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Jenny

Weight cut

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Why do some coaches allow their kids to cut so much weight.  I’ve had my kid on a few travel teams here and watched same kids cut so much weight.  I witness coaches helping kids on scales and kids in basically tears.   When will be a coach to say enough is enough.  I believe some parents are to blame but so is the coach for allowing it.  There is a rule in high school in which the coaches allow the kids to cheat to get around it.   Shameful 

Edited by Jenny

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Speaking from the athlete standpoint, you want to remain competitive and give yourself the best opportunity to win. Use David Taylor as an example, he was able to go up a weight and just won a world title...not many people are like that. And to be completely honest, it’s part of the sport no matter where you go...it’s unhealthy and not good for growing kids, but it will happen wherever you go.

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Weight cut is ok and I understand it’s a part of the sport but a few kids take it to an extreme.   That’s when somebody needs to step in. 

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if you don't like to see kids cutting weight then they need to lift weights.. most kids cutting do it cause at there more natural weight they are not strong enough to compete

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Most kids cut because parents tell their kids they are not good enough.  Cutting from 141 to 132 is a cut.  Some kids cut down to 126 and are miserable all year.   Kids cut way to much. I heard of kids going to hospital because of awful weight cuts. 

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Said my peace I think we all know some kids cut way to much and parents and coaches sit back and don’t say anything.  Some of us encourage it.  

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33 minutes ago, Jenny said:

Most kids cut because parents tell their kids they are not good enough.  Cutting from 141 to 132 is a cut.  Some kids cut down to 126 and are miserable all year.   Kids cut way to much. I heard of kids going to hospital because of awful weight cuts. 

Most kids cut because they think they could perform better at a lower weight class, period. Not because of some pressure from parents or coaches. I've been around wrestling for 25+ years and this has always been the case.

Edited by greco165

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Everyone is inevitably going to make some type of weight cut in this sport, however I do agree with you Jenny that the extreme cut from kids should be stopped. Most of those guys that are cutting that much weight are probably still a top tier kid in either weight class.  So why go thru the misery, and it is misery, of cutting all that weight.  I can tell you from my personal experience, experience with other athletes, and with my own son, that my preference is going to be wrestle up the weight class.  Feel good at practice all 5 days.  Optimize that training time and let the weight come off progressively. Of course as mentioned here too, hit that weight room, because there is nothing that replaces strength at any level.  I also disagree that there is no pressure from coaches and parents for most kids to make the cut and the decision is solely theirs.  Maybe they are not aggressively telling them to make the cut, but not advising them otherwise when we know their decision make that cut, is a poor one, is just as bad.  As Coaches it is just as much our responsibility to correct these bad decisions as it is to correct their wrestling technique.

 

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I think it is getting a lot better.  If there are only a few doing it, that is better than it was back in the dark ages.  I would agree that coaches should be held accountable if it is extreme, but not sure a new parent understands that 3-5 lbs is not horrible so you may have to trust your coach.  Hopefully you have a good coach. 

In a perfect world, kids would not make themselves miserable and coach's wouldn't ask them to / tell them not to.  I wouldn't have a problem with a parent saying they are concerned even if it wasn't their kid they were concerned about.  Cutting weight is the worst part of our great sport and the number one excuse parents don't want their kids to try wrestling.   Encouraging kids, like XCard said above, to feel good at all practices and show up at competitions able to perform at their best possible level is the real solution. 

I hope that some day mat side weigh-ins or not having set weight classes and grouping by nearest weight ( there is a name for this, but it escapes me) are implemented at a youth level when the focus should be on learning and getting better instead of wins and losses.

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Do you want the coaches to sit there and watch each kid eat each bite of food? 

There is clearly a system in place. Is it a perfect system? No... there is no perfect system. 

The kids know the system. Some kids choose to pack on weight between matches or weigh ins. They then choose to “kill” themselves to get down to weight before the next Weigh-in. They work the system. 

Im sure that 99 percent of coaches follow the rules and guidelines as best as they can.

Lets stop blaming coaches. I would say if something “unhealthy” is going on the parents and mostly the kid (yes the kid) is to blame. You gotta figure that most high school varsity wrestlers are a year or two from being out on their own. They need to make better live choices.

Just curious Jenny... what did you see that was so out of line, that it prompted you to make a profile and post on this topic? Lots of times I see post like this when parents finds out that a better wrestler decides to go down to their kid’s weight class and takes the spot. 

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well I didn’t make this post because of my son.  I actually don’t have that worry at all.  My concern is when I go to these tournaments and see these kids dropping a ton of weight and are very dehydrated at the scale.  If coaches actually followed the rule you wouldn’t have that as much. I’ve heard of some kids dropping crazy amounts of weight. You said it yourself.  If a kid is jumping ten pounds or more between matches is that healthy and to your point they are a year or two or four away from being adults and on their own.  With that statement they are not old enough to know better.  If coaches and parents didn’t allow that they would t do it.  It’s like saying hey not allowed to drink you should know better but hey your a senior go ahead.   We would not allow it.  If a kid can not maintain his diet then he should move up.  I believe most kids cut weight because they been brain washed into believing they can not win at the weight that is healthy.  It’s a pattern that goes on in this sport.  Just because it’s something that has been part of the sport doesn’t mean it’s right. A healthy weight cut is a good thing.  Teaches kids  discipline  And sacrifice but  excessive weight cut should not be allowed and it still goes on with coaches knowledge and parents.  

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3 minutes ago, Jenny said:

well I didn’t make this post because of my son.  I actually don’t have that worry at all.  My concern is when I go to these tournaments and see these kids dropping a ton of weight and are very dehydrated at the scale.  If coaches actually followed the rule you wouldn’t have that as much. I’ve heard of some kids dropping crazy amounts of weight. You said it yourself.  If a kid is jumping ten pounds or more between matches is that healthy and to your point they are a year or two or four away from being adults and on their own.  With that statement they are not old enough to know better.  If coaches and parents didn’t allow that they would t do it.  It’s like saying hey not allowed to drink you should know better but hey your a senior go ahead.   We would not allow it.  If a kid can not maintain his diet then he should move up.  I believe most kids cut weight because they been brain washed into believing they can not win at the weight that is healthy.  It’s a pattern that goes on in this sport.  Just because it’s something that has been part of the sport doesn’t mean it’s right. A healthy weight cut is a good thing.  Teaches kids  discipline  And sacrifice but  excessive weight cut should not be allowed and it still goes on with coaches knowledge and parents.  

I get your points.  A few points I'd like to mention as a Coach:

1.  10 pounds is not the same on some kids as it is others.  A 116 pound kid losing 10 pounds to get to 106 is typically different than a 230 pound kid dropping to 220.

2.  Offseason cutting isn't necessary in my mind.

3.  Going from football to wrestling kids will often lose 10 pounds naturally.  That's not cutting weight.  What they do after that could be a weight cut depending on how much they lose.  

4.  Also the regulations in place are not without flaws.  Last year we had a kid who was missing quality weigh ins because he was too light.  He had to chug gatorades before weigh ins in order to weigh enough to have a quality weight in. (Yes, I'm aware of the 2% form and that doesn't solve all problems either)

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43 minutes ago, Jenny said:

You said it yourself.  If a kid is jumping ten pounds or more between matches is that healthy and to your point they are a year or two or four away from being adults and on their own.  With that statement they are not old enough to know better. 

Your not giving these kids enough credit. Most cutters are the kids that live wrestling. They absolutely know better. Ignorance is not an excuse for these kids.

Heck every teenager that I have met, knows it all!!!! Just ask them. 

But... really they know better. Parents do too. Most blame absolutely needs to go on the family as a whole. Same as every other bad choice that they make. And... all kids make some bad choices from time to time (my kids included). A poor diet while wrestling may be just one for these kids. 

It takes a village, but it starts at home! 

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28 minutes ago, nkraus said:

I get your points.  A few points I'd like to mention as a Coach:

1.  10 pounds is not the same on some kids as it is others.  A 116 pound kid losing 10 pounds to get to 106 is typically different than a 230 pound kid dropping to 220.

 

Thank you for saying that.  To have a meaningful discussion about the topic, it only makes sense to talk about it in terms of percentages rather than pounds.  Just like the two pound 'growth allowance' given to the kids after the first of the year.   I have no problem with the concept, but do think giving a #106 an almost 2% allowance while giving the heavyweight .6% allowance seems silly.    

I have watched my wrestler over the past two months lose nearly 7% body weight by doing absolutely nothing other than conditioning with the pre-season & club team 5 days a week, and cutting out the 4 x eggos lathered in thick peanut butter for breakfast.    

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On 10/30/2018 at 10:56 AM, Mattyb said:

Do you want the coaches to sit there and watch each kid eat each bite of food? 

There is clearly a system in place. Is it a perfect system? No... there is no perfect system. 

The kids know the system. Some kids choose to pack on weight between matches or weigh ins. They then choose to “kill” themselves to get down to weight before the next Weigh-in. They work the system. 

Im sure that 99 percent of coaches follow the rules and guidelines as best as they can.

Lets stop blaming coaches. I would say if something “unhealthy” is going on the parents and mostly the kid (yes the kid) is to blame. You gotta figure that most high school varsity wrestlers are a year or two from being out on their own. They need to make better live choices.

Just curious Jenny... what did you see that was so out of line, that it prompted you to make a profile and post on this topic? Lots of times I see post like this when parents finds out that a better wrestler decides to go down to their kid’s weight class and takes the spot. 

Do you guys weigh your kids every day? Just curious, if you see a kid working the system, do you feel it is the responsibility of the Coach to intervene?

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1 hour ago, XCard said:

Do you guys weigh your kids every day? Just curious, if you see a kid working the system, do you feel it is the responsibility of the Coach to intervene?

Isn't it suppose to be the coach's responsibility?

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On 10/30/2018 at 1:10 PM, Mattyb said:

Your not giving these kids enough credit. Most cutters are the kids that live wrestling. They absolutely know better. Ignorance is not an excuse for these kids.

Heck every teenager that I have met, knows it all!!!! Just ask them. 

But... really they know better. Parents do too. Most blame absolutely needs to go on the family as a whole. Same as every other bad choice that they make. And... all kids make some bad choices from time to time (my kids included). A poor diet while wrestling may be just one for these kids. 

It takes a village, but it starts at home! 

I am going to echo this.  Young men and women should not get left off of the hook for bad decisions until they are "out on their own".  This is the same "let kids be kids" mentality that has been crippling generations of young men and women.

Should we be raising our children to become children?  That sounds crazy.  But people are doing it everyday.  Then when there are 40 year olds who suck at life people wonder what happened?

While picking my 9 year old up from school yesterday we were a couple miles from the school and he realized that he forgot his math homework.  He started crying about having to sit at silent lunch or something.  He asked me to turn back and get it.  Guess what? I did that Monday.  First time was an accident.  Second time was a mistake.  Now he gets a consequence.  It's that simple.  Keep giving them consequences until they figure it out.

Sorry for the rant.  Just struck a nerve this morning. Carry on and happy Friday!

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2 hours ago, XCard said:

Do you guys weigh your kids every day? Just curious, if you see a kid working the system, do you feel it is the responsibility of the Coach to intervene?

I’m not a high school coach, but I ask my sons what they weigh everyday. 

But as far as coaches go... they should follow the rules. If they think a kid has a poor diet, or is not getting on weight properly. They should talk with the kid and his parents to attempt to educate them on proper nutrition for sure!!! 

Again... it starts at home.

Btw... Ratliff... your the man!

Edited by Mattyb

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On 10/27/2018 at 12:24 PM, Jenny said:

Why do some coaches allow their kids to cut so much weight.  I’ve had my kid on a few travel teams here and watched same kids cut so much weight.  I witness coaches helping kids on scales and kids in basically tears.   When will be a coach to say enough is enough.  I believe some parents are to blame but so is the coach for allowing it.  There is a rule in high school in which the coaches allow the kids to cheat to get around it.   Shameful 

Thank you for saying this. 

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While I was coaching I always had one rule. Your cut shouldn't be more than 5-7 pounds from your "natural weight." Many of my kids played football and ran cross country. I really did not put a lot of emphasis on a cutting weight. My wrestlers' chose the weight that wanted to go and they maintained it. 

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On 10/27/2018 at 1:24 PM, Jenny said:

 There is a rule in high school in which the coaches allow the kids to cheat to get around it.   Shameful 

Please enlighten me on this rule that allows Coaches to cheat?  As a coach I turn in my weigh-ins weekly to our ad who in turn sends those to the IHSAA.  Wrestlers have to pass hydration tests so that they can be on their weight loss plan which allows for only 1.5% weight loss a week.  Anything more than that isn't a qualifying weigh-in.  They need 6 of those, and a scratch weight at their weight class also.  

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