Biggest disappointment

[headlock83]

The Center Grove kid who ran was Schoettle, against Lovejoy on Friday night.  It was ridiculous!  The ref should have had the guts to award the points that he had signaled for the stalling, although, the Luers coaches should have contested it better at the end, too.   The CG coaches share the blame for that, and for how they acted afterwards.  No class!  If I remember correctly, thos same coaches screwed up the seeding at the Al Smith, by their behavior in the seeding meeting.

I have never seen a wrestler run from his opponent like that.  I think a possible DQ is in order for a stunt like that.  It was embarrassing for our sport.

[wrestler9]

The Center Grove kid who ran was Schoettle, against Lovejoy on Friday night.  It was ridiculous!  The ref should have had the guts to award the points that he had signaled for the stalling, although, the Luers coaches should have contested it better at the end, too.   The CG coaches share the blame for that, and for how they acted afterwards.  No class!  If I remember correctly, thos same coaches screwed up the seeding at the Al Smith, by their behavior in the seeding meeting.

No class, that is crap, the reason that the center grove coaches got mad is because one of Lovejoy's coach called Schoettle a pu$$y to his face, now that is no class! disrespecting a wrestler because he beat your kid

[Y2CJ41]

My biggest disappointment was watching the ref call three stalling warnings, but only award one point total as the Center Grove wrestler turned his back on his opponent, sprinted around the outside of the mat, and even used the ref for a pick when he was nearly caught.  Then celebrating his one point win.

That was followed by watching an upset wrestler and his coach verbally accosted by one of the Center Grove coaches.

I was terribly disappointed that this is how Center Grove wants to represent themselves.

That is nothing new for Center Grove, ask anyone at the Al Smith seeding meeting.

[BlackshirtD]

yeah I was referring to Schottle/Lovejoy match..that was just horrible. Another disappointment Y2 kept passing by the Hobart Section and I didn't get a chance to say hi..so hey..hi man!!

[aoberlin]

I was standing right next to the a Center Grove coach that was on the side and he was yelling no and what are you doing when his kid was running.  I really just think the moment got bigger than the kid and he wasn't thinking right.  It also probably didn't help that Lovejoy is dangerous and he knew it.  I look forward to watching Lovejoy for the next 3 years he is exciting to watch and so was his brother.  Again remember they are just kids and I am sure he want be doing that again.

[redhotrider]

220 weight class champion being decided by stalling calls, I would rather see them go to o.t.

[Caleb Spires]

I was wondering if anyone would point out the Schoettle match. His running for the last 10 seconds in a close match bothered me..

[kevinl]

No class, that is crap, the reason that the center grove coaches got mad is because one of Lovejoy's coach called Schoettle a pu$$y to his face, now that is no class! disrespecting a wrestler because he beat your kid

Nope, they were talking to each other not to the other coaches and certainly not to the other wrestler.  This was confirmed by several people who were on the floor at the time.

When a coach is talking directly to his wrestler it is no business to the other coach, especially after a stunt like that, what he says.  It certainly does not warrant getting in the face of the other coach and telling him to shut the F_CK up or else and requiring to be pulled out by a coach from another school.

If it bothers him that the two were talking to each other and may have called his wrestler a name then maybe they should teach him to face his opponent, stall his butt off if he is not good enough to win on his own, and hold on to win.  But if he turns tail and runs away like a little school girl he should expect the two to talk about how cowardly that was, take whatever pride he has left, and walk up, and pick up his medal on the podium and enjoy that manner in which he "earned" it.

As I said there were other coaches that over heard this and told me that the Luers coach and wrestler were NOT out of line but the CG coach was.

Wrestler9 it is obvious that this behavior is not unexpected by the CG coaches based on the response of many on the forum.

It is a shame that you do not seem to know any better but want to defend a man who has been kicked off another team for similar behavior.  I guess it is OK with the CG school board, the athletic department, the wrestling families, and their fans to bring a person like that into their school to be a role model for their students.

Our little school may not have ever had a State Champ, but they lose with class, wrestle with pride, and give it their all for six solid minutes.

That is OK Sam is already talking aboutmaking another RUN for State next year, CG better bring their track shoes again. 

[kevinl]

I was standing right next to the a Center Grove coach that was on the side and he was yelling no and what are you doing when his kid was running.  I really just think the moment got bigger than the kid and he wasn't thinking right.  It also probably didn't help that Lovejoy is dangerous and he knew it.  I look forward to watching Lovejoy for the next 3 years he is exciting to watch and so was his brother.  Again remember they are just kids and I am sure he want be doing that again.

Thanks coach.  The fact that he ran was disappointing but was a complement in a way to Sam.

Sam has not wrestled off season since sixth grade (one HYWA tournament in 7th going in cold.)  

That little act has helped him decide to work very hard this off season.  He knows that that match was lost because of two bad shots on his part.  God knows that Scheottle's only moves were defensive (other than the one head lock he tried to throw early) including that sprint around the mat.  

But when the ref warned Schoettle for stalling three times and only awarded a single point, then the coach got in the face of one of our coaches and threatened him that was over the line.

[Cale Hoover]

I attempt to not respond to comments made on this board for many reasons.  However, I am not going to in this case due to the false accusations being made.  First, my assistant coach responded after our student-athlete and wrestler were spoken to directly by the assistant coach of the opposing school.  I did step between them and the situation was quickly diffused.  I understand their disappointment and we were certainly not pleased with the way the match ended.  My coaching staff initiated none of the events that transpired as we all exited the competition area.  I can also say that none of my coaches used any profanity during the situation as I was standing between all involved.  Sometimes things happen or are said during competition that are unfortunate, but I wish everyone would remember we are all working with 14-18 year old kids.  They are not always going to do things as we would like.  Unfortunately the adults involved in our sport do not as well.

It has become common for the moderators of this site to criticize the Center Grove program because of disagreements they have had with me in the past.  They are more than welcome to continue doing so as they are entitled to their opinions.  I am very comfortable with the mission and vision of our program and what everyone is trying to do.  I think the people who know me have an understanding of what I stand for and how I want the Center Grove program to be run.  I will be the first to admit that we are not perfect, but we are all working to do things the right way and in the best interests of our kids.

Congratulations to all involved with this past weekend and please come to Center Grove next Saturday and take in the last IHSAA Team State Dual Championship.

[kevinl]

I attempt to not respond to comments made on this board for many reasons.  However, I am not going to in this case due to the false accusations being made.  First, my assistant coach responded after our student-athlete and wrestler were spoken to directly by the assistant coach of the opposing school.  I did step between them and the situation was quickly diffused.  I understand their disappointment and we were certainly not pleased with the way the match ended.  My coaching staff initiated none of the events that transpired as we all exited the competition area.  I can also say that none of my coaches used any profanity during the situation as I was standing between all involved.  Sometimes things happen or are said during competition that are unfortunate, but I wish everyone would remember we are all working with 14-18 year old kids.  They are not always going to do things as we would like.  Unfortunately the adults involved in our sport do not as well.

It has become common for the moderators of this site to criticize the Center Grove program because of disagreements they have had with me in the past.  They are more than welcome to continue doing so as they are entitled to their opinions.  I am very comfortable with the mission and vision of our program and what everyone is trying to do.  I think the people who know me have an understanding of what I stand for and how I want the Center Grove program to be run.  I will be the first to admit that we are not perfect, but we are all working to do things the right way and in the best interests of our kids.

Congratulations to all involved with this past weekend and please come to Center Grove next Saturday and take in the last IHSAA Team State Dual Championship.

That is a shame that you want to look at this as a complaint of your wrestler, it was a shameful act but he is a young man and needs to understand that.  We were disappointed by his actions and that was all as stated in the original post.

However your words hold no validity with me, nor it appears with many others that have had the occasion to deal with CG.  There were enough other people on the floor that over heard this and they corroborated the story that I presented or I would not have brought it up.

Perhaps as an adult you should realize that where there is smoke there is often fire.  If your program is criticized so much maybe there is a problem that should be addressed.  If there is a problem it should be addressed by the head coach, unless that is where the problem starts.  If that is the case then the school board should handle it.

Coach, I have been around wrestling for a lot of years and have never had a reason to question CG or you, but your coach was clearly out of line and if your program has any respect for the sport he needs to be handled.  From what I have been told this is not his first incident and you decided to bring him on knowing that.  To get into the face of another coach and to threaten him is no way to run a class program, but if it is the way you want to run yours then I understand why everyone on this board has come out and made the comments about your staff that they have.

[NateSteffen]

The biggest disappointment for me besides having to watch the entire state series from my computer is being on this website and listening to a TON of people b!tching and moaning instead of saying how proud they are of whatever program they are associated with.      

[Cale Hoover]

I am most disturbed about the things you have said regarding one of my student-athletes.  Feel free to come after me, but your criticisms have no validity to me because of the way you are handling yourself and what you are typing on this board.  I care very much what many people have to say about my program.  I am not sure that you have an opinion that I should value at this point.

It does not take much courage to go on a message board and criticize a young person while refusing to sign your name to a post.   The young man in question has done nothing to deserve the criticism, hate, and, anger you are directing at him.  I would appreciate you leaving him out of any discussion.  He is a very good young man who has worked very hard and earned his success just as all the other young men this weekend.

I was there on Friday night and know what happened.  You obviously were not.  I am not sure why you think my coaches would be upset and say something after a match was won.  We were speaking with our wrestler when the opposing coach felt compelled to speak directly to my student-athete.  You better believe we will stick up for our guys especially after what was said.

 In regards to criticism by Joe Caprino, moderator of this board, he was not at the Al Smith seeding meeting but feels compelled to make comments on the board but will not address it with me personally.   He sees me on numerous occasions around the state, has my email address, and has my phone number.  Feel free to contact me any time.  It shows a great deal more character to have a face to face discussion than it does to say things about people on a message board.

Cale Hoover
Head Coach
Center Grove High School  

[kevinl]

I am most disturbed about the things you have said regarding one of my student-athletes.  Feel free to come after me, but your criticisms have no validity to me because of the way you are handling yourself and what you are typing on this board.  I care very much what many people have to say about my program.  I am not sure that you have an opinion that I should value at this point.

It does not take much courage to go on a message board and criticize a young person while refusing to sign your name to a post.   The young man in question has done nothing to deserve the criticism, hate, and, anger you are directing at him.  I would appreciate you leaving him out of any discussion.  He is a very good young man who has worked very hard and earned his success just as all the other young men this weekend.

I was there on Friday night and know what happened.  You obviously were not.  I am not sure why you think my coaches would be upset and say something after a match was won.  We were speaking with our wrestler when the opposing coach felt compelled to speak directly to my student-athete.  You better believe we will stick up for our guys especially after what was said.

 In regards to criticism by Joe Caprino, moderator of this board, he was not at the Al Smith seeding meeting but feels compelled to make comments on the board but will not address it with me personally.   He sees me on numerous occasions around the state, has my email address, and has my phone number.  Feel free to contact me any time.  It shows a great deal more character to have a face to face discussion than it does to say things about people on a message board.

Cale Hoover
Head Coach
Center Grove High School  

Coach since I assume that you have at least a high school education please reread what I have written and not what you seem to be wanting to make this.

Here let me help:

My biggest disappointment was watching the ref call three stalling warnings, but only award one point total as the Center Grove wrestler turned his back on his opponent, sprinted around the outside of the mat, and even used the ref for a pick when he was nearly caught.  Then celebrating his one point win.

That was followed by watching an upset wrestler and his coach verbally accosted by one of the Center Grove coaches.

I was terribly disappointed that this is how Center Grove wants to represent themselves.

Nope, they were talking to each other not to the other coaches and certainly not to the other wrestler.  This was confirmed by several people who were on the floor at the time.

When a coach is talking directly to his wrestler it is no business to the other coach, especially after a stunt like that, what he says.  It certainly does not warrant getting in the face of the other coach and telling him to shut the F_CK up or else and requiring to be pulled out by a coach from another school.

If it bothers him that the two were talking to each other and may have called his wrestler a name then maybe they should teach him to face his opponent, stall his butt off if he is not good enough to win on his own, and hold on to win.  But if he turns tail and runs away like a little school girl he should expect the two to talk about how cowardly that was, take whatever pride he has left, and walk up, and pick up his medal on the podium and enjoy that manner in which he "earned" it.

As I said there were other coaches that over heard this and told me that the Luers coach and wrestler were NOT out of line but the CG coach was.

Wrestler9 it is obvious that this behavior is not unexpected by the CG coaches based on the response of many on the forum.

It is a shame that you do not seem to know any better but want to defend a man who has been kicked off another team for similar behavior.  I guess it is OK with the CG school board, the athletic department, the wrestling families, and their fans to bring a person like that into their school to be a role model for their students.

Our little school may not have ever had a State Champ, but they lose with class, wrestle with pride, and give it their all for six solid minutes.

That is OK Sam is already talking aboutmaking another RUN for State next year, CG better bring their track shoes again. 

Thanks coach.  The fact that he ran was disappointing but was a complement in a way to Sam.

Sam has not wrestled off season since sixth grade (one HYWA tournament in 7th going in cold.) 

That little act has helped him decide to work very hard this off season.  He knows that that match was lost because of two bad shots on his part.  God knows that Scheottle's only moves were defensive (other than the one head lock he tried to throw early) including that sprint around the mat. 

But when the ref warned Schoettle for stalling three times and only awarded a single point, then the coach got in the face of one of our coaches and threatened him that was over the line.

[/quote]

That is a shame that you want to look at this as a complaint of your wrestler, it was a shameful act but he is a young man and needs to understand that. We were disappointed by his actions and that was all as stated in the original post.

However your words hold no validity with me, nor it appears with many others that have had the occasion to deal with CG.  There were enough other people on the floor that over heard this and they corroborated the story that I presented or I would not have brought it up.

Perhaps as an adult you should realize that where there is smoke there is often fire.  If your program is criticized so much maybe there is a problem that should be addressed.  If there is a problem it should be addressed by the head coach, unless that is where the problem starts.  If that is the case then the school board should handle it.

Coach, I have been around wrestling for a lot of years and have never had a reason to question CG or you, but your coach was clearly out of line and if your program has any respect for the sport he needs to be handled.  From what I have been told this is not his first incident and you decided to bring him on knowing that.  To get into the face of another coach and to threaten him is no way to run a class program, but if it is the way you want to run yours then I understand why everyone on this board has come out and made the comments about your staff that they have.

See I have made it easy on you.  If it is in RED it was about your "student/athlete."  Very little of it was directed to the youngman.  The rest of it is about your staff.

Give it a break Coach, it was more than Joe that criticized you and your program on this thread.  Again try a little reading comprehension, if you ask nicely I will go back and pull all those comments into a single post to make it easier for you too.  I can color code them for you too if you need it. 

Despite your words you clearly do not care what others think of your program.  Honestly man look at the number of posts where people state that they expect this behavior out of your program.  You have to be living under a rock not to see it.

The Luers coach was talking directly to his wrestler when YOUR assistant got in his face and according to several others on the floor not associated with either program used profanity and many felt he was threatening the Luers Coach.

My apologies to those on the forum that are reading this.  Anyone that was there saw something that was clearly disturbing on the mat Friday night, then the coaching staff for CG (or more correctly one member of the CG coaching staff) made it worse.  No wrestler should go through having another coach get into their faces and threaten them no matter what they say to each other.

No matter what Coach Hoover responds this will be the last post from me directed to him.

[Cale Hoover]

I may not be much, but I am honest. 

I am proud of every member of our team and coaching staff at Center Grove.  We have had a fun, enjoyable year.  Congratulations to our state qualifiers Brock Warner and Drew Ponder.  Congratulations to state medal winner Anthony Shoettle.  A big congratulations to Sean Mappes the 17o pound state champion.

Not a single person in our program is perfect, but we do stick together, support one another, and work to do our best everyday.  I am honored to be your coach.

[munges]

Could someone who knows the rules better than me explain why a point could not have beeen awarded for fleeing? Sure he did not flee the mat but he was fleeing the other wrestler and is that not what you are doing when you flee the mat? This is a serious question and am qurious of how this rule could apply.

[bluemonster]

KevinL,

        As unfortunate as it may be for your son how things worked out, I strongly disagree with the way you are attacking a 15year old young man. I can feel your frustration, but man.....let it go.  

[WAC8]

All of that bs ^^ is pathetic. Upset of the day goes to Molloy taking 5th.  In my opinion the best wrestler in that weight class, but payed the price for not coming to wrestle.  Congrats to Blanton for taking it to him

[Y2CJ41]

I am most disturbed about the things you have said regarding one of my student-athletes.  Feel free to come after me, but your criticisms have no validity to me because of the way you are handling yourself and what you are typing on this board.  I care very much what many people have to say about my program.  I am not sure that you have an opinion that I should value at this point.

It does not take much courage to go on a message board and criticize a young person while refusing to sign your name to a post.   The young man in question has done nothing to deserve the criticism, hate, and, anger you are directing at him.  I would appreciate you leaving him out of any discussion.  He is a very good young man who has worked very hard and earned his success just as all the other young men this weekend.

I was there on Friday night and know what happened.  You obviously were not.  I am not sure why you think my coaches would be upset and say something after a match was won.  We were speaking with our wrestler when the opposing coach felt compelled to speak directly to my student-athete.  You better believe we will stick up for our guys especially after what was said.

 In regards to criticism by Joe Caprino, moderator of this board, he was not at the Al Smith seeding meeting but feels compelled to make comments on the board but will not address it with me personally.   He sees me on numerous occasions around the state, has my email address, and has my phone number.  Feel free to contact me any time.  It shows a great deal more character to have a face to face discussion than it does to say things about people on a message board.

Cale Hoover
Head Coach
Center Grove High School  

You were not at the Al Smith seeding meeting either....how come you can comment on it, but I cannot.  Cale, I used to respect what you and your program was about, but after this year I have changed my tune.  I used to defend you as I have known you for many years, but it seems this year some of your true colors have been shown.  You want to blame ME for your coaches acting like idiots instead of manning up and addressing the issue.  It is sad that this is NOT the first issue with your assistants this year and yet you want to defend their actions until the end.  Wasn't it YOU who apologized to everyone in the Al Smith for their actions...yet it is MY fault that they act the way they did?

Amazing, simply amazing.  

[AJ]

All of that bs ^^ is pathetic. Upset of the day goes to Molloy taking 5th.  In my opinion the best wrestler in that weight class, but payed the price for not coming to wrestle.  Congrats to Blanton for taking it to him

It looked like Molloy did come to wrestle... He got out to a 6-2 lead I think and then it seemed like he just gassed.  Congrats to Blanton for once again pulling off a huge win...

[bluemonster]

Ok, i'm sorry, 17. I don't know either young man involved very well.

[tyandky]

I remember seeing a national champion in college doing the same thing as schoettle right before we seen the flip

[KarlHungus]

And Mr. Lovejoy is clearly more frustrated with the officiating and post match actions than the high school kid in question.

[MattM]

I remember seeing a national champion in college doing the same thing as schoettle right before we seen the flip

Partial flip.   

[Y2CJ41]

Cale,
Also since you are defending your coach's actions, remember two wrongs do not make a right. Someone that is "supposed" to be a leader in this sport and former IHSWCA president should be held to a higher standard.  If the Luers coach did say or do something out of line it does not make it right for your coaches to act that way.  I would expect you to know this and make sure the coaches on your staff know that they will be under the microscope more than other coaches due to your stature in the wrestling community.