff(I will translate, a few of the Garrett kids asked me to come coach).  If my job was in Fort Wayne I would have probably continued to coach at Northrop.v

 

Well i "interpreted" from another post in another thread that you wanted to come home, and sicne karl/danteague said that all posts are open to interpretation, i was well within my rights to make such an interpretation. However, now, I will change my interpretation of such post because you have clarified it through a further posting, which is something you shoudl learn how to do.

[Y2CJ41]

What postings hinted that I wanted to come back and coach at Garrett after college?  I am curious where I have even hinted that I wanted to do that.  I would love to see six points of reference where I stated anything close to that.

 

Or would you like to meet me face to face and say it to my face in a non-violent manner?

[pin2win1]

in one of your earlier posts on another thread you said how much you loved the garrett program and how you returned to garrett after school.... i am sorry, I just figured that your love for Garrett, and your returning after school meant you choose to return because you wanted to.

 

but yeah whenever you are in mishawaka or i am in Garrett... where the heck is garrett btw..... i'll feel free to say it to your face, although that would be tough to do now since i am conceeding that you didn't want to return to garett but only did so out of necessity. I guess i could say, i did infer that you wanted to come back to garrett from your posts, but have no changed because I am taking your clearer post as being what you meant. Would that work?

 

See the main difference between you and me y2, is that I am willing to listen and let people clarify what they meant by their words on a message board, that way i can understand where they are coming from. Therefore, when someone clears up something they said, I no longer focus on my orgional misconception (whether by my error or the other person's error). You on the other hand, read what a person says, make an inference, then when a person explains what they really meant in their post you ignore it, and then you go back to your inference despite the person showing you how your inference was wrong, (whether by your own error of the other persons). Under your way of doing things, you carry a chip on your shoulder and will almost always fail to recognize where others come from.

[Y2CJ41]

Of course you can't find that one magical post or even six statements of me saying that.  Thanks for playing you lose again.

[Y2CJ41]

And of course you want to argue minute semantics instead of the point.  Go back to discussing statistics that is a great avenue for you to earn smart points.  Tell me again if 35% of Americans are skiers what percent would you get if you did a random survey of half the Americans, I forgot.

[Jimtown 138]

Wow, all of this and not a "duckandrun" in sight?

 

Or is he really here...

[pin2win1]

Of course you can't find that one magical post or even six statements of me saying that.  Thanks for playing you lose again.

 

Well seeing as i realize that I have better things to do than search for one or two messages, i think i can handle losing. If the definition of a loser is one who doesn;t have enough time on their hands to go and serch for one or two messages on a wrestling message board that means nothing in the grand scheme of things, well i think i can handle it.

 

However, i would counter that your six points of reference were crap, well they may have been references so in that manner they weren't rap, but I prefer that they were references that once read with good reading comprehension skills that a person would lead you to such conclusions that you have come to. I responded to your six points of reference and showed how busco never even came close to saying that coaches never leave schools unless it is for some other reason outside of money or success. I also showed how your reading comprehnsion skills need some work so you can understand phrases and words like, "more often," "alot." and "doesn't happen very often."

 

And of course you want to argue minute semantics instead of the point.  Go back to discussing statistics that is a great avenue for you to earn smart points.  Tell me again if 35% of Americans are skiers what percent would you get if you did a random survey of half the Americans, I forgot.

 

Depends on which half I poll, in a true random sampling (one where i choose people out of a hat without any scientific method of choosing them at all) I probably could be all over the place. However, if i choose to poll the same percent of people from each state that corresponds to the percentage of american's that live in each state represents, and by the same percentage of men and women, and by age groups, and a number of other factors, in my survey as there are in america. I would think my survey could come pretty darn close to 35 percent, but then that isn't a "random" sample now is it, that would be a scientific sampling now wouldn;t it.

[KarlHungus]

Football coaches now huh...Garrett received a fine football coach a few years ago that left a bigger school and even though he bounced around ended up at a smaller school.  Columbia City(2 sectional runner ups in a row) to Central Noble to Dekalb to Garrett.  WHy in the world would he go to Garrett? they are so small!  He has had more success there than he has had in the last 10 years at CC.  His Railroaders team would beat the Eagles easily. 

 

He went to Garrett because they needed a coach in the middle of July and there were not many options open to the Garrett administration. Frickey took the Garrett job because he wanted to be a head coach again.  I worked with Coach Frickey in the years when there were opportunities to move.  All those opportunities were for bigger schools, not smaller.  The fact that garrett would beat cc tells you how bad cc is not that garrett has done anything that great.  Garrett is a few games over .500 under Frickey.

[pin2win1]

ok, so i am now a loser... postponed grilled hamburgers to look for that post i made my inference from.... Y2 tells us that he loves the garrett community, has a special thing with the community, and that he is in no hurry to leave.... and here i inferred that he wanted to go back to Garrett after college. My bad, but here is the post.

 

Yes there are examples of where coaches have stayed at smaller schools.  Without knowing why they are still there you can't tell much.  For instance in my case, I may be waiting patiently for the right job to open up before I jump ship.  I am not going to jump ship to just any program, I will gladly stay at Garrett for 20 years without a problem because I love the community(FYI I grew up there if you didn't know).  Garrett has a special thing with me there, the parents, other coaches and the kids will tell you that in a hearbeat.  I believe almost everyone in our Garrett wrestling family knows that I could move on to another school at any time, but so far have chosen to stay at Garrett.  I am in no rush to move on, but if the right position opens up I will definitely take a look at it.