decbell1 Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 Up 8-0 in 3rd throwing the match, What would you consider unethical to be teaching a High School Wrestler?? Can't decide which baffles me the most, the fact that you can't see how this is unethical, or the fact that someone with those views could ever be a part of the IHSWCA Board!! I can't think of something that is more unethical than what happened that isn't already specifically against the rules. What's next? Do you smudge your overall record by a match or two so that you can get the 6 seed instead of the 5 seed to get a better draw? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justdo^it135 Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 Pretty Sure i know which coach this is, and i would just like to give him a heck yeah. Do whatever it takes to win. I do not care what it is just do it. I wish i would have wrestled for a coach that was this passionate about winning, and advancing his kids. Is moving your stud wrestlers around in your lineup to match up with a team better considered cheating? No it is not. This is no different. He did not directly break any rules so he did nothing wrong, and in the end put his wrestler in a better position to win and achieve more. Sounds like fantastic coaching to me. Good Job bringing it to the next level Coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decbell1 Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 PS. Tomorrow night I will be at the North Montgomery Team Regional. You can bet i will know exactly who wins the match between Franklin and Bloomington South first round via text message and have itemized match scores. These are the times we live in. It isn't compromising tournament ethics, it is having a higher threshold for obtaining information. Sorry, boys, I can't buy the unethical slant. Other than the fact that you injury defaulted when you weren't injured? What about the fact that you LIED? Do you not have any self respect or do you just do whatever is best for you without regard for right or wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 Pretty Sure i know which coach this is, and i would just like to give him a heck yeah. Do whatever it takes to win. I do not care what it is just do it. I wish i would have wrestled for a coach that was this passionate about winning, and advancing his kids. Is moving your stud wrestlers around in your lineup to match up with a team better considered cheating? No it is not. This is no different. He did not directly break any rules so he did nothing wrong, and in the end put his wrestler in a better position to win and achieve more. Sounds like fantastic coaching to me. Good Job bringing it to the next level Coach. There are these things called ethics that are unwritten rules that people should follow in life. This falls in that category. If you honestly are that worried about your first round match at regional. I highly doubt you have much of a chance of making it to state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decbell1 Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 Pretty Sure i know which coach this is, and i would just like to give him a heck yeah. Do whatever it takes to win. I do not care what it is just do it. I wish i would have wrestled for a coach that was this passionate about winning, and advancing his kids. Is moving your stud wrestlers around in your lineup to match up with a team better considered cheating? No it is not. This is no different. He did not directly break any rules so he did nothing wrong, and in the end put his wrestler in a better position to win and achieve more. Sounds like fantastic coaching to me. Good Job bringing it to the next level Coach. lol, how in the world is it the same situation? Moving a lineup is a coach's job. I'm not sure it says anywhere in a coach's job description to blatantly and openly lie. By the way, does anyone know if the other wrestler involved in this had a legitimate reason to FF to take 4th? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Cooper Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 Why is it hard to believe that there is another view point here? You can continue to be baffled, because I don't find fault with the decision. I'm sure many other coaches would have done the same thing. Do you think the inj def for 4th was unethical? Do you think the lack of proper seeding was unethical? The coach did what he (and the wrestler) believed gave them the best opportunity to advance in the tournament. I wouldn't say i'm an unethical person.... unless you think that hgh injections for a 2 year old to give him an advantage in sports is unethical... in that case, no comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justdo^it135 Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 I don't understand how you can say those two things aren't related. I just think if we are going to play completely fair and ethical we shouldn't move and bump guys around. Have everyone wrestle their normal weights and let the cards fall where they will. Moving your guys is lying. You are saying that they weigh something different than they actually do. Thats lying. It is just commonly accepted as good coaching because it has been done so much. i say you need to choose sides, either be willing to do whatever you have to do to give your wrestlers the advantage or be Completely ethical. Also: Unwritten rules are not rules. That simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Cooper Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 My response was to NCWrestlefan I should have quoted it. I got too busy watching LOST.... .which gets increasingly more confusing each second btw... and didn't get the post written in a timely manner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 I don't understand how you can say those two things aren't related. I just think if we are going to play completely fair and ethical we shouldn't move and bump guys around. Have everyone wrestle their normal weights and let the cards fall where they will. Moving your guys is lying. You are saying that they weigh something different than they actually do. Thats lying. It is just commonly accepted as good coaching because it has been done so much. i say you need to choose sides, either be willing to do whatever you have to do to give your wrestlers the advantage or be Completely ethical. Also: Unwritten rules are not rules. That simple. Bumping around to get a dual meet win vs. taking a dive to presumably get a better draw Two very different things. One is strategy, the other is something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1oldwrestler Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 Pretty Sure i know which coach this is, and i would just like to give him a heck yeah. Do whatever it takes to win. I do not care what it is just do it. I wish i would have wrestled for a coach that was this passionate about winning, and advancing his kids. Is moving your stud wrestlers around in your lineup to match up with a team better considered cheating? No it is not. This is no different. He did not directly break any rules so he did nothing wrong, and in the end put his wrestler in a better position to win and achieve more. Sounds like fantastic coaching to me. Good Job bringing it to the next level Coach. Holy crap, I can't believe what I'm reading. You go ahead and give him a "heck yeah." Me, I'll give him a "what in the heck are you teaching your wrestlers!?" This is blatantly unethical and against everything wrestling, and all sports, for that matter, stands for which is go out, compete your hardest and let the chips fall where they may. "Good Job bringing it to the next level Coach." What a load of debris. Everyone involved in this situation (not including the kids) should be ashamed of themselves. There is absolutely no defense for this. It's black and white but our society frowns on black and white. Everything is gray which is incredibly sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 My response was to NCWrestlefan I should have quoted it. I got too busy watching LOST.... .which gets increasingly more confusing each second btw... and didn't get the post written in a timely manner. Chris I got it all figured out for you. One thats a screwed up bracket situations that could have been avioded by not releasing the brackets but as you illuded to coaches will still try to stratagies based on what they think may happen. Secondly its two time stings running parallel to each other at the same time that will eventually merge into one and completely warp their minds. Either that or the writters just threw darts at a board to finish the season and this is what they came up with. Third, stop giving your kid HGH so my son will have a chance to at least score on him someday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decbell1 Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 How is bumping up a wrestler unethical? That makes no sense. If you weigh 134.9, why couldn't you wrestle 140? That really has nothing to do with this situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 Do you think the inj def for 4th was unethical? If it wasn't a true injury default then yes. As far as I can tell the individual has been out for part of the season, so he may still have been injured. Do you think the lack of proper seeding was unethical? The seeding was correct in this weight class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Cooper Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 Martin- I think the darts started getting thrown after about season 3 or 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndianaWrestlingGuy1 Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 If a team loses tomorrow night, they are out of the tournament, there is a big difference. If I wanted to know who is in the finals at the Evansville, Merrillville, and New Haven Semi-State next weekend while having a kid going for 3rd or 4th in New Castle, I could obtain that to massage my draw. A very large reach, but I hope you see my point. Another example that pertains to the same Regional in contention: If I am a 125 lb coach going into the Perry Regional with the seeding atrocity from Shelbyville, you can bet if the opportunity was right my wrestler would be forfeiting a his semi final for a 3rd place sectional finish instead of drawing into a Kieffer/Wright for a regional advancement round. No offense to the Shelbyville 125lber. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signal34 Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 When your late to the tournament and your speeding, what are you teaching your kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Cooper Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 How about this- Team state, final match. After the 13th match, your team is up by 7 team score. Is it unethical to ff the last match and take the state title? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frigginhurts Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 I'm totally with DecBel on this one....i honestly can't believe what i am reading in regards to some people agreeing with this decision. question for the sane people on here...if you are that coaches a.d., what do you do with him? suspend him or slap him on the wrist? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1oldwrestler Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 When your late to the tournament and your speeding, what are you teaching your kids. Wow, I really see your point (sarcasm). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive2246 Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 How about this- Team state, final match. After the 13th match, your team is up by 7 team score. Is it unethical to ff the last match and take the state title? It's not an Inj. Default, it's a FF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1oldwrestler Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 How about this- Team state, final match. After the 13th match, your team is up by 7 team score. Is it unethical to ff the last match and take the state title? Huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frigginhurts Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 Chris Cooper - are you actually being serious or trying to get a rise out of people? you aren't even comparing apples to apples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2CJ41 Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 If I wanted to know who is in the finals at the Evansville, Merrillville, and New Haven Semi-State next weekend while having a kid going for 3rd or 4th in New Castle, I could obtain that to massage my draw. A very large reach, but I hope you see my point. You won't know your draw until Sunday for state, so you honestly have no clue who you will be wrestling. That is not the same thing. This coach knew EXACTLY who his kid would get win or lose and chose to default during the middle of the match to get what he thought was a better draw. Another example that pertains to the same Regional in contention: If I am a 125 lb coach going into the Perry Regional with the seeding atrocity from Shelbyville, you can bet if the opportunity was right my wrestler would be forfeiting a his semi final for a 3rd place sectional finish instead of drawing into a Kieffer/Wright for a regional advancement round. No offense to the Shelbyville 125lber. I guess to me its the cowards way out instead of deciding it on the mat. If you don't strive to do your best and take dives to get things you want then to me you are coward. One of my wrestlers last week, knew if he won in the finals, his day this week would be tougher. He didn't take a dive because he knows he is capable of beating the same kid next week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justdo^it135 Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 Whether you think its unethical or not nothing illegal was done so i'd be surprised if he was suspended. A stern talking to at the most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rebels8 Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 i think as long as the parents of the wrestler arent upset with the decision to improve their sons chances of advancing and achieving a very hard goal of making it to conseco, then all is good and a great coaching move to try to improve that kids dream of wrestling at conseco. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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